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External RF-EMF Alters Cell Number and Reactive Oxygen Species Balance

-Rake 2y ago
Since my wife was diagnosed with breast cancer last year, I've gone down a rabbit hole on environmental oncogenic drivers, including "out there" ones like RF. This study doesn't surprise me in the slightest.
- voisin 2y ago
  Can you elaborate on what evidence you are particularly swayed by?
  - FollowingTheDao 2y ago
    Might want to see how they are linking quantum mechanics of radical pair mechanism to the health effects of even very weak magnetic fields: https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rsif.2022.0325 https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rsif.2022.032...
perching_aix 2y ago
I don't quite understand why the authors consider their experiment a solid, novel evidence to alter safety standards, short for them imagining women shoving up Qi chargers into their uterus. That said, I'm also unfamiliar with those mysterious "present safety standards" that "solely consider the thermal-effect of RM-EMF", so I can't even tell if that is actually true. The reason I'm even doubting that it is, because the field of photochemistry is like... pretty established. You'd think EM radiation resulting in heightened ROS production and other health effects are not missed by academia and regulation by now. Especially considering that this is the exact mechanism behind one of the most well known EM radiation health concerns, UV-radiation.
- jessetemp 2y ago
  This is about mid range wireless charging [1] not Qi chargers. If something is charging your watch from across the room it's blasting your whole body. The FCC limits RF exposure to 1.6 W/kg. [2] That's presumably the standard the authors argue is insufficient to prevent ~7MHz wireless chargers from inhibiting cell apoptosis. [1] https://airfuel.org/ https://airfuel.org/ [2] https://www.fcc.gov/consumers/guides/wireless-devices-and-health-concerns https://www.fcc.gov/consumers/guides/wireless-devices-and-he...
  - perching_aix 2y ago
    But that's not a thermal thing? It's energy absorbed.
- FollowingTheDao 2y ago
  There is much you have misunderstood about the science and the regulation that I will need to say you have to read about it more. > Especially considering that this is the exact mechanism behind one of the most well known EM radiation health concerns, UV-radiation. The UV health risk is based on the thermal effect when it comes to cancer. And this is pretty much the only thing they look for in EMF health and safety. There is a concern the ROS do more than just cause cancer, like mood disoders, fatigue, immune issues, etc. All of the studies that are regulating safety ONLY look at the thermal effect in regard to DNA damage.
  - perching_aix 2y ago
    > The UV health risk is based on the thermal effect when it comes to cancer. As far as I'm aware no, it is well-established that like I said, it's the phototoxicity of UV: https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s13273-017-0002-0 https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s13273-017-0002-0 https://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/ultraviolet-radiation https://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/ultraviolet...

Since my wife was diagnosed with breast cancer last year, I've gone down a rabbit hole on environmental oncogenic drivers, including "out there" ones like RF. This study doesn't surprise me in the slightest.

voisin 2y ago
Can you elaborate on what evidence you are particularly swayed by?
- FollowingTheDao 2y ago
  Might want to see how they are linking quantum mechanics of radical pair mechanism to the health effects of even very weak magnetic fields: https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rsif.2022.0325 https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rsif.2022.032...

perching_aix 2y ago

I don't quite understand why the authors consider their experiment a solid, novel evidence to alter safety standards, short for them imagining women shoving up Qi chargers into their uterus. That said, I'm also unfamiliar with those mysterious "present safety standards" that "solely consider the thermal-effect of RM-EMF", so I can't even tell if that is actually true. The reason I'm even doubting that it is, because the field of photochemistry is like... pretty established. You'd think EM radiation resulting in heightened ROS production and other health effects are not missed by academia and regulation by now. Especially considering that this is the exact mechanism behind one of the most well known EM radiation health concerns, UV-radiation.

jessetemp 2y ago
This is about mid range wireless charging [1] not Qi chargers. If something is charging your watch from across the room it's blasting your whole body. The FCC limits RF exposure to 1.6 W/kg. [2] That's presumably the standard the authors argue is insufficient to prevent ~7MHz wireless chargers from inhibiting cell apoptosis. [1] https://airfuel.org/ https://airfuel.org/ [2] https://www.fcc.gov/consumers/guides/wireless-devices-and-health-concerns https://www.fcc.gov/consumers/guides/wireless-devices-and-he...
- perching_aix 2y ago
  But that's not a thermal thing? It's energy absorbed.
FollowingTheDao 2y ago
There is much you have misunderstood about the science and the regulation that I will need to say you have to read about it more. > Especially considering that this is the exact mechanism behind one of the most well known EM radiation health concerns, UV-radiation. The UV health risk is based on the thermal effect when it comes to cancer. And this is pretty much the only thing they look for in EMF health and safety. There is a concern the ROS do more than just cause cancer, like mood disoders, fatigue, immune issues, etc. All of the studies that are regulating safety ONLY look at the thermal effect in regard to DNA damage.
- perching_aix 2y ago
  > The UV health risk is based on the thermal effect when it comes to cancer. As far as I'm aware no, it is well-established that like I said, it's the phototoxicity of UV: https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s13273-017-0002-0 https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s13273-017-0002-0 https://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/ultraviolet-radiation https://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/ultraviolet...