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There was a time when "Black" was considered offensive and "African-American" was the generally-approved nomenclature. You seem to be implying that the "-Americ

There was a time when "Black" was considered offensive and "African-American" was the generally-approved nomenclature. You seem to be implying that the "-American" pattern emerged as some sort of white conspiracy to paint everyone else as less American, but my understanding is that the opposite is true. Language and social preferences evolve over time, and that one has simply come and gone as the "correct" option of the day. As a generally "white" person (of roughly western European descent), I will happily use any set of labels that keeps people from glaring at me. I feel pretty strongly that unpleasant language is a symptom of prejudice, not a cause. If changing words could change hearts and minds, I think we would have seen it happen by now.

JohnMakin 2y ago
> There was a time when "Black" was considered offensive and "African-American" was the generally-approved nomenclature. Eh, this is a little inaccurate - I don't think anyone but white people worked themselves up about this, and the distinction between "black" and "african american" was made because Americans with slave ancestry are not the only people who have dark skin color. It's also still in use and hasn't gone anywhere. AFAIK you've always been able to refer to a black person as black without offense, but of course, people have used that as a mild slur or with insulting connotations.
- Izkata 2y ago
  Whether or not it was mainly white people who did this, I do remember when I was a kid (late 90s/early 2000s) there was a hard push to just swap "black" for "African-American" no matter how little sense it made, because "black" was considered offensive. It's how we got one particular addition to the "ignorant American" meme videos, where people would go on vacation to Europe or Africa and call a black person born and living there "African-American". It's also why Elon Musk generally isn't considered African-American, even though he has a better claim to the label than most.
  - JohnMakin 2y ago
    These narratives were not driven by black people. I know what you are referring to. It was never considered an offensive term by anyone who had any stake in it, it was purely contrived and performative nonsense for being “aware” when it was signaling only that they absolutely were not. Just my 2c as a PoC
    - adastra22 2y ago
      Same goes for Indian vs Native American, which this thread started off with. Few Indians are offended by the phrase “Native American”, but it is cumbersome and not used to describe themselves. They’re perfectly fine with the term “Indian” and prefer it, even if it is etymologically wrong (sorry to the South Asians out there). It’s an outsider combining in and saying “no, people can’t call you black” [or “Indian”] that is weirdly controlling and oppressive.
      - graemep 2y ago
        I wondered about how the majority of people belonging to those two groups felt about it. I am quite surprised that "Indian" is still acceptable in a country as sensitive about vocabulary as the US - its very much a colonial term. Then again "America" is, if named after Vespucci, is named after a slave owner and trader which does not seem to bother anyone (which is odd in an age when other things are being renamed). I prefer "Native American" because, as British Sri Lankan (lived in both countries) Indian just has a different meaning to me. > It’s an outsider combining in and saying “no, people can’t call you black” [or “Indian”] that is weirdly controlling and oppressive. Yes, and we have that problem in the UK too. I find it very amusing that South Asians (particularly those actually in South Asia who are not much subject to western influence) will use phrases about themselves (e.g. "coloured") that would shock westerners. We are also getting a lot more policing of language in the UK. It is actually quite oppressive, and disadvantages recent immigrants (and people from the wrong background) who do not know the right vocabulary.
        adastra22 2y ago
kitd 2y ago
> There was a time when "Black" was considered offensive and "African-American" was the generally-approved nomenclature. This culminated in an epic television moment when an American interviewer asked Kris Akabusi, a black British 400m runner, what his victory meant "as a British African-American".

JohnMakin 2y ago

> There was a time when "Black" was considered offensive and "African-American" was the generally-approved nomenclature. Eh, this is a little inaccurate - I don't think anyone but white people worked themselves up about this, and the distinction between "black" and "african american" was made because Americans with slave ancestry are not the only people who have dark skin color. It's also still in use and hasn't gone anywhere. AFAIK you've always been able to refer to a black person as black without offense, but of course, people have used that as a mild slur or with insulting connotations.

Izkata 2y ago
Whether or not it was mainly white people who did this, I do remember when I was a kid (late 90s/early 2000s) there was a hard push to just swap "black" for "African-American" no matter how little sense it made, because "black" was considered offensive. It's how we got one particular addition to the "ignorant American" meme videos, where people would go on vacation to Europe or Africa and call a black person born and living there "African-American". It's also why Elon Musk generally isn't considered African-American, even though he has a better claim to the label than most.
- JohnMakin 2y ago
  These narratives were not driven by black people. I know what you are referring to. It was never considered an offensive term by anyone who had any stake in it, it was purely contrived and performative nonsense for being “aware” when it was signaling only that they absolutely were not. Just my 2c as a PoC
  - adastra22 2y ago
    Same goes for Indian vs Native American, which this thread started off with. Few Indians are offended by the phrase “Native American”, but it is cumbersome and not used to describe themselves. They’re perfectly fine with the term “Indian” and prefer it, even if it is etymologically wrong (sorry to the South Asians out there). It’s an outsider combining in and saying “no, people can’t call you black” [or “Indian”] that is weirdly controlling and oppressive.
    - graemep 2y ago
      I wondered about how the majority of people belonging to those two groups felt about it. I am quite surprised that "Indian" is still acceptable in a country as sensitive about vocabulary as the US - its very much a colonial term. Then again "America" is, if named after Vespucci, is named after a slave owner and trader which does not seem to bother anyone (which is odd in an age when other things are being renamed). I prefer "Native American" because, as British Sri Lankan (lived in both countries) Indian just has a different meaning to me. > It’s an outsider combining in and saying “no, people can’t call you black” [or “Indian”] that is weirdly controlling and oppressive. Yes, and we have that problem in the UK too. I find it very amusing that South Asians (particularly those actually in South Asia who are not much subject to western influence) will use phrases about themselves (e.g. "coloured") that would shock westerners. We are also getting a lot more policing of language in the UK. It is actually quite oppressive, and disadvantages recent immigrants (and people from the wrong background) who do not know the right vocabulary.
      - adastra22 2y ago

kitd 2y ago

> There was a time when "Black" was considered offensive and "African-American" was the generally-approved nomenclature. This culminated in an epic television moment when an American interviewer asked Kris Akabusi, a black British 400m runner, what his victory meant "as a British African-American".