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America has always tolerated enhanced levels of BS. I remember as a small kid finding US comics at the newsagent that had ads for "x-ray glasses". I thought tha

America has always tolerated enhanced levels of BS. I remember as a small kid finding US comics at the newsagent that had ads for "x-ray glasses". I thought that's amazing, why don't we have those here? We'll we didn't have them because they don't exist and it was illegal to sell stuff that doesn't exist where I lived.

AStonesThrow 2y ago
Here's my hot take: conspiracy theories and outlandish myths are America's version of Old World superstition and folklore. Study any European culture and how it was Christianized, and how the local culture, folklore, and mythology melded with religion to become a unique tapestry. Look at Ireland for a really pronounced example. Look at the folktales and revered fables that came out of those cultures for a synthesis of what rural folk really believed and talked about over dinner, and by the hearth in the evening times after work was done. But the United States has none of that. The New World came of age during the Enlightenment era of reason and rationality. Now we're in a post-Christian society, one rooted in science and empiricism, but we're still yearning for the supernatural, and it's manifesting in unique ways for us. Americans don't have faeries or unicorns or goblins, we've got chemtrails and little green men. Furthermore, as the U.S. and other New World cultures progress, we're making our own mythology and legends. Look at how much of the American Revolution and Civil War is already steeped in pious fairy tales, such as young Washington's cherry tree, Betsy Ross, Paul Revere, or that utterly fictional, feminist chick who supposedly rode horseback like Revere. Personally, I believe that this fake stuff that people believe is one of two things: either there are kernels of truth and allegory to them, that they're masking a deeper truth that's too dangerous to discuss openly or brazenly reveal; or that they're utter distractions and designed to keep people busy and concerned about utterly irrelevant things. Panem et circenses.
- candiddevmike 2y ago
  There is tons of American folklore, and even more if you include native Americans. Hell "witchcraft" was more of prominent in early America than Europe, and fairies/fae like things are littered in native american histories. Conspiracy theories are a 20th century coping mechanism for an oversized, seemingly-omnipotent federal government.
  - vladms 2y ago
    People were indeed afraid of stuff they did not understand and they imagined them to be quite different than what they really were. Like Greeks inventing Zeus as a coping mechanism for the malevolent, all powerful and vengeful nature. Hope it will not be another 2000 years until some of today's inexact beliefs get forgotten.
    - AStonesThrow 2y ago
      No, that is a profoundly ignorant perspective on the truths and pragmatism of ancient wisdom. The pagan religions were not merely created to explain the unexplainable. Pagan myths and legends imparted greater truths and wisdom, they encoded history and science, and they explained psychological human behavior and interactions with nature. These truths were conveyed very precisely, intricately, exactly as they were, from the cultural perspective, but they are nonsensical to you who will always be outsiders to that tribe, space, and time. The ancients, even illiterate peasants and slaves, had a marvelous grasp of metaphor, allegory, and allusions even to the "pop-culture" of their day! Some of us still do! Pagan religion was a unifying force for any tribe or nation. The reason it was supplanted with monotheism was because those tribes were unable to unite, or even interact, trade, and communicate efficiently, while still worshiping multiple pagan gods. Therefore, Abrahamic religions became an even grander unifying force on global scales, while still serving the purposes of those ancient myths and legends. As popular piety and local legend was permitted and absorbed, those monotheistic religions were able to flourish and intertwine with those cultures. To repeat the tired old canard that religion was perpetuated by ignorant benighted dullards, in order to cope or merely survive, is scurrilious, anthropologically ignorant, and shockingly arrogant. The hierarchies and rulers of the ancient world knew exactly what they were doing in every respect. YOU are afraid of spiritualities and the supernatural which you do not understand, and so you denigrate them. Likewise do President Trump and the wisdom of Qanon know what works. Just because they don't think or act the way you expect, doesn't make them stupid or inferior to your atheism/scientim.
      - vladms 2y ago
        So the part where if you don't make an offer to the (priest) of some god it will strike you with thunder was correct, and I am not understanding the hidden meaning? Maybe I was too optimistic with the 2000 years. I never claimed religion did not fulfill sometimes good purposes. But it perpetuated many bad, incorrect beliefs based on fear that slowed progress. For example not doing to your peer something that you don't like yourself seems something positive for society. Going to hell if you try to understand astronomy seems quite negative for society.
ffujdefvjg 2y ago
Well it was obviously an ad for "x-ray glasses," not x-ray glasses.
- candiddevmike 2y ago
  I mean, doesn't that prove the parents point kind of? Americans tolerate/enable a lot of BS. You could argue there are entire industries built around that (most tend to be multilevel marketing).
  - ffujdefvjg 2y ago
    That's what I was getting at
giantg2 2y ago
You can't sell fraudulent things in the US either. The x-ray glasses ads have a clarification in them about not actually using x-rays, but being an optical illusion. I would bet that whatever country you are from probably has some novelty item that requires a cultural understanding or fine print to know what it truly is.
- from-nibly 2y ago
  Sometimes it feels like a literal monkey's paw wouldn't be able to be acused of fraud in the US.
from-nibly 2y ago
It is really frustrating as an American Native (as in I was born here not Native American). Caring about being deceived marks you as a conspiricy theorist. If you get frustrated about "made with real milk" not being precise enough to describe if the milk was used to stir the concoction or if it has any milk in it or if its the only milk like thing in it, then you worry too much. But companies pull that crap all the time. It's because when people do good faith things we don't correct them on their technical loopholes. We don't ask people to cut the loophole off we just presume that they wouldn't use it. I saw an ad today that said $999 desktops and PCs. Most people think it's fine. That ad is deceiving you though. It's trying to make you feel like they are giving you information. They aren't though. I can go on Amazon and buy a computer at nearly every conceivable price. They don't say it's a good PC or even what that might mean. They are just saying the will take $999 from you and a lawyer probably wouldn't go to court about the definition of a computer over it.
- 01HNNWZ0MV43FF 2y ago
  I see this with Oreos "Made with real cocoa" There is no such thing as fake cocoa, that's why. I don't give a shit what's "real" I know I'm eating sugar and palm oil

AStonesThrow 2y ago

Here's my hot take: conspiracy theories and outlandish myths are America's version of Old World superstition and folklore. Study any European culture and how it was Christianized, and how the local culture, folklore, and mythology melded with religion to become a unique tapestry. Look at Ireland for a really pronounced example. Look at the folktales and revered fables that came out of those cultures for a synthesis of what rural folk really believed and talked about over dinner, and by the hearth in the evening times after work was done. But the United States has none of that. The New World came of age during the Enlightenment era of reason and rationality. Now we're in a post-Christian society, one rooted in science and empiricism, but we're still yearning for the supernatural, and it's manifesting in unique ways for us. Americans don't have faeries or unicorns or goblins, we've got chemtrails and little green men. Furthermore, as the U.S. and other New World cultures progress, we're making our own mythology and legends. Look at how much of the American Revolution and Civil War is already steeped in pious fairy tales, such as young Washington's cherry tree, Betsy Ross, Paul Revere, or that utterly fictional, feminist chick who supposedly rode horseback like Revere. Personally, I believe that this fake stuff that people believe is one of two things: either there are kernels of truth and allegory to them, that they're masking a deeper truth that's too dangerous to discuss openly or brazenly reveal; or that they're utter distractions and designed to keep people busy and concerned about utterly irrelevant things. Panem et circenses.

candiddevmike 2y ago
There is tons of American folklore, and even more if you include native Americans. Hell "witchcraft" was more of prominent in early America than Europe, and fairies/fae like things are littered in native american histories. Conspiracy theories are a 20th century coping mechanism for an oversized, seemingly-omnipotent federal government.
- vladms 2y ago
  People were indeed afraid of stuff they did not understand and they imagined them to be quite different than what they really were. Like Greeks inventing Zeus as a coping mechanism for the malevolent, all powerful and vengeful nature. Hope it will not be another 2000 years until some of today's inexact beliefs get forgotten.
  - AStonesThrow 2y ago
    No, that is a profoundly ignorant perspective on the truths and pragmatism of ancient wisdom. The pagan religions were not merely created to explain the unexplainable. Pagan myths and legends imparted greater truths and wisdom, they encoded history and science, and they explained psychological human behavior and interactions with nature. These truths were conveyed very precisely, intricately, exactly as they were, from the cultural perspective, but they are nonsensical to you who will always be outsiders to that tribe, space, and time. The ancients, even illiterate peasants and slaves, had a marvelous grasp of metaphor, allegory, and allusions even to the "pop-culture" of their day! Some of us still do! Pagan religion was a unifying force for any tribe or nation. The reason it was supplanted with monotheism was because those tribes were unable to unite, or even interact, trade, and communicate efficiently, while still worshiping multiple pagan gods. Therefore, Abrahamic religions became an even grander unifying force on global scales, while still serving the purposes of those ancient myths and legends. As popular piety and local legend was permitted and absorbed, those monotheistic religions were able to flourish and intertwine with those cultures. To repeat the tired old canard that religion was perpetuated by ignorant benighted dullards, in order to cope or merely survive, is scurrilious, anthropologically ignorant, and shockingly arrogant. The hierarchies and rulers of the ancient world knew exactly what they were doing in every respect. YOU are afraid of spiritualities and the supernatural which you do not understand, and so you denigrate them. Likewise do President Trump and the wisdom of Qanon know what works. Just because they don't think or act the way you expect, doesn't make them stupid or inferior to your atheism/scientim.
    - vladms 2y ago
      So the part where if you don't make an offer to the (priest) of some god it will strike you with thunder was correct, and I am not understanding the hidden meaning? Maybe I was too optimistic with the 2000 years. I never claimed religion did not fulfill sometimes good purposes. But it perpetuated many bad, incorrect beliefs based on fear that slowed progress. For example not doing to your peer something that you don't like yourself seems something positive for society. Going to hell if you try to understand astronomy seems quite negative for society.

ffujdefvjg 2y ago

Well it was obviously an ad for "x-ray glasses," not x-ray glasses.

candiddevmike 2y ago
I mean, doesn't that prove the parents point kind of? Americans tolerate/enable a lot of BS. You could argue there are entire industries built around that (most tend to be multilevel marketing).
- ffujdefvjg 2y ago
  That's what I was getting at

giantg2 2y ago

You can't sell fraudulent things in the US either. The x-ray glasses ads have a clarification in them about not actually using x-rays, but being an optical illusion. I would bet that whatever country you are from probably has some novelty item that requires a cultural understanding or fine print to know what it truly is.

from-nibly 2y ago
Sometimes it feels like a literal monkey's paw wouldn't be able to be acused of fraud in the US.

from-nibly 2y ago

It is really frustrating as an American Native (as in I was born here not Native American). Caring about being deceived marks you as a conspiricy theorist. If you get frustrated about "made with real milk" not being precise enough to describe if the milk was used to stir the concoction or if it has any milk in it or if its the only milk like thing in it, then you worry too much. But companies pull that crap all the time. It's because when people do good faith things we don't correct them on their technical loopholes. We don't ask people to cut the loophole off we just presume that they wouldn't use it. I saw an ad today that said $999 desktops and PCs. Most people think it's fine. That ad is deceiving you though. It's trying to make you feel like they are giving you information. They aren't though. I can go on Amazon and buy a computer at nearly every conceivable price. They don't say it's a good PC or even what that might mean. They are just saying the will take $999 from you and a lawyer probably wouldn't go to court about the definition of a computer over it.

01HNNWZ0MV43FF 2y ago
I see this with Oreos "Made with real cocoa" There is no such thing as fake cocoa, that's why. I don't give a shit what's "real" I know I'm eating sugar and palm oil