5 ms·

What's the difference between this and just visit twice on a tourist visa?

gentile 2y ago
It's mentioned in the article, the US embassy advises against unauthorized employment. https://jp.usembassy.gov/services/visas-japan-u-s-citizens/ https://jp.usembassy.gov/services/visas-japan-u-s-citizens/
- jalapenos 2y ago
  It also avoids differentiating on two very different scenarios: coming to Japan without a work visa to work illegally for a local company, and doing work for an employer or client not in Japan while being in Japan. On paper, all laws are strict. In practice, some of them, and some interpretations of them, are considered a higher priority than others (which can range to straight up ignoring them or even violating them themselves). The point I'm making is I don't get why they've bothered with such a pointless visa, and it sounds like some PR stunt. If it extended to a year or was a residence permit then it'd be an actual valuable visa worth the effort. The only thing I can think of is maybe they hoped it'd be used by digital nomads to come work for local companies for 6 months, but that doesn't sound likely. PR gimmick or "we're doing things" purpose more likely.
laurieg 2y ago
Is you are on a tourist visa then you cannot work. Actively working as a nomad ok a tourist visa waiver is breaking the law. Of course, nomads often did come and with in this status. They would exist in a grey area, arguing their with was more incidental in nature and bit the reason to be in Japan (just like replying to a few with emails while in holiday). The nomad visa is essentially formalizing this grey area. As other commentors have mentioned, it's not a particularly useful status as you don't get a residence card and you can enroll in national health insurance too. You'll also find it harder to find apartments to rent too
- jalapenos 2y ago
  Right so it's a compliance thing. Rather than just visiting on a tourist visa and relying on the fact that no immigration officer is going to come bust in your hotel door and yell "hey are you doing work on that laptop!", you go through a bunch of tedious bureaucratic hoops to get the assurance that they definitely for certain won't come inspect what you're doing on your laptop.
  - djtango 2y ago
    People are being too individualistic here - Japan or any other country is never going to go after individuals who happen to work for remote companies or freelance while they globe trot working on tourist visas. But when companies like Shopify go fully remote, if they suddenly have a lot of employees who are frequenting Japan, they are painting a giant target on their back and exposing themselves to legal risk. A company is never going to expose themselves to this kind of legal risk so HR will very quickly (and understandably) clamp down on this. This is why even the most progressive "work from anywhere" policies tend to have fine print that amounts to "your country of residence and any home countries you can legally work in". This is then why we often see "remote" coming with all kinds of conditions like US remote or EU remote etc because the reality of legal compliance for HR is a huge headache. These nomad visas are a baby step in the right direction towards unburdening companies from this liability.
    - notpushkin 2y ago
      > This is then why we often see "remote" coming with all kinds of conditions like US remote or EU remote etc because the reality of legal compliance for HR is a huge headache. Could they just hire those individuals as contractors instead? It should be up to the contractor to ensure compliance then. (IANAL)
      - djtango 2y ago
        Some do but from observation lawyers/HR find reasons to resist this. The most likely explanation is there could be risk but there is zero risk associated with saying no so legal and HR say no to this arrangement because they don't want more work and legal and HR are cost centres so they can't magically pull budget out of thin air to appease some annoying digital nomads. A company is also not going to let their entire workforce of full time employees transition to contractors overnight either, which would be a giant headache for both HR and senior management. For example VCs prefer "headcount" over contractors for a number of reasons so there is pressure from the top to incentivise full time employees. Large multinationals have a lot of considerations around taxation (its always taxes...) These are some of the practicalities I've uncovered that provide inertia towards remote working
seoulmetro 2y ago
Working on tourist visas is illegal... ? What's the difference between buying an iPhone and taking one from the Apple store? You get an iPhone at the end of both.

It's mentioned in the article, the US embassy advises against unauthorized employment. https://jp.usembassy.gov/services/visas-japan-u-s-citizens/ https://jp.usembassy.gov/services/visas-japan-u-s-citizens/

jalapenos 2y ago
It also avoids differentiating on two very different scenarios: coming to Japan without a work visa to work illegally for a local company, and doing work for an employer or client not in Japan while being in Japan. On paper, all laws are strict. In practice, some of them, and some interpretations of them, are considered a higher priority than others (which can range to straight up ignoring them or even violating them themselves). The point I'm making is I don't get why they've bothered with such a pointless visa, and it sounds like some PR stunt. If it extended to a year or was a residence permit then it'd be an actual valuable visa worth the effort. The only thing I can think of is maybe they hoped it'd be used by digital nomads to come work for local companies for 6 months, but that doesn't sound likely. PR gimmick or "we're doing things" purpose more likely.

laurieg 2y ago

Is you are on a tourist visa then you cannot work. Actively working as a nomad ok a tourist visa waiver is breaking the law. Of course, nomads often did come and with in this status. They would exist in a grey area, arguing their with was more incidental in nature and bit the reason to be in Japan (just like replying to a few with emails while in holiday). The nomad visa is essentially formalizing this grey area. As other commentors have mentioned, it's not a particularly useful status as you don't get a residence card and you can enroll in national health insurance too. You'll also find it harder to find apartments to rent too

jalapenos 2y ago
Right so it's a compliance thing. Rather than just visiting on a tourist visa and relying on the fact that no immigration officer is going to come bust in your hotel door and yell "hey are you doing work on that laptop!", you go through a bunch of tedious bureaucratic hoops to get the assurance that they definitely for certain won't come inspect what you're doing on your laptop.
- djtango 2y ago
  People are being too individualistic here - Japan or any other country is never going to go after individuals who happen to work for remote companies or freelance while they globe trot working on tourist visas. But when companies like Shopify go fully remote, if they suddenly have a lot of employees who are frequenting Japan, they are painting a giant target on their back and exposing themselves to legal risk. A company is never going to expose themselves to this kind of legal risk so HR will very quickly (and understandably) clamp down on this. This is why even the most progressive "work from anywhere" policies tend to have fine print that amounts to "your country of residence and any home countries you can legally work in". This is then why we often see "remote" coming with all kinds of conditions like US remote or EU remote etc because the reality of legal compliance for HR is a huge headache. These nomad visas are a baby step in the right direction towards unburdening companies from this liability.
  - notpushkin 2y ago
    > This is then why we often see "remote" coming with all kinds of conditions like US remote or EU remote etc because the reality of legal compliance for HR is a huge headache. Could they just hire those individuals as contractors instead? It should be up to the contractor to ensure compliance then. (IANAL)
    - djtango 2y ago
      Some do but from observation lawyers/HR find reasons to resist this. The most likely explanation is there could be risk but there is zero risk associated with saying no so legal and HR say no to this arrangement because they don't want more work and legal and HR are cost centres so they can't magically pull budget out of thin air to appease some annoying digital nomads. A company is also not going to let their entire workforce of full time employees transition to contractors overnight either, which would be a giant headache for both HR and senior management. For example VCs prefer "headcount" over contractors for a number of reasons so there is pressure from the top to incentivise full time employees. Large multinationals have a lot of considerations around taxation (its always taxes...) These are some of the practicalities I've uncovered that provide inertia towards remote working

seoulmetro 2y ago

Working on tourist visas is illegal... ? What's the difference between buying an iPhone and taking one from the Apple store? You get an iPhone at the end of both.