4 ms·

Blocking, sure. But literally sending the emails to the CEO might very well be a new one.

by qgin 2y ago

rwmj 2y ago
There are loads of terrible companies around, so I'd be surprised if none of them had ever tried to intercept Blind sign-up messages before now, and if you're a tyrant CEO at one of said terrible companies, getting the emails forwarded to you is merely the next logical step. The next paragraph in the text is a lot more interesting: Some of the most commonly discussed topics on Blind are protected speech in the U.S.—pay, job terminations, critiques of workplace conditions—which we believe workers should be free to access and discuss. What are the consequences (in the US) of a company blocking that?
- 0cf8612b2e1e 2y ago
  Zero. Protected speech is protected from government intervention. You can run your own forum that bans people from discussing <thing you hate> without repercussions.
  - ceejayoz 2y ago
    Eh, discussing salary is a right, guaranteed by the National Labor Relations Act.
    - 0cf8612b2e1e 2y ago
      You are totally right. Was knee jerk thinking of generic free speech protections from private companies. That being said, blanket blocking access to a forum might still be ok? You do not know specifically what would be discussed there.
    - lmz 2y ago
      Blocking signups to a specific forum using company email is not blocking salary discussions.
      - ceejayoz 2y ago
        You'd want to be very sure that at no point an email/text along the lines of "let's do this, because people are discussing salaries" was sent that might show up in discovery.
        Alupis 2y ago
        So what if it does? You are not prohibiting discussing of salaries - you are prohibiting discussing of salaries while using company property and company time. There is no problem here.
        kragen 2y ago
        NLRB has ruled many times on companies "prohibiting discussing of salaries while using company property and company time", virtually always striking down the prohibitions and in many cases sanctioning companies for trying to impose them. Labor organizing activity is absolutely allowed to happen on company property and company time. It would be impossible otherwise at many workplaces. Think about auto factories, coal mines, offshore oil platforms, etc., especially before email.
        Alupis 2y ago
        You are misinformed. The NLRB does not allow you to use company time and company property to do non-company things. You can use your own break time to discuss salaries. There is nothing a company can do to prohibit that. It's really that simple.
        ceejayoz 2y ago
        If work allows non-work conversations, discussing salaries can't be an exception to that. (Automattic definitely permits non-work conversations during the workday.) https://www.nlrb.gov/about-nlrb/rights-we-protect/your-rights/your-rights-to-discuss-wages https://www.nlrb.gov/about-nlrb/rights-we-protect/your-right... > You may have discussions about wages when not at work, when you are on break, and even during work if employees are permitted to have other non-work conversations. You have these rights whether or not you are represented by a union. If you consistently have - and consistently enforce! - a "no non-work conversations" policy, that can include salary discussions. Suddenly adding a new "no talking!" policy in response to people organizing wouldn't fly, either.
    - Alupis 2y ago
      Discussing salary using company property (your provided email address and provided computer) on company time is not guaranteed nor protected. You can discuss anything you want on your time using your own property.
      - AlotOfReading 2y ago
        I'm pretty sure the NLRA does protect that, and this specific behavior seems like it would fall afoul of CA 232.5 as well: https://law.justia.com/codes/california/code-lab/division-2/part-1/chapter-1/article-1/section-232-5/ https://law.justia.com/codes/california/code-lab/division-2/...
      - snowwrestler 2y ago
        It may not be so clear cut if the employer allows other non-work use of the email and computers, like sending and receiving personal emails, or visiting websites for personal reasons.
      - ceejayoz 2y ago
        That's entirely false. https://www.nlrb.gov/about-nlrb/rights-we-protect/your-rights/your-rights-to-discuss-wages https://www.nlrb.gov/about-nlrb/rights-we-protect/your-right... > You may have discussions about wages when not at work, when you are on break, and even during work if employees are permitted to have other non-work conversations. You have these rights whether or not you are represented by a union.
        Alupis 2y ago
        That's entirely false. > > You may have discussions about wages when not at work, when you are on break, and even during work if employees are permitted to have other non-work conversations. You have these rights whether or not you are represented by a union. So which employer expressly allows you to use company time and property to do non-company things? Oh, right... none. So you clocking into work (figuratively or literally), logging into you company computer, browsing to a non-work-related website and gabbing all day is not protected.

Blocking, sure. But literally sending the emails to the CEO might very well be a new one.

by qgin 2y ago

Blocking, sure. But literally sending the emails to the CEO might very well be a new one.

rwmj 2y ago

There are loads of terrible companies around, so I'd be surprised if none of them had ever tried to intercept Blind sign-up messages before now, and if you're a tyrant CEO at one of said terrible companies, getting the emails forwarded to you is merely the next logical step. The next paragraph in the text is a lot more interesting: Some of the most commonly discussed topics on Blind are protected speech in the U.S.—pay, job terminations, critiques of workplace conditions—which we believe workers should be free to access and discuss. What are the consequences (in the US) of a company blocking that?

0cf8612b2e1e 2y ago
Zero. Protected speech is protected from government intervention. You can run your own forum that bans people from discussing <thing you hate> without repercussions.
- ceejayoz 2y ago
  Eh, discussing salary is a right, guaranteed by the National Labor Relations Act.
  - 0cf8612b2e1e 2y ago
    You are totally right. Was knee jerk thinking of generic free speech protections from private companies. That being said, blanket blocking access to a forum might still be ok? You do not know specifically what would be discussed there.
  - lmz 2y ago
    Blocking signups to a specific forum using company email is not blocking salary discussions.
    - ceejayoz 2y ago
      You'd want to be very sure that at no point an email/text along the lines of "let's do this, because people are discussing salaries" was sent that might show up in discovery.
      - Alupis 2y ago
        So what if it does? You are not prohibiting discussing of salaries - you are prohibiting discussing of salaries while using company property and company time. There is no problem here.
        kragen 2y ago
        NLRB has ruled many times on companies "prohibiting discussing of salaries while using company property and company time", virtually always striking down the prohibitions and in many cases sanctioning companies for trying to impose them. Labor organizing activity is absolutely allowed to happen on company property and company time. It would be impossible otherwise at many workplaces. Think about auto factories, coal mines, offshore oil platforms, etc., especially before email.
        Alupis 2y ago
        You are misinformed. The NLRB does not allow you to use company time and company property to do non-company things. You can use your own break time to discuss salaries. There is nothing a company can do to prohibit that. It's really that simple.
        ceejayoz 2y ago
        If work allows non-work conversations, discussing salaries can't be an exception to that. (Automattic definitely permits non-work conversations during the workday.) https://www.nlrb.gov/about-nlrb/rights-we-protect/your-rights/your-rights-to-discuss-wages https://www.nlrb.gov/about-nlrb/rights-we-protect/your-right... > You may have discussions about wages when not at work, when you are on break, and even during work if employees are permitted to have other non-work conversations. You have these rights whether or not you are represented by a union. If you consistently have - and consistently enforce! - a "no non-work conversations" policy, that can include salary discussions. Suddenly adding a new "no talking!" policy in response to people organizing wouldn't fly, either.
  - Alupis 2y ago
    Discussing salary using company property (your provided email address and provided computer) on company time is not guaranteed nor protected. You can discuss anything you want on your time using your own property.
    - AlotOfReading 2y ago
      I'm pretty sure the NLRA does protect that, and this specific behavior seems like it would fall afoul of CA 232.5 as well: https://law.justia.com/codes/california/code-lab/division-2/part-1/chapter-1/article-1/section-232-5/ https://law.justia.com/codes/california/code-lab/division-2/...
    - snowwrestler 2y ago
      It may not be so clear cut if the employer allows other non-work use of the email and computers, like sending and receiving personal emails, or visiting websites for personal reasons.
    - ceejayoz 2y ago
      That's entirely false. https://www.nlrb.gov/about-nlrb/rights-we-protect/your-rights/your-rights-to-discuss-wages https://www.nlrb.gov/about-nlrb/rights-we-protect/your-right... > You may have discussions about wages when not at work, when you are on break, and even during work if employees are permitted to have other non-work conversations. You have these rights whether or not you are represented by a union.
      - Alupis 2y ago
        That's entirely false. > > You may have discussions about wages when not at work, when you are on break, and even during work if employees are permitted to have other non-work conversations. You have these rights whether or not you are represented by a union. So which employer expressly allows you to use company time and property to do non-company things? Oh, right... none. So you clocking into work (figuratively or literally), logging into you company computer, browsing to a non-work-related website and gabbing all day is not protected.