4 ms·

> Well, forecasts says 45% of women 20-44 will be single 2030 From my (cis white mid-30s) male perspective, if this winds up being true then it will be because

> Well, forecasts says 45% of women 20-44 will be single 2030 From my (cis white mid-30s) male perspective, if this winds up being true then it will be because they choose to be single They will lament that they cannot find any good men, but they will be overlooking "good enough" men in thier lives, I guarantee I see this with all of my wife's friends all the time. They are all single and they have insane expectations for what they want out of a man It's a mix of funny and sad because they often will tell her how she's lucky to have found such a great guy, but I wouldn't check even half of their dating requirements And of course men have high standards too. But despite how gender norms have changed, it remains the case that men pursue women and women choose who they date. So it's on men to meet women's standards but also on women to have realistic, reasonable standards. I see women with unreasonable standards all the time.

cjbgkagh 2y ago
Price is set at the margin with fewer females dating the remaining set the price. I think the core part of the problem is that women do not seem to know the actual distribution of men and what should be the expected likelihood of desired attributes. This is most obvious when they sincerely pick attributes which they believe to be the median range but are in fact only in the >90% of men. I think this is the predominant reason why fewer women are at the price setting margin. There is little attention paid to the negative consequences of this overestimation - possibly because few people pay attention to older women who have paid those consequences and older women have no incentive to inform younger women as quite often they are still in competition with them. Trying to educate young women that they really should realistic about their prospects is not going to be popular. In general men appear to already have an accurate estimate of the distribution of attributes. I think the proportion of the difference is demonstrated by the attributes that men and women covet and the difficulty in achieving those attributes. For example losing weight is far easier than growing taler.
- namaria 2y ago
  Women have no obligation to date or pair up. Why is it a problem if a lot of women's standards are too high for the majority of men and they decide to not date? It's well within their right to be single.
  - bluefirebrand 2y ago
    It's well within their right to be single, but don't complain if you want to be in a relationship and "can't find a good man" Men aren't obligated to meet some unreasonable set of standards either For this stuff to work, people need to meet each other in the middle somewhere
  - chongli 2y ago
    It’s not about obligation, it’s about loneliness. That was the start of this whole thread. Women with unrealistic expectations creating the conditions for their own loneliness. I don’t think it’s entirely their fault though, as others in the thread seem to imply. The rise in expectations seems to closely match the rise of mass (and later social) media. Simply put, women and girls are exposed to all kinds of images and stories about attractive and high status men. Along with that we have dating apps that seem to reinforce this illusion of abundance. So then we should not be surprised at all that it’s so common for women to have an unrealistic picture of their prospects.
    - namaria 2y ago
      > Women with unrealistic expectations creating the conditions for their own loneliness. Replace that with 'solitude' and the article pretty much explains why that is a non-issue. Women deciding they are better off alone is not a problem. Accusing them of being unhappy and then purporting to explain why is pretty weird. If there are psychological issues with people being lonely, coming to the conclusion that they should date more and if they can't it's "women's fault" is kinda flabbergasting. The social fabric isn't made of romantic pairs, and that's definitely not women's collective responsibility.
      - chongli 2y ago
        I’m not accusing anyone of being unhappy. I am believing people when they say they are unhappy. Furthermore I said specifically that it’s not women’s fault.
        2y ago
- lizard 2y ago
  Physical attributes are easy to recognize, so if these weigh heavily in your expectations, you can more rapidly estimate the distribution. Being able to do this quickly also means you can break out populations to make more accurate estimates of your current environment; i.e. while the media bombards us with beautiful celebrities, you can maintain an independent estimation of your actual dating pool. Social attributes take more time. You need to spend time with someone to understand where they are, and you would need to spend time with a lot of people to understand the distribution. You can try to use heuristics, like being in a relationship with someone you believe has similar expectations, but as noted those aren't actually very accurate.
stonethrowaway 2y ago
> but I wouldn't check even half of their dating requirements I’ll bite. What do you think is on that list of dating requirements?
orochimaaru 2y ago
I might take another track here as well and add a bit of blame on the overuse of perfumes and deodorant. I think they block actual pheromone sensing intrinsic to us which make said standards have more of a bearing than they should.

cjbgkagh 2y ago

Price is set at the margin with fewer females dating the remaining set the price. I think the core part of the problem is that women do not seem to know the actual distribution of men and what should be the expected likelihood of desired attributes. This is most obvious when they sincerely pick attributes which they believe to be the median range but are in fact only in the >90% of men. I think this is the predominant reason why fewer women are at the price setting margin. There is little attention paid to the negative consequences of this overestimation - possibly because few people pay attention to older women who have paid those consequences and older women have no incentive to inform younger women as quite often they are still in competition with them. Trying to educate young women that they really should realistic about their prospects is not going to be popular. In general men appear to already have an accurate estimate of the distribution of attributes. I think the proportion of the difference is demonstrated by the attributes that men and women covet and the difficulty in achieving those attributes. For example losing weight is far easier than growing taler.

namaria 2y ago
Women have no obligation to date or pair up. Why is it a problem if a lot of women's standards are too high for the majority of men and they decide to not date? It's well within their right to be single.
- bluefirebrand 2y ago
  It's well within their right to be single, but don't complain if you want to be in a relationship and "can't find a good man" Men aren't obligated to meet some unreasonable set of standards either For this stuff to work, people need to meet each other in the middle somewhere
- chongli 2y ago
  It’s not about obligation, it’s about loneliness. That was the start of this whole thread. Women with unrealistic expectations creating the conditions for their own loneliness. I don’t think it’s entirely their fault though, as others in the thread seem to imply. The rise in expectations seems to closely match the rise of mass (and later social) media. Simply put, women and girls are exposed to all kinds of images and stories about attractive and high status men. Along with that we have dating apps that seem to reinforce this illusion of abundance. So then we should not be surprised at all that it’s so common for women to have an unrealistic picture of their prospects.
  - namaria 2y ago
    > Women with unrealistic expectations creating the conditions for their own loneliness. Replace that with 'solitude' and the article pretty much explains why that is a non-issue. Women deciding they are better off alone is not a problem. Accusing them of being unhappy and then purporting to explain why is pretty weird. If there are psychological issues with people being lonely, coming to the conclusion that they should date more and if they can't it's "women's fault" is kinda flabbergasting. The social fabric isn't made of romantic pairs, and that's definitely not women's collective responsibility.
    - chongli 2y ago
      I’m not accusing anyone of being unhappy. I am believing people when they say they are unhappy. Furthermore I said specifically that it’s not women’s fault.
      - 2y ago
lizard 2y ago
Physical attributes are easy to recognize, so if these weigh heavily in your expectations, you can more rapidly estimate the distribution. Being able to do this quickly also means you can break out populations to make more accurate estimates of your current environment; i.e. while the media bombards us with beautiful celebrities, you can maintain an independent estimation of your actual dating pool. Social attributes take more time. You need to spend time with someone to understand where they are, and you would need to spend time with a lot of people to understand the distribution. You can try to use heuristics, like being in a relationship with someone you believe has similar expectations, but as noted those aren't actually very accurate.

stonethrowaway 2y ago

> but I wouldn't check even half of their dating requirements I’ll bite. What do you think is on that list of dating requirements?

orochimaaru 2y ago

I might take another track here as well and add a bit of blame on the overuse of perfumes and deodorant. I think they block actual pheromone sensing intrinsic to us which make said standards have more of a bearing than they should.