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Hilarious to see all the people lamenting the break-up of AT&T. That break-up sparked the long distance phone race, which became the driving force for the massi

Hilarious to see all the people lamenting the break-up of AT&T. That break-up sparked the long distance phone race, which became the driving force for the massive laying of fiber optics... which enabled the Internet boom of the 1990s.

CSMastermind 2y ago
My understanding was that most of the internet infrastructure was laid by Bell before their break-up because they projected video calling being a huge use case in the future.
- floxy 2y ago
  1982 seem a bit early for the massive fiber rollout. My recollection was that Sprint was the driving factor for laying fiber, since they had the railroad right-of-ways. But that was quite a while back. Maybe there was also another dark-horse company laying fiber along railroads, but not operating as a phone company? Something not quite at the tip of my tongue. Seems like someone could have written a good history book about internet infrastructure, especially the mid-to-late 90s. Anyone have suggestions?
  - inheritedwisdom 2y ago
    I’d read that…I’d love to hear an Acquired podcast on the path of Long Distance Discount Services -> WorldCom -> MCI -> Verizon. They laid down a lot of fiber.
  - relistan 2y ago
    Sprint is the de-acronymized name for SPRINT: Southern Pacific Railroad Internal Networking Telephony They started doing public long distance on their own (railroad) network in the 1970s. They were restrained (and frequently sued by) AT&T. The breakup opened the floodgates. They were sold like a half dozen times in the 80s. But, MCI was AFAIK the largest early fiber pioneer.
    - floxy 2y ago
      Ah, yes, MCI. Thanks.
  - CSMastermind 2y ago
    The place that I heard about Bell Labs was: The Idea Factory: Bell Labs and the Great Age of American Innovation by Jon Gertner I did a search for books about building the internet infrastructure and it turned up some other recommendations but I haven't read them so can't vouch for quality or content: Network Geeks: How They Built the Internet by Brian E Carpenter The Master Switch: The Rise and Fall of Information Empires by Tim Wu Tubes: A Journey to the Center of the Internet by Andrew Blum How the Internet Happened: From Netscape to the iPhone by Brian McCullough Maybe someone else here has read them and can comment.
nickff 2y ago
AT&T had also been granted a long-term monopoly on long-distance telephony by the federal government; Google has never had such protection.
- relistan 2y ago
  A monopoly is a monopoly no matter how it got that way.
bityard 2y ago
Breaking up AT&T was unquestionably the right call. (So to say.) Long distance was expensive for quite a while even after the break-up. If you called up an out-of-state friend or relative to catch up, you expected the call to cost you at least a few bucks. (And you hoped they would be the ones to call you next time.) Even into the 90's, long distance at $0.10/minute was considered cheap. And in most rural areas, everywhere past a mile or so out of town was long distance. I remember buying long-distance calling cards to bring our phone costs down. For about 5 years, it was cheaper to just get a local-only phone line and then buy your long-distance as phone cards. Each card came with a certain number of minutes pre-loaded. You'd dial the 1-800 number on the back, scratch off your PIN, enter it, and then you'd dial your destination number. Other than the hassle of buying and using the card, the major downside was that your own number didn't (usually) show up on the caller ID. They were also good if you stayed in hotels a lot, since hotels would charge upward of usurious amounts for both local and long-distance calls but they would typically allow toll-free calls to go through without charge.
- someluccc 2y ago
  This illustrates why breaking up google is a good idea given their egregious charges (free) for things people used to/still spend money on, such as: - An office software suite - Global maps and GPS, City Guides - Video entertainment - Mobile and Desktop OS - Web Browsers Also, pay no mind to their competitors in all of those markets AND in their core business of search, being feeble multi-trillion and multi-billion global corporations
  - zuminator 2y ago
    Those things aren't free, they're supported by ad revenue and the sale of personal or aggregated user information. I'm not saying there isn't a place for that type of software, but imo it's wrong and somewhat dangerous to equate that with things that are actually free. And even so, to the extent that any of Google's software is actually free, it's mostly a loss leader for the sake of vendor lock-in, which is intrinsically anticompetitive.
    - 2y ago
tightbookkeeper 2y ago
That’s a complicated chain of cause and effect to claim so casually.
- relistan 2y ago
  Feel free to read up on it. Start with the histories of MCI and Sprint, then NSFNet, etc
  - tightbookkeeper 2y ago
    I don’t need to know all of those histories are filled with debate and nuance and it’s not clear what would have happened in a counterfactual. You’re repeating someones posthoc thesis as obvious fact. It’s probably a good point to share. Let’s just have a little more skepticism and openness to other analysis.
timeon 2y ago
> which enabled the Internet boom Now this gives me reason lamenting the break-up of AT&T.
z3ncyberpunk 2y ago
The fiber optics that were paid to be delivered to every home and never delivered upon and the money pocketed? Yeah.

CSMastermind 2y ago

My understanding was that most of the internet infrastructure was laid by Bell before their break-up because they projected video calling being a huge use case in the future.

floxy 2y ago
1982 seem a bit early for the massive fiber rollout. My recollection was that Sprint was the driving factor for laying fiber, since they had the railroad right-of-ways. But that was quite a while back. Maybe there was also another dark-horse company laying fiber along railroads, but not operating as a phone company? Something not quite at the tip of my tongue. Seems like someone could have written a good history book about internet infrastructure, especially the mid-to-late 90s. Anyone have suggestions?
- inheritedwisdom 2y ago
  I’d read that…I’d love to hear an Acquired podcast on the path of Long Distance Discount Services -> WorldCom -> MCI -> Verizon. They laid down a lot of fiber.
- relistan 2y ago
  Sprint is the de-acronymized name for SPRINT: Southern Pacific Railroad Internal Networking Telephony They started doing public long distance on their own (railroad) network in the 1970s. They were restrained (and frequently sued by) AT&T. The breakup opened the floodgates. They were sold like a half dozen times in the 80s. But, MCI was AFAIK the largest early fiber pioneer.
  - floxy 2y ago
    Ah, yes, MCI. Thanks.
- CSMastermind 2y ago
  The place that I heard about Bell Labs was: The Idea Factory: Bell Labs and the Great Age of American Innovation by Jon Gertner I did a search for books about building the internet infrastructure and it turned up some other recommendations but I haven't read them so can't vouch for quality or content: Network Geeks: How They Built the Internet by Brian E Carpenter The Master Switch: The Rise and Fall of Information Empires by Tim Wu Tubes: A Journey to the Center of the Internet by Andrew Blum How the Internet Happened: From Netscape to the iPhone by Brian McCullough Maybe someone else here has read them and can comment.

nickff 2y ago

AT&T had also been granted a long-term monopoly on long-distance telephony by the federal government; Google has never had such protection.

relistan 2y ago
A monopoly is a monopoly no matter how it got that way.

bityard 2y ago

Breaking up AT&T was unquestionably the right call. (So to say.) Long distance was expensive for quite a while even after the break-up. If you called up an out-of-state friend or relative to catch up, you expected the call to cost you at least a few bucks. (And you hoped they would be the ones to call you next time.) Even into the 90's, long distance at $0.10/minute was considered cheap. And in most rural areas, everywhere past a mile or so out of town was long distance. I remember buying long-distance calling cards to bring our phone costs down. For about 5 years, it was cheaper to just get a local-only phone line and then buy your long-distance as phone cards. Each card came with a certain number of minutes pre-loaded. You'd dial the 1-800 number on the back, scratch off your PIN, enter it, and then you'd dial your destination number. Other than the hassle of buying and using the card, the major downside was that your own number didn't (usually) show up on the caller ID. They were also good if you stayed in hotels a lot, since hotels would charge upward of usurious amounts for both local and long-distance calls but they would typically allow toll-free calls to go through without charge.

someluccc 2y ago
This illustrates why breaking up google is a good idea given their egregious charges (free) for things people used to/still spend money on, such as: - An office software suite - Global maps and GPS, City Guides - Video entertainment - Mobile and Desktop OS - Web Browsers Also, pay no mind to their competitors in all of those markets AND in their core business of search, being feeble multi-trillion and multi-billion global corporations
- zuminator 2y ago
  Those things aren't free, they're supported by ad revenue and the sale of personal or aggregated user information. I'm not saying there isn't a place for that type of software, but imo it's wrong and somewhat dangerous to equate that with things that are actually free. And even so, to the extent that any of Google's software is actually free, it's mostly a loss leader for the sake of vendor lock-in, which is intrinsically anticompetitive.
  - 2y ago

tightbookkeeper 2y ago

That’s a complicated chain of cause and effect to claim so casually.

relistan 2y ago
Feel free to read up on it. Start with the histories of MCI and Sprint, then NSFNet, etc
- tightbookkeeper 2y ago
  I don’t need to know all of those histories are filled with debate and nuance and it’s not clear what would have happened in a counterfactual. You’re repeating someones posthoc thesis as obvious fact. It’s probably a good point to share. Let’s just have a little more skepticism and openness to other analysis.

timeon 2y ago

> which enabled the Internet boom Now this gives me reason lamenting the break-up of AT&T.

z3ncyberpunk 2y ago

The fiber optics that were paid to be delivered to every home and never delivered upon and the money pocketed? Yeah.