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We just recently discovered, that during childbrith, vaginal microbiota is transferred to the child and this transfer is quite beneficial for the development of
by WA 2y ago
We just recently discovered, that during childbrith, vaginal microbiota is transferred to the child and this transfer is quite beneficial for the development of the immune system of the child. It's called vaginal microbiota transfer (VMT). It's so beneficial that babies being born via c-section are now artificially covered in their mother's vaginal microbiota.
Now imagine the thousands of factors that happen during pregnancy that probably influence the neurodevelopment of a human and which artifical womb doesn't take into account. Simple things such as: hearing and feeling the heartbeat of the mother, feeling the environment, heat, cold, being carried through life and so on.
- chromanoid 2y agoI totally agree. Even "mere" breast feeding is still full of mysteries that developed during the millions of years of mammal evolution.
- jes5199 2y agosure, but take a survey of any group of five year olds - can you tell which ones were born by c-section? which ones were breastfed?
- micromacrofoot 2y agoyes but you can measure various effects on the macro scale, which is why we think breast feeding is a little more beneficial than formula
- schwartzworld 2y agoIt’s problematic in some ways. Many new mothers torture themselves unnecessarily about nursing vs formula because they want the best for their baby. The benefits of nursing are real, and if you can do it, great. But if you don’t have the time, biology or even just inclination to breastfeed, your baby will be fine. There’s no evidence that says formula is detrimental, especially compared to not eating enough at all.
- micromacrofoot 2y agoyes, always a risk... it's one way science reporting fails people I feel, they don't really explain the scale
- m463 2y agoApart from the nutrients from breastfeeding, I recall that it is part of an immune system feedback loop. If the child is fighting off something, it is transferred to the nipple during breastfeeding. The mother's immune system develops a response and provides help to the child in the breast milk next feeding.
- xvilka 2y agoInteresting. Do you have a source for that?
- api_or_ipa 2y agoBabbage podcast from the Economist had a great episode recently on it. https://open.spotify.com/episode/2LCTSD4k9bNDn6i8DzLv9r?si=D-hdkLR1S6ij_wfJjHaAeg https://open.spotify.com/episode/2LCTSD4k9bNDn6i8DzLv9r?si=D...
- Nashooo 2y agoI'm sorry to be direct but I mean this in the best and most genuine way possible: how is a podcast a source?
- tsimionescu 2y agoLaypeople are much more likely to learn something useful and solid from a good podcast on a topic, run by someone (or with a guest) who has read the literature broadly and can distinguish solid papers from publish-or-perish drivel. Doing your own research, unless you dedicate an inordinate amount of time or energy to it, is very likely to lead you completely astray.
- hombre_fatal 2y agoWell, they provided something and it’s from a reputable publication. You can wait around for more people to chime in or you can dig in yourself until then. We are in casual conversation here.
- 2y ago
- jancsika 2y ago> thousands of factors But this includes risk factors, too. E.g., IIRC there's research into how certain stressors on the mother during pregnancy increase the likelihood of things like anxiety and depression for their offspring.
- pazimzadeh 2y agoI agree with you, there’s probably a lot of epigenetic activity going on in response to environmental factors. On the other hand, these things can probably be studied and identified. There is an organ shortage for transplantation, which historically peaks in times of peace. One idea is to genetically modify animals to make them more immunologically compatible. I could see a world where being able to control every aspect of the development process allows for more suitable organs (less risk of infection, etc).
- jncfhnb 2y ago> There is an organ shortage for transplantation, which historically peaks in times of peace. That sounds unlikely to be true. I’m curious where you’re getting that from?
- pazimzadeh 2y agosorry I don't remember the source. not super critical to the argument though
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- makeitdouble 2y agoLike the vast majority of medical research, this aims at solving problematic cases where intervening reduces critical risks. The stated case for this is premature birth, were the choice is between an artificial womb, the traditional setting, or letting the newborn die.
- BizarroLand 2y agoI suppose another alternative use would be for trans people and women born without uteri to have biological children.
- renewiltord 2y agoThis is one of the reasons I am not an organ donor. Think of all the specific things that a body has for a kidney. Should it be taken out, experience completely different conditions, and then be placed into an entirely different body that wasn’t grown around it organically? This could have horrific consequences for the recipient and I cannot, in good conscience, participate. It is unethical.
- MailleQuiMaille 2y ago>This could have horrific consequences for the recipient Like, he could live ? The point you are trying to make is unclear.
- Tagbert 2y agoYes, the consequences of not getting a kidney transplant for someone with kidney failure is a painful death. The transplant is a much better alternative even if it isn’t ideal. Preferring to offer death rather than your straw-man argument is probably more unethical.
- sojournerc 2y agoMy father received a heart transplant that gave him many years of extended life. please reconsider being a donor. Something, even if it's not perfect, is better than nothing.
- triceratops 2y agoLet me ease your conscience. If you become an organ donor it's not your decision whether any of your organs are actually transplanted. And you'd be dead. So you wouldn't be participating. (Make absurd statements, get absurd replies)
- renewiltord 2y agoHaha, a defence of suicide bombing is not what I expected.
- wholinator2 2y ago
- rysertio 2y agoStill better than a preterm baby dying.
- lagpot 2y agoYes, I think people who haven't studied this at all have a very naive view of the end-to-end complexities of pregnancy. It's currently very infeasible to simulate this environment, we don't have the knowledge or the technology, or even a path of how to get there. What's more likely to come first is artificially created sperm, from a sample of any cells - first by converting them to stem cells, then differentiating those to sperm-producing cells. It's already been trialed in the lab. I expect it's only a matter of time before this becomes a widely available reproductive technology, like IVF is now. Perhaps a few decades, if that. The most interesting thing about this is it can be done with female cells to make "female sperm", both in the sense that it comes from a female individual and that every sperm cell will be X chromosomed (thus producing only daughters). At that point, men will be effectively obsolete, and will gradually diminish in population, as each successive generation will be skewed more towards female. It will be interesting to see how society adapts to being female-centered instead of male-dominated.
- xattt 2y ago> It will be interesting to see how society adapts to being female-centered instead of male-dominated. See Nursing for the dynamics of a female-dominated world. As a cis-male who was able to pierce into this space, it has its moments. There’s a lot of clique-ines, eating of the young and crabs-in-a-bucket mentality. I don’t know if this is because Nursing is historically subservient to medicine, and horizontal trauma is a manifestation of being unable to act out on higher ranking members of the hierarchy. Also, career stagnation - many nurses are lifers in one clinical area and are secretly unsatisfied. Fortunately, there is hope in pockets of the profession, typically in more cognitively-demanding areas with more “ownership” of patients (intensive care, NPs in primary care). However, it’s hard to transfer culture between clinical areas, as the ones who are capable have already left toxic areas. The ones that don’t leave are the ones on power trips and don’t want to lose their little fiefdom.
- mensetmanusman 2y agoYeah the language they learn pre-birth is also a fascinating topic.