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friendly reminder that rent control causes vacancies like this. because its better to wait for a better market than let someone sit on your discounted property

friendly reminder that rent control causes vacancies like this. because its better to wait for a better market than let someone sit on your discounted property forever.

tootie 2y ago
If rent is controlled, then waiting doesn't do anything does it? Also, rent control barely exists anywhere in the country.
- iknowstuff 2y ago
  depends on the rent control. In most cases you’re allowed to rent at any price you want when changing the tenant.
throwaway19972 2y ago
> friendly reminder that rent control causes vacancies like this This is simply an american myth. I'm not sure where it comes from.
- olliej 2y ago
  It's standard property owner propaganda to support price gouging.
ceejayoz 2y ago
The original article's graphic of top-affected metro areas (https://www.realtor.com/news/trends/cities-with-most-vacant-homes-lendingtree-study/ https://www.realtor.com/news/trends/cities-with-most-vacant-..., "Metros with the highest vacancy rates") doesn't look like it has many areas subject to rent control.
henry2023 2y ago
This is a common epistemological bias in which you try to fit your narrative into what’s observable rather than building a narrative out of what you observe. You can verify yourself that cities with rent control have pretty low vacancy rates for example SF and NY are around 2.5%. And even my claim is not that rent control decreases vacancy. My view is that extremely dense cities with already low vacancies implement rent control as a social measure and usually that doesn’t have a real impact on market dynamics.
- avidiax 2y ago
  > My view is that extremely dense cities with already low vacancies implement rent control as a social measure and usually that doesn’t have a real impact on market dynamics. How could a portion of the housing stock being held by people paying below-market rates not impact market dynamics? At the very least: * People paying far below market rent are disincentivized to ever move, even if they have a long commute, their children move out, etc. * Landlords are disincentivized to ever renovate or improve rent-controlled units. The improvements can't be captured in increased prices or marketability. * Developers may constrain supply, since it would be more profitable to develop housing somewhere without rent control, all other things being equal. * The market rent (paid by newcomers or movers) often increases, owing to constrained supply caused by multiple of the above points.
  - throwaway19972 2y ago
    > Landlords are disincentivized to ever renovate or improve rent-controlled units. This is already true in low-vacancy housing markets. Besides, renovating units with active tenants is extraordinarily rare. Outside of active units (among common american rent control schemes) units without active unita may be freely repriced. > Developers may constrain supply, since it would be more profitable to develop housing somewhere without rent control, all other things being equal. Developers are not landlords. Why would developers care about rent when they aren't renting? Outside of cartel activity this shouldn't happen. > The market rent (paid by newcomers or movers) often increases, owing to constrained supply caused by multiple of the above points. Neither supply nor rent control are sufficient to keep rents stable to a given metric. Surely this can't be news to anyone. You need to provide both to competently manage a rental market. But neither rent control nor supply will remove homelessness. Only decommodification will.
- iknowstuff 2y ago
  uh funny that you mention sf/nyc, given your first paragraph, as sf in particular is the huge exception to the correlation.
micromacrofoot 2y ago
this isn't rent controlled real estate though, 0% of it is
olliej 2y ago
Friendly reminder: these vacancies are caused by lack of demand not rent control. Rent control doesn't apply to these 5.6M vacancies, and anyone with even the most basic common sense would say "huh, I know housing prices are skyrocketing, so why would there be this many vacant properties" and read the article rather than just making up anti-government buzzword bingo. Additional friendly reminder: every rent control law, no matter how badly written, was instituted in response to price gouging by property owners.
- iknowstuff 2y ago
  price gouging is another way of saying charging what people are willing to pay.

friendly reminder that rent control causes vacancies like this. because its better to wait for a better market than let someone sit on your discounted property forever.

tootie 2y ago

If rent is controlled, then waiting doesn't do anything does it? Also, rent control barely exists anywhere in the country.

iknowstuff 2y ago
depends on the rent control. In most cases you’re allowed to rent at any price you want when changing the tenant.

throwaway19972 2y ago

> friendly reminder that rent control causes vacancies like this This is simply an american myth. I'm not sure where it comes from.

olliej 2y ago
It's standard property owner propaganda to support price gouging.

ceejayoz 2y ago

The original article's graphic of top-affected metro areas (https://www.realtor.com/news/trends/cities-with-most-vacant-homes-lendingtree-study/ https://www.realtor.com/news/trends/cities-with-most-vacant-..., "Metros with the highest vacancy rates") doesn't look like it has many areas subject to rent control.

henry2023 2y ago

This is a common epistemological bias in which you try to fit your narrative into what’s observable rather than building a narrative out of what you observe. You can verify yourself that cities with rent control have pretty low vacancy rates for example SF and NY are around 2.5%. And even my claim is not that rent control decreases vacancy. My view is that extremely dense cities with already low vacancies implement rent control as a social measure and usually that doesn’t have a real impact on market dynamics.

avidiax 2y ago
> My view is that extremely dense cities with already low vacancies implement rent control as a social measure and usually that doesn’t have a real impact on market dynamics. How could a portion of the housing stock being held by people paying below-market rates not impact market dynamics? At the very least: * People paying far below market rent are disincentivized to ever move, even if they have a long commute, their children move out, etc. * Landlords are disincentivized to ever renovate or improve rent-controlled units. The improvements can't be captured in increased prices or marketability. * Developers may constrain supply, since it would be more profitable to develop housing somewhere without rent control, all other things being equal. * The market rent (paid by newcomers or movers) often increases, owing to constrained supply caused by multiple of the above points.
- throwaway19972 2y ago
  > Landlords are disincentivized to ever renovate or improve rent-controlled units. This is already true in low-vacancy housing markets. Besides, renovating units with active tenants is extraordinarily rare. Outside of active units (among common american rent control schemes) units without active unita may be freely repriced. > Developers may constrain supply, since it would be more profitable to develop housing somewhere without rent control, all other things being equal. Developers are not landlords. Why would developers care about rent when they aren't renting? Outside of cartel activity this shouldn't happen. > The market rent (paid by newcomers or movers) often increases, owing to constrained supply caused by multiple of the above points. Neither supply nor rent control are sufficient to keep rents stable to a given metric. Surely this can't be news to anyone. You need to provide both to competently manage a rental market. But neither rent control nor supply will remove homelessness. Only decommodification will.
iknowstuff 2y ago
uh funny that you mention sf/nyc, given your first paragraph, as sf in particular is the huge exception to the correlation.

micromacrofoot 2y ago

this isn't rent controlled real estate though, 0% of it is

olliej 2y ago

Friendly reminder: these vacancies are caused by lack of demand not rent control. Rent control doesn't apply to these 5.6M vacancies, and anyone with even the most basic common sense would say "huh, I know housing prices are skyrocketing, so why would there be this many vacant properties" and read the article rather than just making up anti-government buzzword bingo. Additional friendly reminder: every rent control law, no matter how badly written, was instituted in response to price gouging by property owners.

iknowstuff 2y ago
price gouging is another way of saying charging what people are willing to pay.