6 ms·

San Francisco to pay $212M to end reliance on 5.25-inch floppy disks

14 points by LordAtlas 2y ago

cranberryturkey 2y ago
my lord.
ggm 2y ago
I would like to see if I can sustain an argument that is is literally the definition of "technical debt" in it's purest form: The cost in inflation adjusted dollars to do this, probably exceeds the incremental upgrade cost had it been done across the lifetime of the system. Does anyone have the chops to do the thought experiment? It means working on the labour and input costs for the time period, assuming a rollout and semi continuous upgrade through different ages of technology, as opposed to paying out a diamond bracelet worth of cost at the end to jump over technology intervening moments.
knowitnone 2y ago
This is BS. I'm not an engineer but I'm sure one can create an emulation layer, connected to a SSD, put whatever data/software on it, and have this work. It certainly wouldn't cost $212M. I bet a college student could do this. Oh, look https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floppy_disk_hardware_emulator https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floppy_disk_hardware_emulator, it's already been built. This smells of corruption.
- akira2501 2y ago
  The goal and costs are to replace the entire control system not find a means of replacing a single legacy component within it.
- atombender 2y ago
  As the article points out, $212m will upgrade the entire train control system to a modern one (they admit to be "five generations" behind). Phasing out floppy disks is a consequence of this. They're cereinlynnot paying someone this much to just replace the floppy disk system but nothing else; that would be insane. The headline is a little flippant, and they don't mean it literally. Many people on HN these days seem to reply without reading the article headline first...
  - shiroiushi 2y ago
    >Many people on HN these days seem to reply without reading the article headline first... You sound like you're new to the internet.
- theamk 2y ago
  They are upgrading the whole system, the floppy is just easiest-to-explain part. > The new control system is supposed to be five generations ahead of what Muni is using now, [...] challenges in maintaining expertise in 1990s programming languages have further encouraged the SFMTA to seek upgrades.
- atonse 2y ago
  Also it is $212 for 20-25 years of support. Not just some one time cost.
johann8384 2y ago
In 1998 those disks were already outdated technology.
psyclobe 2y ago
I guarantee you the dos setup will be sorely missed
gault8121 2y ago
The headline here is manipulative. > The $212 million contract includes support services from Hitachi for "20 to 25 years," The $212m is a 20-year service contract for the new technology and the costs of installing it, not a one-time cost to remove the old floppy disks.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
slipperybeluga 2y ago
[dead]

14 points by LordAtlas 2y ago

my lord.

ggm 2y ago

I would like to see if I can sustain an argument that is is literally the definition of "technical debt" in it's purest form: The cost in inflation adjusted dollars to do this, probably exceeds the incremental upgrade cost had it been done across the lifetime of the system. Does anyone have the chops to do the thought experiment? It means working on the labour and input costs for the time period, assuming a rollout and semi continuous upgrade through different ages of technology, as opposed to paying out a diamond bracelet worth of cost at the end to jump over technology intervening moments.

knowitnone 2y ago

This is BS. I'm not an engineer but I'm sure one can create an emulation layer, connected to a SSD, put whatever data/software on it, and have this work. It certainly wouldn't cost $212M. I bet a college student could do this. Oh, look https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floppy_disk_hardware_emulator https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floppy_disk_hardware_emulator, it's already been built. This smells of corruption.

akira2501 2y ago
The goal and costs are to replace the entire control system not find a means of replacing a single legacy component within it.
atombender 2y ago
As the article points out, $212m will upgrade the entire train control system to a modern one (they admit to be "five generations" behind). Phasing out floppy disks is a consequence of this. They're cereinlynnot paying someone this much to just replace the floppy disk system but nothing else; that would be insane. The headline is a little flippant, and they don't mean it literally. Many people on HN these days seem to reply without reading the article headline first...
- shiroiushi 2y ago
  >Many people on HN these days seem to reply without reading the article headline first... You sound like you're new to the internet.
theamk 2y ago
They are upgrading the whole system, the floppy is just easiest-to-explain part. > The new control system is supposed to be five generations ahead of what Muni is using now, [...] challenges in maintaining expertise in 1990s programming languages have further encouraged the SFMTA to seek upgrades.
atonse 2y ago
Also it is $212 for 20-25 years of support. Not just some one time cost.

johann8384 2y ago

In 1998 those disks were already outdated technology.

psyclobe 2y ago

I guarantee you the dos setup will be sorely missed

gault8121 2y ago

The headline here is manipulative. > The $212 million contract includes support services from Hitachi for "20 to 25 years," The $212m is a 20-year service contract for the new technology and the costs of installing it, not a one-time cost to remove the old floppy disks.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

slipperybeluga 2y ago

[dead]