6 ms·

It's not possible to not play. Even if I chose to avoid social media, my kids' school insists everyone interest with their teachers through some crappy branded

It's not possible to not play. Even if I chose to avoid social media, my kids' school insists everyone interest with their teachers through some crappy branded app. Read the TOS. Didn't like what I saw. Told them I didn't want to install an app on my phone. Asked nicely if there was some way I could participate without it. They acted like I beat my kids.

em-bee 2y ago
exactly this. i have written about this before: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41529783 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41529783 some people just do not understand that there are interactions that are forced on us and that refusing to participate is only to our own disadvantage. even if they allow you to participate without installing that app, you will always be second class. people will forget to copy you on messages, or not see messages you sent. and they will have a grudge because you make them do extra work. they will leave you out on things that are optional, or not vote for you when electing a parent representative. they will reject you for not being a team player. the irony is that as a software developer i would not hesitate to create such an app. surely my app is better than the alternatives. and the TOS of my app is fine. oh wait, my boss changed the TOS without asking me. ooops.
_heimdall 2y ago
How do schools actually manage requiring this? Is it required that all students have access to smartphones, tablets, the internet in general, etc? If a student doesn't have a device to install the crappy branded app on, what does the school do? I don't have kids yet though that time is likely coming, this goes firmly on the growing list of reasons why we'd choose to homeschool.
- theGnuMe 2y ago
  When you homeschool you will likely buy said crappy app (or another one) to help you actually school your kids...
  - from-nibly 2y ago
    Why would you need an app to homeschool your kids?
- SoftTalker 2y ago
  Schools that do this typically provide a Chromebook or iPad to each student.
  - hyggetrold 2y ago
    Notice how there's a very consistent winner in all this :)
pessimizer 2y ago
> Asked nicely if there was some way I could participate without it. You've done your duty with them. Now write a letter to the school board. Give them a little while to respond, and if they don't, start handing copies of the letter to other parents outside of the school gates. If you can't get other parents to care, then you're in trouble. Try to claim a religious exception.
masfuerte 2y ago
Organisations insist that I interact with them using an app. I show them my Nokia feature phone and they find an alternative. Really, this is more damning. They could accommodate you but they don't because you could submit to their bullshit and choose not to. Maybe the answer is to carry a dead feature phone to show to them. Like a talisman to ward off their evil.
SirMaster 2y ago
Sure it is, you can homeschool for example.
- 7bit 2y ago
  Americans and their home schooling
- moron4hire 2y ago
  No thanks, don't want to put my kids through my childhood
  - SirMaster 2y ago
    My point was simply it's a valid option. You can't just reject some valid options and then say that what's left is inescapable... Or at least I don't think that's a very strong argument.
    - moron4hire 2y ago
      I'm not on a good mentalspace to discuss this, I will admit. By most accounts, I'm consider a "success" of homeschooling. And in that, I have some resentment. A child shouldn't be a social experiment. A child should be prepared to live in the society in which they live. And that's where I think homeschooling failed me. I don't blame my parents for this. At the time, 35+ years ago, it was "different". I guess. I don't know. I know my parents did what they thought was best. I just don't think they knew what was best. They were barely in their 20s when they had me. I was well into my 30s when we had our kids. So now, I'm here with them, and I don't want them to experience the pervasive loneliness that I did.
  - _heimdall 2y ago
    Assuming you were homeschooled and it went poorly for you, was your takeaway that it could never be done well? What did you find that makes homeschooling always worse than trusting the local, likely poorly paid and appreciated, state educators?

em-bee 2y ago

exactly this. i have written about this before: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41529783 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41529783 some people just do not understand that there are interactions that are forced on us and that refusing to participate is only to our own disadvantage. even if they allow you to participate without installing that app, you will always be second class. people will forget to copy you on messages, or not see messages you sent. and they will have a grudge because you make them do extra work. they will leave you out on things that are optional, or not vote for you when electing a parent representative. they will reject you for not being a team player. the irony is that as a software developer i would not hesitate to create such an app. surely my app is better than the alternatives. and the TOS of my app is fine. oh wait, my boss changed the TOS without asking me. ooops.

_heimdall 2y ago

How do schools actually manage requiring this? Is it required that all students have access to smartphones, tablets, the internet in general, etc? If a student doesn't have a device to install the crappy branded app on, what does the school do? I don't have kids yet though that time is likely coming, this goes firmly on the growing list of reasons why we'd choose to homeschool.

theGnuMe 2y ago
When you homeschool you will likely buy said crappy app (or another one) to help you actually school your kids...
- from-nibly 2y ago
  Why would you need an app to homeschool your kids?
SoftTalker 2y ago
Schools that do this typically provide a Chromebook or iPad to each student.
- hyggetrold 2y ago
  Notice how there's a very consistent winner in all this :)

pessimizer 2y ago

> Asked nicely if there was some way I could participate without it. You've done your duty with them. Now write a letter to the school board. Give them a little while to respond, and if they don't, start handing copies of the letter to other parents outside of the school gates. If you can't get other parents to care, then you're in trouble. Try to claim a religious exception.

masfuerte 2y ago

Organisations insist that I interact with them using an app. I show them my Nokia feature phone and they find an alternative. Really, this is more damning. They could accommodate you but they don't because you could submit to their bullshit and choose not to. Maybe the answer is to carry a dead feature phone to show to them. Like a talisman to ward off their evil.

SirMaster 2y ago

Sure it is, you can homeschool for example.

7bit 2y ago
Americans and their home schooling
moron4hire 2y ago
No thanks, don't want to put my kids through my childhood
- SirMaster 2y ago
  My point was simply it's a valid option. You can't just reject some valid options and then say that what's left is inescapable... Or at least I don't think that's a very strong argument.
  - moron4hire 2y ago
    I'm not on a good mentalspace to discuss this, I will admit. By most accounts, I'm consider a "success" of homeschooling. And in that, I have some resentment. A child shouldn't be a social experiment. A child should be prepared to live in the society in which they live. And that's where I think homeschooling failed me. I don't blame my parents for this. At the time, 35+ years ago, it was "different". I guess. I don't know. I know my parents did what they thought was best. I just don't think they knew what was best. They were barely in their 20s when they had me. I was well into my 30s when we had our kids. So now, I'm here with them, and I don't want them to experience the pervasive loneliness that I did.
- _heimdall 2y ago
  Assuming you were homeschooled and it went poorly for you, was your takeaway that it could never be done well? What did you find that makes homeschooling always worse than trusting the local, likely poorly paid and appreciated, state educators?