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Here I am running a 12 year old Dell PowerEdge with dual Xeons.. I wonder when the first gen Epyc servers will be cheap fodder on eBay.

assusdan 2y ago
IMO, 1st gen Epyc is not any good, given that 2nd gen exists, is more popular and is cheap enough (I actually have epyc 7302 and MZ31-AR0 motherboard as homelab). Too low performance per core and NUMA things, plus worse node (2nd gen compute is 7nm TSMC)
renewiltord 2y ago
Not worth. Get 9654 on eBay for $2k plus $1k for mobo. $7k full system. Or go Epyc 7282 type, and that’s good combo easily available.
ipsum2 2y ago
They already are, and aren't very good.
p1necone 2y ago
1-3rd gen Epycs can be had super cheap, but the motherboards are expensive. Also not worth getting anything less than 3rd gen unless you're primarily buying them for the pcie lanes and ram capacity - a regular current gen consumer CPU with half - a quarter of the core count will outperform them in compute while consuming significantly less power.
- justmarc 2y ago
  Lots of great second hand hardware to be had on ebay. Even last gen used CPUs, as well as RAM, at much less than retail. However when you end up building a server quite often the motherboard + case is the cheap stuff, the CPUs are second in cost and the biggest expense can be the RAM.
- jsheard 2y ago
  When buying used Epycs you have to contend with them possibly being vendor-locked to a specific brand of motherboard as well. https://www.servethehome.com/amd-psb-vendor-locks-epyc-cpus-for-enhanced-security-at-a-cost/ https://www.servethehome.com/amd-psb-vendor-locks-epyc-cpus-...
  - sph 2y ago
    They sell this vendor lock-in "feature" as enhanced security?
    - Uvix 2y ago
      Yes. It keeps the board from booting if the firmware is replaced with a version not signed by the board manufacturer (i.e. so an attacker can’t replace it with a version that does nefarious things). Preventing CPU reuse in other boards is just an (unintentional?) side effect.
      - kjs3 2y ago
        The cynic would say the security implications are the side effect, since selling more, new chips is the goal.
        Uvix 2y ago
        If that was the goal then the CPU would fuse on first boot for any manufacturer’s board, rather than being fused only by Dell boards.
- Tuna-Fish 2y ago
  The reason for this is that CPU upgrades on the same board were/are very viable on SP3. Doing that on Intel platforms just wasn't done for basically ever, it was never worth it. But upgrade to Milan from Naples or Rome is very appealing. So SP3 CPUs are much more common used than the boards, simply because more of them were made. This is probably very bad for hobbyists, the boards are not going to get cheap until the entire platform is obsolete.
swarnie 2y ago
Unsure about the Epyc chips but Ryzen 5 series kit was being given away on Amazon in the week... I snagged a 9 5950X for £242
- kombine 2y ago
  Thanks for pointing out, it's still up there for £253 - I might consider upgrading my 8 core 5800X3D.
  - smolder 2y ago
    Whether that's an upgrade depends on your use case, as the X3D has more cache.
    - kombine 2y ago
      I don't play games so the X3D's cache doesn't really benefit me. 5950X should speed up compilation, but then, I mostly do Python at the moment :)
      - smolder 2y ago
        You might be surprised at what benefits from the big cache outside of games but that is certainly one of the main selling points. :)
taneq 2y ago
Haha same, and it’s perfectly capable of anything a smallish company would need for general on-prem hosting.

assusdan 2y ago

IMO, 1st gen Epyc is not any good, given that 2nd gen exists, is more popular and is cheap enough (I actually have epyc 7302 and MZ31-AR0 motherboard as homelab). Too low performance per core and NUMA things, plus worse node (2nd gen compute is 7nm TSMC)

renewiltord 2y ago

Not worth. Get 9654 on eBay for $2k plus $1k for mobo. $7k full system. Or go Epyc 7282 type, and that’s good combo easily available.

ipsum2 2y ago

They already are, and aren't very good.

p1necone 2y ago

1-3rd gen Epycs can be had super cheap, but the motherboards are expensive. Also not worth getting anything less than 3rd gen unless you're primarily buying them for the pcie lanes and ram capacity - a regular current gen consumer CPU with half - a quarter of the core count will outperform them in compute while consuming significantly less power.

justmarc 2y ago
Lots of great second hand hardware to be had on ebay. Even last gen used CPUs, as well as RAM, at much less than retail. However when you end up building a server quite often the motherboard + case is the cheap stuff, the CPUs are second in cost and the biggest expense can be the RAM.
jsheard 2y ago
When buying used Epycs you have to contend with them possibly being vendor-locked to a specific brand of motherboard as well. https://www.servethehome.com/amd-psb-vendor-locks-epyc-cpus-for-enhanced-security-at-a-cost/ https://www.servethehome.com/amd-psb-vendor-locks-epyc-cpus-...
- sph 2y ago
  They sell this vendor lock-in "feature" as enhanced security?
  - Uvix 2y ago
    Yes. It keeps the board from booting if the firmware is replaced with a version not signed by the board manufacturer (i.e. so an attacker can’t replace it with a version that does nefarious things). Preventing CPU reuse in other boards is just an (unintentional?) side effect.
    - kjs3 2y ago
      The cynic would say the security implications are the side effect, since selling more, new chips is the goal.
      - Uvix 2y ago
        If that was the goal then the CPU would fuse on first boot for any manufacturer’s board, rather than being fused only by Dell boards.
Tuna-Fish 2y ago
The reason for this is that CPU upgrades on the same board were/are very viable on SP3. Doing that on Intel platforms just wasn't done for basically ever, it was never worth it. But upgrade to Milan from Naples or Rome is very appealing. So SP3 CPUs are much more common used than the boards, simply because more of them were made. This is probably very bad for hobbyists, the boards are not going to get cheap until the entire platform is obsolete.

swarnie 2y ago

Unsure about the Epyc chips but Ryzen 5 series kit was being given away on Amazon in the week... I snagged a 9 5950X for £242

kombine 2y ago
Thanks for pointing out, it's still up there for £253 - I might consider upgrading my 8 core 5800X3D.
- smolder 2y ago
  Whether that's an upgrade depends on your use case, as the X3D has more cache.
  - kombine 2y ago
    I don't play games so the X3D's cache doesn't really benefit me. 5950X should speed up compilation, but then, I mostly do Python at the moment :)
    - smolder 2y ago
      You might be surprised at what benefits from the big cache outside of games but that is certainly one of the main selling points. :)

taneq 2y ago

Haha same, and it’s perfectly capable of anything a smallish company would need for general on-prem hosting.