9 ms·

I think this overall makes a good point that any type of directly heating people is much more efficient than heating an entire building. I hope electrically hea

by _yb2s 2y ago

I think this overall makes a good point that any type of directly heating people is much more efficient than heating an entire building. I hope electrically heated clothing catches on soon... as it already exists and works pretty well. For example, you can get lightweight vests for fairly cheap that will keep you warm all day long from a USB battery in your pocket. Heated blankets and mattress pads of course have also been around a while and work great.

mschuster91 2y ago
> I think this overall makes a good point that any type of directly heating people is much more efficient than heating an entire building. It is, but if a building cools down below the dew point (and it will, unless you're somewhere near the equator), any humidity e.g. from the air you breathe out or from plants will just crash out and condense on the walls, resulting in mold.
- _yb2s 2y ago
  Because of the effect you’re talking about, the outdoor dew point is never above the outdoor temperature- so the air even indoors gets really dry when it’s cold outside, and you only need to keep the inside slightly warmer to keep this from happening. I am into sailing and often sail in cold climates without cabin heat- and find that my body heat alone is enough to prevent this from happening in a small sailboat cabin.
IncreasePosts 2y ago
I'm not sure if this makes sense - even if you had very efficient personal heating, you'd probably still want to maintain your house at a certain temperature(for times when you're not wearing your personal heating, or for pets, or visitors, so your pipes don't burst, etc), meaning you should be investing in good insulation/air gap sealing, etc. Once you pay that cost, the cost of heating the house a few extra degrees isn't that big.
- BlueTemplar 2y ago
  For a not so small minority, it's more of a if you can afford that cost (ironically, probably more of an issue in places without pipe-freeze-busting temperatures). (And they probably cannot afford redoing insulation of where they live either, assuming they even own rather than rent.) P.S.: The hot water bottle is pretty great, in particular when sick.
- _yb2s 2y ago
  I am not suggesting that people in extreme cold climates not heat their house at all and burst pipes, etc. but you could, for example heat your house to 65F instead of 72F and use about 25-30% less heating energy, and still keep family members that like it warmer comfortable. If you drop it to 60F that uses close to half the heating energy on average that heating to 72F. Personally, I live in a mild climate where it rarely gets below 50F or over 85F outside, and I just leave the windows open year round and let the house fluctuate between about 60F and 80F, and find it very comfortable without using anything but different clothing. It is interesting that even with all of the windows open the house averages out the evening lows very well, and stays about 10F warmer.
bloopernova 2y ago
We got a "tall" dining table height Kotatsu with heater and blanket. It's incredibly warm and comfortable in deep winter. The pets love it too! Main issue is that because it's dining table height, all the standard blankets and futons are too short/small. Highly recommend it though, it's great. It just needed a voltage converter.
_joel 2y ago
Not great for your health, long-term - as you'd be breathing in unheated, cold air for excessive periods - "Cold air inflames lungs and inhibits circulation, increasing the risk of respiratory conditions, such as asthma attacks or symptoms, worsening of chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD), and infection. Cold also induces vasoconstriction, which causes stress to the circulatory system (198) that can lead to cardiovascular effects, including ischaemic heart disease (IHD), coronary heart disease, strokes, subarachnoid haemorrhage and death (198–206). Most of the evidence for the impact of cold on health comes from studies connecting outdoor temperatures to health outcomes. For example, cold spells are associated with increased mortality and respiratory and cardiovascular morbidity (207), and mortality and morbidity rates in countries with cold and temperate climates are higher in winter than in summer (208)." https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK535294/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK535294/
- phendrenad2 2y ago
  We need to do more research into this, honestly. The biggest factor - time - isn't accounted for (I.E., do you eventually acclimate to colder temperatures, nullifying all of the bad effects these studies find in the aggregate).
  - dp-hackernews 2y ago
    Just think Inuit or Aboriginal - both living in environments of opposing extremes, surviving just fine for many, many years...
    - _joel 2y ago
      Yex, they adapted over millenia. I don't see what relevance this is to this particular issue though.
      - phendrenad2 2y ago
        Did they really adapt over millennia? There's a lot of relevance if you keep your eyes open.
smeej 2y ago
The other thing that keeps me nice and warm is the stationary bike under my standing desk. I never managed the coordination to walk at my desk, but sitting and riding is easy.
- vosper 2y ago
  Oh there's more than one of us! I also have a stationary bike under my standing desk. It's a cheap recumbent. It's not amazing in terms of ergonomics, so I use it for about 20-30 mins at a time, a few times a day. I used to walk on a treadmill but I found that my head moved enough that focusing on text could be quite annoying. Also, I'd rather get my steps outside. My head still moves on the bike, but it's much less. Also, this way I can just raise my desk and slide the bike under, whereas with the treadmill I was unplugging and going to another room which was less convenient. I have a TV dinner tray thing with a secondary wireless keyboard and trackball that sits just above my knees so I can work while I pedal. And yes it's great for warming up and staying warm all day!
  - smeej 2y ago
    Mine's only semi-recumbent, so I can ride it for hours. I think it was maybe $120 on Amazon. My knees only come up high enough for my thighs to be parallel to the ground, so I can keep the keyboard position nice and low for typing. I've supposedly pedaled over 10,000 miles this year, and I've lost over 40 lbs in the process! Never mind keeping warm in New England! One of the best purchases I've made in a long time!
AStonesThrow 2y ago
"Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for the night. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life!"
mrloop 2y ago
Or even good woolen jumper can make a big difference. Something light so you don’t notice your wearing it but with good insulating properties and you retain a lot more of your own body heat than a cotton or synthetic top.

by _yb2s 2y ago

mschuster91 2y ago

> I think this overall makes a good point that any type of directly heating people is much more efficient than heating an entire building. It is, but if a building cools down below the dew point (and it will, unless you're somewhere near the equator), any humidity e.g. from the air you breathe out or from plants will just crash out and condense on the walls, resulting in mold.

_yb2s 2y ago
Because of the effect you’re talking about, the outdoor dew point is never above the outdoor temperature- so the air even indoors gets really dry when it’s cold outside, and you only need to keep the inside slightly warmer to keep this from happening. I am into sailing and often sail in cold climates without cabin heat- and find that my body heat alone is enough to prevent this from happening in a small sailboat cabin.

IncreasePosts 2y ago

I'm not sure if this makes sense - even if you had very efficient personal heating, you'd probably still want to maintain your house at a certain temperature(for times when you're not wearing your personal heating, or for pets, or visitors, so your pipes don't burst, etc), meaning you should be investing in good insulation/air gap sealing, etc. Once you pay that cost, the cost of heating the house a few extra degrees isn't that big.

BlueTemplar 2y ago
For a not so small minority, it's more of a if you can afford that cost (ironically, probably more of an issue in places without pipe-freeze-busting temperatures). (And they probably cannot afford redoing insulation of where they live either, assuming they even own rather than rent.) P.S.: The hot water bottle is pretty great, in particular when sick.
_yb2s 2y ago
I am not suggesting that people in extreme cold climates not heat their house at all and burst pipes, etc. but you could, for example heat your house to 65F instead of 72F and use about 25-30% less heating energy, and still keep family members that like it warmer comfortable. If you drop it to 60F that uses close to half the heating energy on average that heating to 72F. Personally, I live in a mild climate where it rarely gets below 50F or over 85F outside, and I just leave the windows open year round and let the house fluctuate between about 60F and 80F, and find it very comfortable without using anything but different clothing. It is interesting that even with all of the windows open the house averages out the evening lows very well, and stays about 10F warmer.

bloopernova 2y ago

We got a "tall" dining table height Kotatsu with heater and blanket. It's incredibly warm and comfortable in deep winter. The pets love it too! Main issue is that because it's dining table height, all the standard blankets and futons are too short/small. Highly recommend it though, it's great. It just needed a voltage converter.

_joel 2y ago

Not great for your health, long-term - as you'd be breathing in unheated, cold air for excessive periods - "Cold air inflames lungs and inhibits circulation, increasing the risk of respiratory conditions, such as asthma attacks or symptoms, worsening of chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD), and infection. Cold also induces vasoconstriction, which causes stress to the circulatory system (198) that can lead to cardiovascular effects, including ischaemic heart disease (IHD), coronary heart disease, strokes, subarachnoid haemorrhage and death (198–206). Most of the evidence for the impact of cold on health comes from studies connecting outdoor temperatures to health outcomes. For example, cold spells are associated with increased mortality and respiratory and cardiovascular morbidity (207), and mortality and morbidity rates in countries with cold and temperate climates are higher in winter than in summer (208)." https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK535294/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK535294/

phendrenad2 2y ago
We need to do more research into this, honestly. The biggest factor - time - isn't accounted for (I.E., do you eventually acclimate to colder temperatures, nullifying all of the bad effects these studies find in the aggregate).
- dp-hackernews 2y ago
  Just think Inuit or Aboriginal - both living in environments of opposing extremes, surviving just fine for many, many years...
  - _joel 2y ago
    Yex, they adapted over millenia. I don't see what relevance this is to this particular issue though.
    - phendrenad2 2y ago
      Did they really adapt over millennia? There's a lot of relevance if you keep your eyes open.

smeej 2y ago

The other thing that keeps me nice and warm is the stationary bike under my standing desk. I never managed the coordination to walk at my desk, but sitting and riding is easy.

vosper 2y ago
Oh there's more than one of us! I also have a stationary bike under my standing desk. It's a cheap recumbent. It's not amazing in terms of ergonomics, so I use it for about 20-30 mins at a time, a few times a day. I used to walk on a treadmill but I found that my head moved enough that focusing on text could be quite annoying. Also, I'd rather get my steps outside. My head still moves on the bike, but it's much less. Also, this way I can just raise my desk and slide the bike under, whereas with the treadmill I was unplugging and going to another room which was less convenient. I have a TV dinner tray thing with a secondary wireless keyboard and trackball that sits just above my knees so I can work while I pedal. And yes it's great for warming up and staying warm all day!
- smeej 2y ago
  Mine's only semi-recumbent, so I can ride it for hours. I think it was maybe $120 on Amazon. My knees only come up high enough for my thighs to be parallel to the ground, so I can keep the keyboard position nice and low for typing. I've supposedly pedaled over 10,000 miles this year, and I've lost over 40 lbs in the process! Never mind keeping warm in New England! One of the best purchases I've made in a long time!

AStonesThrow 2y ago

"Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for the night. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life!"

mrloop 2y ago

Or even good woolen jumper can make a big difference. Something light so you don’t notice your wearing it but with good insulating properties and you retain a lot more of your own body heat than a cotton or synthetic top.