4 ms·

>Those who do not want you to have this type of agency spend a lot of money to disparage it. You just contradicted yourself. Do we have free and fair elections

>Those who do not want you to have this type of agency spend a lot of money to disparage it. You just contradicted yourself. Do we have free and fair elections, or do we have a system whereby the wealthy have disproportionate influence? It's one or the other.

AdieuToLogic 2y ago
>> Those who do not want you to have this type of agency spend a lot of money to disparage it. > You just contradicted yourself. I did not. Please re-read what I wrote dispassionately. > Do we have free and fair elections, or do we have a system whereby the wealthy have disproportionate influence? It's one or the other. This is a false dichotomy[0]. The US has had free and fair elections for at least 40 years. I wish I could confidently state a longer period. Some might include the 70's but few would include much of the 60's. What the wealthy do in attempt to convince people they do not have agency, or that their involvement in representative government does not matter, is orthogonal to having it. I humbly recommend contemplating the difference. HTH 0 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_dilemma https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_dilemma
- farts_mckensy 2y ago
  You're begging the question with respect to what is "free" and "fair." The US is neither by any reasonable definition of these words. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Begging_the_question https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Begging_the_question See, I can do that too. In large part, people do not have that kind of agency, and telling them they do is deceptive liberal bullshit.
  - AdieuToLogic 2y ago
    > You're begging the question with respect to what is "free" and "fair." Free: there are no longer Jim Crow laws[0], such as voting poll taxes[1]. Fair: each eligible voter whom casts a vote in US elections has it included in the vote tally (see below). > In large part, people do not have that kind of agency, and telling them they do is deceptive liberal bullshit. Every eligible voter has the ability to cast their vote in one form or another. In extenuating circumstances, some votes will not be included. I am neither a constitutional nor civil rights lawyer, so will not attempt to clarify those situations beyond acknowledging they exist. I will not further engage in this thread as my interpretation of your replies thus far is they are not based in intellectually honest discourse. 0 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Crow_laws https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Crow_laws 1 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poll_tax https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poll_tax
    - farts_mckensy 2y ago
      Insufficient definition.

AdieuToLogic 2y ago

>> Those who do not want you to have this type of agency spend a lot of money to disparage it. > You just contradicted yourself. I did not. Please re-read what I wrote dispassionately. > Do we have free and fair elections, or do we have a system whereby the wealthy have disproportionate influence? It's one or the other. This is a false dichotomy[0]. The US has had free and fair elections for at least 40 years. I wish I could confidently state a longer period. Some might include the 70's but few would include much of the 60's. What the wealthy do in attempt to convince people they do not have agency, or that their involvement in representative government does not matter, is orthogonal to having it. I humbly recommend contemplating the difference. HTH 0 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_dilemma https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_dilemma

farts_mckensy 2y ago
You're begging the question with respect to what is "free" and "fair." The US is neither by any reasonable definition of these words. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Begging_the_question https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Begging_the_question See, I can do that too. In large part, people do not have that kind of agency, and telling them they do is deceptive liberal bullshit.
- AdieuToLogic 2y ago
  > You're begging the question with respect to what is "free" and "fair." Free: there are no longer Jim Crow laws[0], such as voting poll taxes[1]. Fair: each eligible voter whom casts a vote in US elections has it included in the vote tally (see below). > In large part, people do not have that kind of agency, and telling them they do is deceptive liberal bullshit. Every eligible voter has the ability to cast their vote in one form or another. In extenuating circumstances, some votes will not be included. I am neither a constitutional nor civil rights lawyer, so will not attempt to clarify those situations beyond acknowledging they exist. I will not further engage in this thread as my interpretation of your replies thus far is they are not based in intellectually honest discourse. 0 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Crow_laws https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Crow_laws 1 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poll_tax https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poll_tax
  - farts_mckensy 2y ago
    Insufficient definition.