4 ms·

Apparently I'm sticking my neck out here, but it really doesn't seem that hard. Overhead, I can intuit the path I would take, and if I imagine it first-person,

Apparently I'm sticking my neck out here, but it really doesn't seem that hard. Overhead, I can intuit the path I would take, and if I imagine it first-person, it seems even more obvious. It's frustrating riding with certain other American drivers in other countries. I've met numerous folks now that seem upset that they have to actually pay attention to their driving and the traffic. Meanwhile I'm horrified that they're apparently just ... completely on auto-pilot in the US.

509engr 2y ago
No, you're definitely not the only one who likes them. Some folks complain about them when they first go in, but they tend to figure it out. WSDOT has been encouraging them for a few years now, and my town has several new roundabouts as a result -- and lots of other cities across the state are using them. They've made navigating those intersections way easier, reduced traffic "waiting times", and generally improved safety versus a lighted intersection. I'm glad they're continuing to find ways to make them work. It seemed when I was growing up in NJ, the state DOT was taking out the giant roundabouts that they were famous for, and now in Washington, they're having a huge resurgence.
- bobthepanda 2y ago
  Huge roundabouts are very dangerous; the safety factor in the modern ones WA installs is that they are tight and slow, which reduces the severity of any crashes. It also does not help that NJ is the only state in the US that does not have a consistent rule about roundabout traffic priority.
- themadturk 2y ago
  I agree, Washington does seem to at least aspire to better roundabouts than some places I've heard of. The one rule I see to be truly necessary is "yield to oncoming traffic from the left." I still get confused at the big roundabout in Kent, after coming off Highway 167 at Willis Street, but most others I've encountered are fine, despite the drivers who still want to stop before proceeding onto them even when there's no other traffic.
Dalewyn 2y ago
I'll take a traditional cross with traffic signals or stop signs on all sides, it's simple and effective. Roundabouts are a waste of space, disrupt traffic, and take more brain processing than I care to afford if I can help it. This particular example isn't even round.
- googledocsftw 2y ago
  How is a roundabout more disruptive than a 4 way junction with stop signs. In terms of brain processing, you get used to it and it becomes second nature. It is a skill.
  - Terr_ 2y ago
    Agreed, with the condition that there is only one lane. Ones with multiple layers stress me out, there are more ways to screw up and more demands on your defensive-driving attention.
    - 8n4vidtmkvmk 2y ago
      I think the problem is not that they're impossible to figure out but you have about 2 seconds from when you see the sign to when you're entering the double roundabout.
      - labster 2y ago
        That’s a very solvable problem of bad signage.
    - googledocsftw 2y ago
      Yes. If there are 2 it should be a "dog bone" with a long straight bit so you have time to adjust. Like: | | =O============O=
  - ProllyInfamous 2y ago
    We have back-to-back round-a-bouts in Chattanooga (153 / Lake Resort / Access) which have two loops (concentric inner & outer round-a-bouts)... that can be quite confusing for anybody unfamiliar with the local pattern.
al_borland 2y ago
I'm ok with most roundabouts. However, there is one near me that everyone complains about. There are 3 of them right in a row, but even that isn't the main issue. There is one with 5 places to turn out, which is relatively small and confusing. If you get it wrong it dumps you out on the expressway and it's an almost 9 mile trip to get back to where you originally wanted to go with no other option than to drive the 9 miles. I have yet to talk to a single person who hasn't made this mistake at least once. A little "oops" road to connect the expressway on-ramp with the road people intended to take would go along way and save hundreds, if not thousands, of wasted miles each year. Many people avoid the area completely because they don't want to deal with it.
- tempestn 2y ago
  Yeah, roundabouts certainly have the potential to be superior, but they're not immune to bad design!
- netsharc 2y ago
  Don't the exits have signs to say where the exit takes you? In Europe they'd be labeled, and highway onramps will have a different background color to indicate a highway.. Also, keeping your navigation display "north up" is much better than having one that will probably be laggy in a roundabout, confusing you on which exit to take. If all else fails, look at the signage; I remember driving and a passenger not sure if the roundabout exit I was taking was correct, I said "Well there's a big sign there that says this way to our destination."
  - al_borland 2y ago
    I think part of the issue is that it’s multi-lane. So if you’re in the right-lane to go to one road, and miss it, staying in the right-lane forces you onto the highway. If there is a car in the left lane you can’t get over to avoid it without causing an accident, or stopping, which would backup the whole circle and also risk accidents. So you end up paying the 9 mile tax. There is no way to miss your turn and easily recover.
    - 2y ago
bigstrat2003 2y ago
I genuinely cannot read that roundabout from overhead, and I am not a person who has trouble with roundabouts. I think it would benefit greatly from an explanatory diagram. I do hope that it would be more obvious while on the ground, like you said.
- zlsa 2y ago
  Unfortunately, it's not. Driving from right-to-left (in the first picture) requires drivers to enter the roundabout twice, then leave once. Judging by the amount of vehicle debris generally present and the additional "Yield" markings and signage that have been added to the second yield point since the construction was completed, it's been confusing from the ground as well.
- bee_rider 2y ago
  Based on the description it is some odd design to accommodate farm equipment. It seems a bit odd.

509engr 2y ago

No, you're definitely not the only one who likes them. Some folks complain about them when they first go in, but they tend to figure it out. WSDOT has been encouraging them for a few years now, and my town has several new roundabouts as a result -- and lots of other cities across the state are using them. They've made navigating those intersections way easier, reduced traffic "waiting times", and generally improved safety versus a lighted intersection. I'm glad they're continuing to find ways to make them work. It seemed when I was growing up in NJ, the state DOT was taking out the giant roundabouts that they were famous for, and now in Washington, they're having a huge resurgence.

bobthepanda 2y ago
Huge roundabouts are very dangerous; the safety factor in the modern ones WA installs is that they are tight and slow, which reduces the severity of any crashes. It also does not help that NJ is the only state in the US that does not have a consistent rule about roundabout traffic priority.
themadturk 2y ago
I agree, Washington does seem to at least aspire to better roundabouts than some places I've heard of. The one rule I see to be truly necessary is "yield to oncoming traffic from the left." I still get confused at the big roundabout in Kent, after coming off Highway 167 at Willis Street, but most others I've encountered are fine, despite the drivers who still want to stop before proceeding onto them even when there's no other traffic.

Dalewyn 2y ago

I'll take a traditional cross with traffic signals or stop signs on all sides, it's simple and effective. Roundabouts are a waste of space, disrupt traffic, and take more brain processing than I care to afford if I can help it. This particular example isn't even round.

googledocsftw 2y ago
How is a roundabout more disruptive than a 4 way junction with stop signs. In terms of brain processing, you get used to it and it becomes second nature. It is a skill.
- Terr_ 2y ago
  Agreed, with the condition that there is only one lane. Ones with multiple layers stress me out, there are more ways to screw up and more demands on your defensive-driving attention.
  - 8n4vidtmkvmk 2y ago
    I think the problem is not that they're impossible to figure out but you have about 2 seconds from when you see the sign to when you're entering the double roundabout.
    - labster 2y ago
      That’s a very solvable problem of bad signage.
  - googledocsftw 2y ago
    Yes. If there are 2 it should be a "dog bone" with a long straight bit so you have time to adjust. Like: | | =O============O=
- ProllyInfamous 2y ago
  We have back-to-back round-a-bouts in Chattanooga (153 / Lake Resort / Access) which have two loops (concentric inner & outer round-a-bouts)... that can be quite confusing for anybody unfamiliar with the local pattern.

al_borland 2y ago

I'm ok with most roundabouts. However, there is one near me that everyone complains about. There are 3 of them right in a row, but even that isn't the main issue. There is one with 5 places to turn out, which is relatively small and confusing. If you get it wrong it dumps you out on the expressway and it's an almost 9 mile trip to get back to where you originally wanted to go with no other option than to drive the 9 miles. I have yet to talk to a single person who hasn't made this mistake at least once. A little "oops" road to connect the expressway on-ramp with the road people intended to take would go along way and save hundreds, if not thousands, of wasted miles each year. Many people avoid the area completely because they don't want to deal with it.

tempestn 2y ago
Yeah, roundabouts certainly have the potential to be superior, but they're not immune to bad design!
netsharc 2y ago
Don't the exits have signs to say where the exit takes you? In Europe they'd be labeled, and highway onramps will have a different background color to indicate a highway.. Also, keeping your navigation display "north up" is much better than having one that will probably be laggy in a roundabout, confusing you on which exit to take. If all else fails, look at the signage; I remember driving and a passenger not sure if the roundabout exit I was taking was correct, I said "Well there's a big sign there that says this way to our destination."
- al_borland 2y ago
  I think part of the issue is that it’s multi-lane. So if you’re in the right-lane to go to one road, and miss it, staying in the right-lane forces you onto the highway. If there is a car in the left lane you can’t get over to avoid it without causing an accident, or stopping, which would backup the whole circle and also risk accidents. So you end up paying the 9 mile tax. There is no way to miss your turn and easily recover.
  - 2y ago

bigstrat2003 2y ago

I genuinely cannot read that roundabout from overhead, and I am not a person who has trouble with roundabouts. I think it would benefit greatly from an explanatory diagram. I do hope that it would be more obvious while on the ground, like you said.

zlsa 2y ago
Unfortunately, it's not. Driving from right-to-left (in the first picture) requires drivers to enter the roundabout twice, then leave once. Judging by the amount of vehicle debris generally present and the additional "Yield" markings and signage that have been added to the second yield point since the construction was completed, it's been confusing from the ground as well.
bee_rider 2y ago
Based on the description it is some odd design to accommodate farm equipment. It seems a bit odd.