5 ms·

Subtitle: "The leader of the long-running study said that the drugs did not improve mental health in children with gender distress and that the finding might be

Subtitle: "The leader of the long-running study said that the drugs did not improve mental health in children with gender distress and that the finding might be weaponized by opponents of the care." Here "weaponize" means use evidence to reach policy conclusions the author does not like.

Spivak 2y ago
No it doesn't, it means cited in a misleading manner to make marketing campaigns and drive policy counter to the actual take-aways of the study. Go look up the "trans women have a male-pattern of violence" study as a perfect example of weaponizing scientific results to the point where the author had to come out to correct folks that that isn't at all what the study said. If you want gross misinterpretation of scientific results in a different field go look up the "99% of people don't become addicted to oxy" study whose weaponization for policy outcomes is credited for starting the opioid crisis. Your priors for "how puberty blockers affect mental health outcomes" should be glued to "doesn't make it better (how could it), doesn't make it worse" and that's what they're claiming the study showed.
- IIlIIllIIl 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - slater 2y ago
    If you have to keep making new accounts to spread your transphobia, at what point do you reconsider your positions?
    - IIlIIllIIl 2y ago
      [flagged]
      - slater 2y ago
        Nice dodge.
  - Spivak 2y ago
    > their concept of women typically consists of a collection of sexist stereotypes Perhaps despite my better judgment, I'm willing to give this one good-faith reply. Your observation is correct, you're identifying something real but you have the explanation wrong. There is another group of women who also fit this description— children. Girls and teenagers also fall into a lot of sexist stereotypes. I certainly did when I was little playing house, dressing up as a princess. I wore way too much makeup when I was first allowed to. But that process is how we grow, and it's okay because we're kids and everyone else is going through it too. Trans women, whether they want to or not, go through the same phases except as adults. Only worse because after so long of denying themselves any kind of femininity they tend to overdo it a bit. And because newly out trans women are the most visible it becomes all people really know. And look, it's super cringe I agree with you, but they're learning how to be adult women just like we did, and they grow out of it and into their own just like we did.
    - blueflow 2y ago
      This was a good answer. I found the thinking lines of some of my MtF peers really apalling.
- mapt 2y ago
  In science, you often find what you look for. "Are Jews more predisposed to financial fraud than non-Jews?" Do you want the answer to that question? How confident are you that you want it? What do you think are the odds that launching that study will benefit the world? What statistical test would you prefer, and what is the balance between type 1 and type 2 error rates? What sort of group is likely to want to fund that study? If you perform 30 of these studies and find that for P>0.05, 3 of them do show a statistically significant result, how do you think that is going to impact society? Do you think it will mean the same thing to scientists as to non-scientists? Acknowledging that society incorporates a longstanding war of dueling narratives, and that scientific studies are a part of that, becomes an unfortunate necessity. I have watched geeky friends go from "Science must prevail over politics" to alt-right eugenicists, and I have watched alt-right eugenicists weaponize "Science must prevail over politics" for the sake of promoting what looks more than a little bit like ethnic cleansing. It is often easier for a group to make obviously poor decisions due to internal conflict, than for an individual who can consolidate a worldview. As a collective group, we have gotten a lot dumber than we were in recent memory.

Spivak 2y ago

No it doesn't, it means cited in a misleading manner to make marketing campaigns and drive policy counter to the actual take-aways of the study. Go look up the "trans women have a male-pattern of violence" study as a perfect example of weaponizing scientific results to the point where the author had to come out to correct folks that that isn't at all what the study said. If you want gross misinterpretation of scientific results in a different field go look up the "99% of people don't become addicted to oxy" study whose weaponization for policy outcomes is credited for starting the opioid crisis. Your priors for "how puberty blockers affect mental health outcomes" should be glued to "doesn't make it better (how could it), doesn't make it worse" and that's what they're claiming the study showed.

IIlIIllIIl 2y ago
[flagged]
- slater 2y ago
  If you have to keep making new accounts to spread your transphobia, at what point do you reconsider your positions?
  - IIlIIllIIl 2y ago
    [flagged]
    - slater 2y ago
      Nice dodge.
- Spivak 2y ago
  > their concept of women typically consists of a collection of sexist stereotypes Perhaps despite my better judgment, I'm willing to give this one good-faith reply. Your observation is correct, you're identifying something real but you have the explanation wrong. There is another group of women who also fit this description— children. Girls and teenagers also fall into a lot of sexist stereotypes. I certainly did when I was little playing house, dressing up as a princess. I wore way too much makeup when I was first allowed to. But that process is how we grow, and it's okay because we're kids and everyone else is going through it too. Trans women, whether they want to or not, go through the same phases except as adults. Only worse because after so long of denying themselves any kind of femininity they tend to overdo it a bit. And because newly out trans women are the most visible it becomes all people really know. And look, it's super cringe I agree with you, but they're learning how to be adult women just like we did, and they grow out of it and into their own just like we did.
  - blueflow 2y ago
    This was a good answer. I found the thinking lines of some of my MtF peers really apalling.
mapt 2y ago
In science, you often find what you look for. "Are Jews more predisposed to financial fraud than non-Jews?" Do you want the answer to that question? How confident are you that you want it? What do you think are the odds that launching that study will benefit the world? What statistical test would you prefer, and what is the balance between type 1 and type 2 error rates? What sort of group is likely to want to fund that study? If you perform 30 of these studies and find that for P>0.05, 3 of them do show a statistically significant result, how do you think that is going to impact society? Do you think it will mean the same thing to scientists as to non-scientists? Acknowledging that society incorporates a longstanding war of dueling narratives, and that scientific studies are a part of that, becomes an unfortunate necessity. I have watched geeky friends go from "Science must prevail over politics" to alt-right eugenicists, and I have watched alt-right eugenicists weaponize "Science must prevail over politics" for the sake of promoting what looks more than a little bit like ethnic cleansing. It is often easier for a group to make obviously poor decisions due to internal conflict, than for an individual who can consolidate a worldview. As a collective group, we have gotten a lot dumber than we were in recent memory.