4 ms·

I’m curious if anyone has the solutions to these.

jakelazaroff 2y ago
The point is that the questions are phrased ambiguously such that a reviewer can credibly claim that a "correct" solution is wrong. Take question 20: > Spell backwards, forwards Is "backwards" the object, with "forwards" describing how to spell it — as in, "Spell the word 'backwards', forwards"? Or is it being used as an adverb, telling you how to spell the word "forwards" — as in, "Spell backwards the word 'forwards'"?
- kyleee 2y ago
  Kind of like modern App Store review. Google must have employed some history majors
- kelnos 2y ago
  Wow, I hadn't even thought of that for that question. Disgustingly genius. The person administering the test can simply tell the person who took the test the opposite interpretation of however they answered, and that's it for their ability to vote.
  - malfist 2y ago
    What's even worse about this is this test wasn't given to everyone who wanted to vote, only those who gained their right to vote after the civil war. White people were "grandfathered" in, literally.
  - jakelazaroff 2y ago
    It reminds me of the Simpsons episode with the spelling bee: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Sn5wyBDxn4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Sn5wyBDxn4 > "Your word is 'weather'." > "Which one? Can you use it in a sentence?" > "Certainly! 'I don't know whether the weather will improve.'" (obviously the joke doesn't work as well written out)
    - KingMob 2y ago
      "Me fail English? That's unpossible!"
    - usea 2y ago
      Also the Simpsons scene with the Smokey Bear statue: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-q-3fPYw_Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-q-3fPYw_Y > "Only who can prevent forest fires?" [You] [Me] > Bart selects "You". > "You pressed 'You', referring to me. That is incorrect. The correct answer is 'You'!"
  - tharkun__ 2y ago
    A prime example of why "unionization" is good: You only need two people to do this differently and be told the opposite by the administrator (preferably the same one but not necessarily) and you've proved that it's BS. That's all theory of course and in practice I bet people did talk about this afterwards and figured out it's BS and it didn't help either way. But it's easy to "find out" (and then try to do something about it) if you stick together. But if nobody sticks together on it and tries to do better for themselves by themselves, everyone does worse for themselves in the end.
    - KingMob 2y ago
      > But it's easy to "find out" (and then try to do something about it) if you stick together. You're kind of describing the civil rights movement.
      - BartjeD 2y ago
        And forgetting the KKK
  - jeffbee 2y ago
    Great, and now that you realize this you also realize why all these other right-wing schemes to suppress the vote are also unconstitutional. If you put some random jerk in a position to deny someone the right to vote based on ID card or signature rules, you have created a system for discriminatory disenfranchisement.
    - kelnos 2y ago
      I think I've already got a pretty good handle on the modern-day disenfranchisement techniques, thank you.
- lostmsu 2y ago
  With the comma the second interpretation seems inapplicable to me.
  - jakelazaroff 2y ago
    It’s awkward, sure, but other questions use commas in that way. Question 19, immediately prior: > Draw in the space below, a square with a triangle in it, and within that same triangle draw a circle with a black dot in it. In that case, “a square with a triangle in it” is fairly unambiguously the object, which would make the sentence construction “[verb] [adverb], [object]” — exactly the same as the second interpretation of “Spell backwards, forwards”.
  - onionisafruit 2y ago
    It seems inapplicable to you, but it will probably seem very applicable to the test administrator who doesn’t want people like you voting.
- stared 2y ago
  Another possible solution is "backwards, forwards". Without quotation marks, this task is inherently ambiguous.
- nomilk 2y ago
  Reminds of the Spelling Bee scene in the Simpsons: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWyYTJKOtDU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWyYTJKOtDU
- Cthulhu_ 2y ago
  And by "spell", do they mean just rewrite the word(s), write the word(s) with a s p a c e between each letter, or go to the examiner and spell it verbally?
phildenhoff 2y ago
A solution is available here: https://mrsjcoonan.weebly.com/uploads/2/3/6/2/23625108/literacytestkey.pdf https://mrsjcoonan.weebly.com/uploads/2/3/6/2/23625108/liter... But, my understanding is that the test is purposefully opaque, so that any answer can be considered “wrong”, at the discretion of whoever’s running the test.
- jampekka 2y ago
  It doesn't have answers for the last two and I think the number 16 is wrong (the circle is encircling the right corner). Also 25 doesn't fit on the line. Would be interested to see what share of population would get all of those correct (if it's even possible). I for one wouldn't. Sadistic stuff.
- csallen 2y ago
  Their answer to #14 is wrong. They crossed out "m" and should've crossed out "l".
- kelnos 2y ago
  Their answer to #14 is wrong. The first part ("draw a line under the first letter after 'h'") is done correctly, with a line under "i", but the second part ("draw a line through the second letter after "j") is wrong. They should have drawn the line through "l", but they drew it through "m". At first I thought "oh, they're just using a slightly different, but perhaps reasonable, meaning of "second letter after". But if that's the case, then they used a different meaning of "first letter after" for the first part. #16 is also wrong: it calls for a black circle overlapping the left corner of a triangle, but they drew it overlapping the right corner. And for #25, they wrote it out, but all of it did not fit on the line, and did not write the terminating ":" in the text, so that's technically incorrect too. (And it's debatable whether or not they were supposed to write out the text that's inside the triangle, or the "gotcha" of writing out the text in the question.) I love that they gave up for the last two questions. I imagine most people who were forced to take that test did so too, assuming they even made it that far in the allotted time.
  - mrbuttons454 2y ago
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
tptacek 2y ago
What's the right answer to "Write down on the line provided, what you read in the triangle below"? The triangle contains "Paris in the spring".
- tilt_error 2y ago
  Actually: Paris in the the spring 'the' comes twice
  - jampekka 2y ago
    That's diabolical. But it's not certain if even that's correct. Depends on how the comma should be interpreted.
    - kelnos 2y ago
      And the person who answered wrote the last two words such that they're not "on the line provided", so regardless of which phrase they're supposed to write, they got the question wrong. Assuming they did write the correct thing, and assuming the test administrator would be unusually generous about the placement of the words, they still got it wrong: they left off the colon at the end.
  - Cthulhu_ 2y ago
    That's one trick part of the the question (a common trick, a lot of people don't read two "the"s in a row), but the other answer could be "what you read in the triangle below" as that's what the question states. The other trick is that the line could be too short depending on your handwriting, in theory disqualifying the tested person regardless of what they write down.
valval 2y ago
It’s not a real test.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

The point is that the questions are phrased ambiguously such that a reviewer can credibly claim that a "correct" solution is wrong. Take question 20: > Spell backwards, forwards Is "backwards" the object, with "forwards" describing how to spell it — as in, "Spell the word 'backwards', forwards"? Or is it being used as an adverb, telling you how to spell the word "forwards" — as in, "Spell backwards the word 'forwards'"?

kyleee 2y ago
Kind of like modern App Store review. Google must have employed some history majors
kelnos 2y ago
Wow, I hadn't even thought of that for that question. Disgustingly genius. The person administering the test can simply tell the person who took the test the opposite interpretation of however they answered, and that's it for their ability to vote.
- malfist 2y ago
  What's even worse about this is this test wasn't given to everyone who wanted to vote, only those who gained their right to vote after the civil war. White people were "grandfathered" in, literally.
- jakelazaroff 2y ago
  It reminds me of the Simpsons episode with the spelling bee: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Sn5wyBDxn4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Sn5wyBDxn4 > "Your word is 'weather'." > "Which one? Can you use it in a sentence?" > "Certainly! 'I don't know whether the weather will improve.'" (obviously the joke doesn't work as well written out)
  - KingMob 2y ago
    "Me fail English? That's unpossible!"
  - usea 2y ago
    Also the Simpsons scene with the Smokey Bear statue: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-q-3fPYw_Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-q-3fPYw_Y > "Only who can prevent forest fires?" [You] [Me] > Bart selects "You". > "You pressed 'You', referring to me. That is incorrect. The correct answer is 'You'!"
- tharkun__ 2y ago
  A prime example of why "unionization" is good: You only need two people to do this differently and be told the opposite by the administrator (preferably the same one but not necessarily) and you've proved that it's BS. That's all theory of course and in practice I bet people did talk about this afterwards and figured out it's BS and it didn't help either way. But it's easy to "find out" (and then try to do something about it) if you stick together. But if nobody sticks together on it and tries to do better for themselves by themselves, everyone does worse for themselves in the end.
  - KingMob 2y ago
    > But it's easy to "find out" (and then try to do something about it) if you stick together. You're kind of describing the civil rights movement.
    - BartjeD 2y ago
      And forgetting the KKK
- jeffbee 2y ago
  Great, and now that you realize this you also realize why all these other right-wing schemes to suppress the vote are also unconstitutional. If you put some random jerk in a position to deny someone the right to vote based on ID card or signature rules, you have created a system for discriminatory disenfranchisement.
  - kelnos 2y ago
    I think I've already got a pretty good handle on the modern-day disenfranchisement techniques, thank you.
lostmsu 2y ago
With the comma the second interpretation seems inapplicable to me.
- jakelazaroff 2y ago
  It’s awkward, sure, but other questions use commas in that way. Question 19, immediately prior: > Draw in the space below, a square with a triangle in it, and within that same triangle draw a circle with a black dot in it. In that case, “a square with a triangle in it” is fairly unambiguously the object, which would make the sentence construction “[verb] [adverb], [object]” — exactly the same as the second interpretation of “Spell backwards, forwards”.
- onionisafruit 2y ago
  It seems inapplicable to you, but it will probably seem very applicable to the test administrator who doesn’t want people like you voting.
stared 2y ago
Another possible solution is "backwards, forwards". Without quotation marks, this task is inherently ambiguous.
nomilk 2y ago
Reminds of the Spelling Bee scene in the Simpsons: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWyYTJKOtDU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWyYTJKOtDU
Cthulhu_ 2y ago
And by "spell", do they mean just rewrite the word(s), write the word(s) with a s p a c e between each letter, or go to the examiner and spell it verbally?

phildenhoff 2y ago

A solution is available here: https://mrsjcoonan.weebly.com/uploads/2/3/6/2/23625108/literacytestkey.pdf https://mrsjcoonan.weebly.com/uploads/2/3/6/2/23625108/liter... But, my understanding is that the test is purposefully opaque, so that any answer can be considered “wrong”, at the discretion of whoever’s running the test.

jampekka 2y ago
It doesn't have answers for the last two and I think the number 16 is wrong (the circle is encircling the right corner). Also 25 doesn't fit on the line. Would be interested to see what share of population would get all of those correct (if it's even possible). I for one wouldn't. Sadistic stuff.
csallen 2y ago
Their answer to #14 is wrong. They crossed out "m" and should've crossed out "l".
kelnos 2y ago
Their answer to #14 is wrong. The first part ("draw a line under the first letter after 'h'") is done correctly, with a line under "i", but the second part ("draw a line through the second letter after "j") is wrong. They should have drawn the line through "l", but they drew it through "m". At first I thought "oh, they're just using a slightly different, but perhaps reasonable, meaning of "second letter after". But if that's the case, then they used a different meaning of "first letter after" for the first part. #16 is also wrong: it calls for a black circle overlapping the left corner of a triangle, but they drew it overlapping the right corner. And for #25, they wrote it out, but all of it did not fit on the line, and did not write the terminating ":" in the text, so that's technically incorrect too. (And it's debatable whether or not they were supposed to write out the text that's inside the triangle, or the "gotcha" of writing out the text in the question.) I love that they gave up for the last two questions. I imagine most people who were forced to take that test did so too, assuming they even made it that far in the allotted time.
- mrbuttons454 2y ago

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

tptacek 2y ago

What's the right answer to "Write down on the line provided, what you read in the triangle below"? The triangle contains "Paris in the spring".

tilt_error 2y ago
Actually: Paris in the the spring 'the' comes twice
- jampekka 2y ago
  That's diabolical. But it's not certain if even that's correct. Depends on how the comma should be interpreted.
  - kelnos 2y ago
    And the person who answered wrote the last two words such that they're not "on the line provided", so regardless of which phrase they're supposed to write, they got the question wrong. Assuming they did write the correct thing, and assuming the test administrator would be unusually generous about the placement of the words, they still got it wrong: they left off the colon at the end.
- Cthulhu_ 2y ago
  That's one trick part of the the question (a common trick, a lot of people don't read two "the"s in a row), but the other answer could be "what you read in the triangle below" as that's what the question states. The other trick is that the line could be too short depending on your handwriting, in theory disqualifying the tested person regardless of what they write down.

valval 2y ago

It’s not a real test.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]