4 ms·

Competition is great! I'm very glad that Apple has managed to exert some pressure on Microsoft here. I really don't think that this would have occurred otherwi

by 3JPLW 14y ago

Competition is great! I'm very glad that Apple has managed to exert some pressure on Microsoft here. I really don't think that this would have occurred otherwise.

gouranga 14y ago
I don't think it's related to Apple at all. I can't believe people are trying to give Apple some credit for it. Two real things: 1) No one ever buys Windows upgrades, so this is a motivator to shift to Win8. Consumers and businesses just buy a new PC and large businesses get licenses automatically. 2) They now have the opportunity of upselling inside the operating system (which they've been playing with for a long time - since 2007!). That is it. No pressure from Apple.
- ahsteele 14y ago
  Whether or not a business just buys new machines or upgrades their OS depends on a variety of factors. Coporations who have bought Microsoft Software Assurance can upgrade to the latest MS Software on any machine without incurring any new licensing costs. http://www.microsoft.com/licensing/software-assurance/new-version-rights.aspx http://www.microsoft.com/licensing/software-assurance/new-ve...
- vonmoltke 14y ago
  > 1) No one ever buys Windows upgrades, so this is a motivator to shift to Win8. Consumers and businesses just buy a new PC and large businesses get licenses automatically. Maybe I'm in a very small minority, but I have bought Windows upgrades. I don't buy prebuilt computers, but still have reason to keep a Windows box around. Plus, my Mom gets my retired boxes, so I need a couple additional installs at her house. One of those is still an XP box, so I will definitely be taking advantage of this upgrade deal for that.
- greedo 14y ago
  If #1 is true in terms of past behavior, then expecting this price point to change that is doubtful. In my experience, the reason no on upgrades is because they then inherit all the cruft from their old install. I'm not sure that upgrading will ever be popular with the Windows crows. #2 is also doubtful for the same reason. If users are faced with 900 versions of Windows to choose from while upgrading, they'll choose the cheapest. And if they find out that Feature X requires them to pony up more money through the MS Store, they'll be supremely irritated. And you haven't really given any evidence to show that it's not related to Apple's pricing.
  - gouranga 14y ago
    Correlation does not imply causality. The burden of proof is on the inclusive case. Windows upgrades allow fresh installs so that's rubbish.
    - greedo 14y ago
      So if a user is going to do a fresh install, they need to back up their existing data, perform a fresh install, restore their data, find all the old install disks from their existing software, install those. Look for the license keys for this software, fail since they bought the software ages ago, or pirated it from a buddy. Then throw their hands up in the air and get mad at MS. It's a fact of Windows in the consumer market that upgrades just don't happen. Consumers almost always run their computers into the ground, then get the latest version of Windows when they purchase a new PC. This is something you stated in your post, yet you seem to think that MS will magically change this behaviour with this price point. I see no evidence to support that. Additionally, the MS Store is almost a direct response to Apple's App Store on OSX.
      - Mythbusters 14y ago
        The experience you described regarding upgrade is grossly outdated. Have you upgraded recently? The transfer wizard (forgot the actual name) does such as awesome job of moving your data to new OS that I have seen even the cookies persist after OS upgrade without me having to do any tweaking.
starpilot 14y ago
Windows users consider the paid OS X upgrades blatant cash grabs for updates that should be free. They see it as charging for service packs.
- shinratdr 14y ago
  That's because they don't use OS X. No service pack has ever made the kind of changes an OS X upgrade has, period. Anyone who spends time in both operating systems knows that's a ridiculous sentiment only spouted by the most ignorant users. I've also never heard it from someone who has ever actually used OS X for any real length of time. Ignorant OS X users tend to consider Windows upgrades overpriced. That's not true either. It's just a different release strategy. Microsoft can't work on that kind of incremental release schedule without upsetting enterprise customers. The only real difference is Apple has stuck with the original OS X UI and chosen to refine it, whereas Microsoft throws out the old skin for every release and designs a new one which makes updates seem more drastic. That's just the UI though. Behind the scenes, OS X has made as much progress between 10.0 and 10.8 as Windows has between XP and 8.

by 3JPLW 14y ago

Competition is great! I'm very glad that Apple has managed to exert some pressure on Microsoft here. I really don't think that this would have occurred otherwise.

gouranga 14y ago

I don't think it's related to Apple at all. I can't believe people are trying to give Apple some credit for it. Two real things: 1) No one ever buys Windows upgrades, so this is a motivator to shift to Win8. Consumers and businesses just buy a new PC and large businesses get licenses automatically. 2) They now have the opportunity of upselling inside the operating system (which they've been playing with for a long time - since 2007!). That is it. No pressure from Apple.

ahsteele 14y ago
Whether or not a business just buys new machines or upgrades their OS depends on a variety of factors. Coporations who have bought Microsoft Software Assurance can upgrade to the latest MS Software on any machine without incurring any new licensing costs. http://www.microsoft.com/licensing/software-assurance/new-version-rights.aspx http://www.microsoft.com/licensing/software-assurance/new-ve...
vonmoltke 14y ago
> 1) No one ever buys Windows upgrades, so this is a motivator to shift to Win8. Consumers and businesses just buy a new PC and large businesses get licenses automatically. Maybe I'm in a very small minority, but I have bought Windows upgrades. I don't buy prebuilt computers, but still have reason to keep a Windows box around. Plus, my Mom gets my retired boxes, so I need a couple additional installs at her house. One of those is still an XP box, so I will definitely be taking advantage of this upgrade deal for that.
greedo 14y ago
If #1 is true in terms of past behavior, then expecting this price point to change that is doubtful. In my experience, the reason no on upgrades is because they then inherit all the cruft from their old install. I'm not sure that upgrading will ever be popular with the Windows crows. #2 is also doubtful for the same reason. If users are faced with 900 versions of Windows to choose from while upgrading, they'll choose the cheapest. And if they find out that Feature X requires them to pony up more money through the MS Store, they'll be supremely irritated. And you haven't really given any evidence to show that it's not related to Apple's pricing.
- gouranga 14y ago
  Correlation does not imply causality. The burden of proof is on the inclusive case. Windows upgrades allow fresh installs so that's rubbish.
  - greedo 14y ago
    So if a user is going to do a fresh install, they need to back up their existing data, perform a fresh install, restore their data, find all the old install disks from their existing software, install those. Look for the license keys for this software, fail since they bought the software ages ago, or pirated it from a buddy. Then throw their hands up in the air and get mad at MS. It's a fact of Windows in the consumer market that upgrades just don't happen. Consumers almost always run their computers into the ground, then get the latest version of Windows when they purchase a new PC. This is something you stated in your post, yet you seem to think that MS will magically change this behaviour with this price point. I see no evidence to support that. Additionally, the MS Store is almost a direct response to Apple's App Store on OSX.
    - Mythbusters 14y ago
      The experience you described regarding upgrade is grossly outdated. Have you upgraded recently? The transfer wizard (forgot the actual name) does such as awesome job of moving your data to new OS that I have seen even the cookies persist after OS upgrade without me having to do any tweaking.

starpilot 14y ago

Windows users consider the paid OS X upgrades blatant cash grabs for updates that should be free. They see it as charging for service packs.

shinratdr 14y ago
That's because they don't use OS X. No service pack has ever made the kind of changes an OS X upgrade has, period. Anyone who spends time in both operating systems knows that's a ridiculous sentiment only spouted by the most ignorant users. I've also never heard it from someone who has ever actually used OS X for any real length of time. Ignorant OS X users tend to consider Windows upgrades overpriced. That's not true either. It's just a different release strategy. Microsoft can't work on that kind of incremental release schedule without upsetting enterprise customers. The only real difference is Apple has stuck with the original OS X UI and chosen to refine it, whereas Microsoft throws out the old skin for every release and designs a new one which makes updates seem more drastic. That's just the UI though. Behind the scenes, OS X has made as much progress between 10.0 and 10.8 as Windows has between XP and 8.