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It’s not just a U.K. thing. Many European countries have something similar, although it might be called something else. It’s a form of tax that pays for public

It’s not just a U.K. thing. Many European countries have something similar, although it might be called something else. It’s a form of tax that pays for public service broadcasting, including radio stations. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Television_licence# https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Television_licence#

busterarm 2y ago
Yes, but the UK is the only country with a license ridiculous enough to offer you a 50% discount _if you're blind_.
- gs17 2y ago
  It sounds weirder than that to me: > colour TV: £169.50 per year; monochrome TV: £57.00 per year; blind people: 50% discount People who can't see their color TV at all pay more than people who can but have an old black-and-white one?
  - madeofpalk 2y ago
    Do the discounts stack? If you’re blind should you just buy a monochrome tv and pay £28?
    - account42 2y ago
      On the other hand you might end up paying quite a bit more for a monochrome tv than for the cheapest color tv you can find.
      - chihuahua 2y ago
        Maybe you can just turn down the color setting to 0, and break off the knob.
  - Ellipsis753 2y ago
    Weirder still, the discounts stack! So blind people can benefit from buying a black-and-white TV for an additional discount. I've given this a lot of thought in the past. The best I could come up with is that "legally blind" could still allow for someone with _very poor_ (colour) vision...
  - dom96 2y ago
    this is making me want to buy a black and white TV (or grab a monitor and set it to always show in black and white) just so I can buy the monochrome TV license for giggles
  - soneil 2y ago
    People who can’t see their colour TV pay more than people who can’t see their B&W TV. Oh to be a a fly on the wall when the inspector has to explain the difference to a blind person. I think it made a lot more sense in the past. The license is set up so it’s a consumption based tax rather than taxing everyone. So only people with TVs paid TV tax. If colour increased the costs, only people consuming colour paid those increases. I imagine it made much more sense before consumption was ubiquitous
    - rescbr 2y ago
      A novelty product opportunity: plug together a Raspberry Pi, an USB TV tuner and a BW LCD display to pay a smaller TV licence.
      - chihuahua 2y ago
        When I lived in Britain in 1989-1992, at the time the rule was that battery-powered TVs were exempt from the license fees. I had a tiny TV that could be powered by 6 AA batteries. The screen size was approximately 3 inches / 7.5cm. I don't know if the rules have changed since then, but if they are the same, then a battery-powered laptop would also be exempt (even in color.)
  - TheRealPomax 2y ago
    That's... not what https://www.gov.uk/find-licences/tv-licence https://www.gov.uk/find-licences/tv-licence says at all. If you're blind, you almost certainly qualify for a free license.
    - giobox 2y ago
      No, it really does say this. There is expressly no free TV licence for being blind, instead a 50% discount. https://www.gov.uk/free-discount-tv-licence https://www.gov.uk/free-discount-tv-licence https://www.tvlicensing.co.uk/check-if-you-need-one/for-your-home/blindseverely-sight-impaired-aud5?WT.ac=reducedfee_blind https://www.tvlicensing.co.uk/check-if-you-need-one/for-your...
  - Xophmeister 2y ago
    Since the switch to digital, presumably there’s no longer and signal for B&W TVs.
    - manarth 2y ago
      There has rarely (if ever) been a separate broadcast signal for B&W vs colour. Broadcasts began in B&W, over time upgraded to colour, but there wasn't a need to broadcast Channel <whatever> in B&W and broadcast the same channel in colour on a different frequency. One single broadcast signal, and different capabilities of receivers.
      - Xophmeister 2y ago
        But surely B&W TVs only exist with analog tuners?
        manarth 2y ago
        Oh, I misunderstood the point you were making. I guess you _could_ have a modern digital receiver with SCART-out (if such a thing exists) to a B&W TV. This BBC article (2018) claims 7,000 people watching TV with a B&W licence – whether they were actually watching it in B&W is not known :-D https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46125741 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46125741
- labster 2y ago
  That makes sense, a blind man only uses half of the signal.
- azornathogron 2y ago
  Although, yes, this sounds absurd, it's worth noting that the TV licence pays for the BBC and the BBC has extensive radio (and web) offerings not only television. Of course, that still doesn't make sense because to the best of my knowledge you don't need a license of any kind to listen to the radio. Anyway, perhaps blind people want to listen to the TV. There are a lot of programs that could make sense even if you can hear but not see them.
  - davejohnclark 2y ago
    > you don't need a license of any kind to listen to the radio. I believe you did once upon a time, but I guess they were phased out as TVs became more popular. >The first supplementary licence fee for colour television was introduced in January 1968. Radio-only licences were abolished in February 1971 (along with the requirement for a separate licence for car radios). https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200405/cmselect/cmcumeds/82/8208.htm https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200405/cmselect/cmcu...
  - miki123211 2y ago
    and audio description[1]! I'm no fan of national broadcasters as a concept, but I have to say, the UK is excellent when it comes to audio description, much more so than any (English speaking) country I'm aware of. It's not just the BBC either, Sky and other private broadcasters also have relatively high standards. For years, the only English AD you could get for extremely popular HBO shows, like Game of Thrones for example, were pirated British rips from Sky, as HBO famously refused to provide the service. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audio_description https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audio_description
- bearbin 2y ago
  The TV license is certainly bit ridiculous, but being legally blind doesn't necessarily mean you can't see at all, just you fall below the legal threshold where it's judged that poor sight will interfere with your day-to-day life. Lots of people registered as blind can still watch the TV just fine even if they won't be able to see the detail.
  - Aerroon 2y ago
    The threshold is a lot higher than people think. I would be at the level of legal blindness without my glasses. I use my phone without glasses daily. A small laptop screen without glasses would be alright too, but desktop monitors are too big. Of course, to be considered legally blind, your vision has to be that bad with the best correction available. (Below 20/200)
- TheRealPomax 2y ago
  Don't want to pay the full amount? Simply get a black and white television, now it's 70% off.
- latexr 2y ago
  I mean, TV is an audiovisual medium. Audio/Visual. 50/50. Blind people can still listen to the TV (though arguably not have half the experience). The real question is if deaf people get the same discount.
Rendello 2y ago
In Japan there was an infamous political party focused on getting rid of the hated TV licence system: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZG95grO-vc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZG95grO-vc
- busterarm 2y ago
  In Japan the vast majority of people stopped paying their TV license after a string of NHK scandals and there's no penalty for failing to pay either. It's just not enforced. Also the party platform wasn't to get rid of the license system but to encrypt the broadcast signal so that only willing NHK viewers would pay for the license.
  - DrillShopper 2y ago
    The penalty for not paying the TV license is dealing with their harassment specialists (aka fee collectors)
- squidsoup 2y ago
  There's a great, and somewhat terrifying character relating to this, the "NHK Fee Collector" in Haruki Murakami's 1Q84.
- bigmadden 2y ago
  Some people actually voted them into office as a joke and they turned out to be a bunch of racists with some really awful views and were overall absolute shite politicians. Who could have imagined?
looperhacks 2y ago
Pedantry time! At least in Germany, the "Rundfunkbeitrag" is not a tax, but more like a fee. Taxes go into the overall budget of the collecting party who then uses a part of the budget to fund something. The broadcasting fee can only be used for the broadcasting system and does not go through the country's budget. This means to increase the broadcasting budget, the fee has to be increased and it can't be subsidized by increasing the budget without increasing the tax.

busterarm 2y ago

Yes, but the UK is the only country with a license ridiculous enough to offer you a 50% discount _if you're blind_.

gs17 2y ago
It sounds weirder than that to me: > colour TV: £169.50 per year; monochrome TV: £57.00 per year; blind people: 50% discount People who can't see their color TV at all pay more than people who can but have an old black-and-white one?
- madeofpalk 2y ago
  Do the discounts stack? If you’re blind should you just buy a monochrome tv and pay £28?
  - account42 2y ago
    On the other hand you might end up paying quite a bit more for a monochrome tv than for the cheapest color tv you can find.
    - chihuahua 2y ago
      Maybe you can just turn down the color setting to 0, and break off the knob.
- Ellipsis753 2y ago
  Weirder still, the discounts stack! So blind people can benefit from buying a black-and-white TV for an additional discount. I've given this a lot of thought in the past. The best I could come up with is that "legally blind" could still allow for someone with _very poor_ (colour) vision...
- dom96 2y ago
  this is making me want to buy a black and white TV (or grab a monitor and set it to always show in black and white) just so I can buy the monochrome TV license for giggles
- soneil 2y ago
  People who can’t see their colour TV pay more than people who can’t see their B&W TV. Oh to be a a fly on the wall when the inspector has to explain the difference to a blind person. I think it made a lot more sense in the past. The license is set up so it’s a consumption based tax rather than taxing everyone. So only people with TVs paid TV tax. If colour increased the costs, only people consuming colour paid those increases. I imagine it made much more sense before consumption was ubiquitous
  - rescbr 2y ago
    A novelty product opportunity: plug together a Raspberry Pi, an USB TV tuner and a BW LCD display to pay a smaller TV licence.
    - chihuahua 2y ago
      When I lived in Britain in 1989-1992, at the time the rule was that battery-powered TVs were exempt from the license fees. I had a tiny TV that could be powered by 6 AA batteries. The screen size was approximately 3 inches / 7.5cm. I don't know if the rules have changed since then, but if they are the same, then a battery-powered laptop would also be exempt (even in color.)
- TheRealPomax 2y ago
  That's... not what https://www.gov.uk/find-licences/tv-licence https://www.gov.uk/find-licences/tv-licence says at all. If you're blind, you almost certainly qualify for a free license.
  - giobox 2y ago
    No, it really does say this. There is expressly no free TV licence for being blind, instead a 50% discount. https://www.gov.uk/free-discount-tv-licence https://www.gov.uk/free-discount-tv-licence https://www.tvlicensing.co.uk/check-if-you-need-one/for-your-home/blindseverely-sight-impaired-aud5?WT.ac=reducedfee_blind https://www.tvlicensing.co.uk/check-if-you-need-one/for-your...
- Xophmeister 2y ago
  Since the switch to digital, presumably there’s no longer and signal for B&W TVs.
  - manarth 2y ago
    There has rarely (if ever) been a separate broadcast signal for B&W vs colour. Broadcasts began in B&W, over time upgraded to colour, but there wasn't a need to broadcast Channel <whatever> in B&W and broadcast the same channel in colour on a different frequency. One single broadcast signal, and different capabilities of receivers.
    - Xophmeister 2y ago
      But surely B&W TVs only exist with analog tuners?
      - manarth 2y ago
        Oh, I misunderstood the point you were making. I guess you _could_ have a modern digital receiver with SCART-out (if such a thing exists) to a B&W TV. This BBC article (2018) claims 7,000 people watching TV with a B&W licence – whether they were actually watching it in B&W is not known :-D https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46125741 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46125741
labster 2y ago
That makes sense, a blind man only uses half of the signal.
azornathogron 2y ago
Although, yes, this sounds absurd, it's worth noting that the TV licence pays for the BBC and the BBC has extensive radio (and web) offerings not only television. Of course, that still doesn't make sense because to the best of my knowledge you don't need a license of any kind to listen to the radio. Anyway, perhaps blind people want to listen to the TV. There are a lot of programs that could make sense even if you can hear but not see them.
- davejohnclark 2y ago
  > you don't need a license of any kind to listen to the radio. I believe you did once upon a time, but I guess they were phased out as TVs became more popular. >The first supplementary licence fee for colour television was introduced in January 1968. Radio-only licences were abolished in February 1971 (along with the requirement for a separate licence for car radios). https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200405/cmselect/cmcumeds/82/8208.htm https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200405/cmselect/cmcu...
- miki123211 2y ago
  and audio description[1]! I'm no fan of national broadcasters as a concept, but I have to say, the UK is excellent when it comes to audio description, much more so than any (English speaking) country I'm aware of. It's not just the BBC either, Sky and other private broadcasters also have relatively high standards. For years, the only English AD you could get for extremely popular HBO shows, like Game of Thrones for example, were pirated British rips from Sky, as HBO famously refused to provide the service. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audio_description https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audio_description
bearbin 2y ago
The TV license is certainly bit ridiculous, but being legally blind doesn't necessarily mean you can't see at all, just you fall below the legal threshold where it's judged that poor sight will interfere with your day-to-day life. Lots of people registered as blind can still watch the TV just fine even if they won't be able to see the detail.
- Aerroon 2y ago
  The threshold is a lot higher than people think. I would be at the level of legal blindness without my glasses. I use my phone without glasses daily. A small laptop screen without glasses would be alright too, but desktop monitors are too big. Of course, to be considered legally blind, your vision has to be that bad with the best correction available. (Below 20/200)
TheRealPomax 2y ago
Don't want to pay the full amount? Simply get a black and white television, now it's 70% off.
latexr 2y ago
I mean, TV is an audiovisual medium. Audio/Visual. 50/50. Blind people can still listen to the TV (though arguably not have half the experience). The real question is if deaf people get the same discount.

Rendello 2y ago

In Japan there was an infamous political party focused on getting rid of the hated TV licence system: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZG95grO-vc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZG95grO-vc

busterarm 2y ago
In Japan the vast majority of people stopped paying their TV license after a string of NHK scandals and there's no penalty for failing to pay either. It's just not enforced. Also the party platform wasn't to get rid of the license system but to encrypt the broadcast signal so that only willing NHK viewers would pay for the license.
- DrillShopper 2y ago
  The penalty for not paying the TV license is dealing with their harassment specialists (aka fee collectors)
squidsoup 2y ago
There's a great, and somewhat terrifying character relating to this, the "NHK Fee Collector" in Haruki Murakami's 1Q84.
bigmadden 2y ago
Some people actually voted them into office as a joke and they turned out to be a bunch of racists with some really awful views and were overall absolute shite politicians. Who could have imagined?

looperhacks 2y ago

Pedantry time! At least in Germany, the "Rundfunkbeitrag" is not a tax, but more like a fee. Taxes go into the overall budget of the collecting party who then uses a part of the budget to fund something. The broadcasting fee can only be used for the broadcasting system and does not go through the country's budget. This means to increase the broadcasting budget, the fee has to be increased and it can't be subsidized by increasing the budget without increasing the tax.