3 ms·

Only Use Old Computers

16 points by Tomte 2y ago

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
voidUpdate 2y ago
> "Use many massive Electron apps and other inexcusably bad software written by soydevs and other people who shouldn't be writing software. The last two reasons aren't really real reasons at all because they are totally unnecessary and avoidable things." Sadly its hard to get away from "massive electron apps" these days if you have a job. I appreciate the sentiment but you're going to have to shift a lot of corporate mindset to get that to happen
- slackfan 2y ago
  If corps want me to use them, they can provide the hardware. Seems fine to me?
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
efficax 2y ago
there are so many falsehoods in this post it’s hard to know where to begin, but it’s true that about 10-15 years ago computers got fast enough for the normal business/office use case and one from 2010 is perfectly serviceable in a way that seems wild if you remember the difference between a system from 2000 and 2010 or 2000 and 1990. but, display quality and battery life have improved dramatically on new systems. i’ll probably use my m1 mac studio for at least 3 more years, long after the m4 comes out, since it’s plenty fast and drives two 6k displays. i guess i’m just a soydev but no computer from 2008 can do that
- karmakaze 2y ago
  I don't know when that was written, but the spirit of it holds. I don't do video rendering, compile massive programs, or play AAA games on high settings. I only run massive Electron apps for work, which supplies the computer to run it. My personal daily driver is a Surface Go 3 with 8 GB RAM. I do have a dual-core desktop with GPU for a game (SC2) and videos. I do plug in an external display, keyboard, mouse.
- JohnFen 2y ago
  > display quality and battery life have improved dramatically on new systems. Which is valid. Nothing wrong with that. But it only applies to laptops. I stopped using laptops about a decade ago (except at work, where that's what they issue) when I realized that I never actually took them anywhere so I didn't have to make the tradeoffs that they come with.
JohnFen 2y ago
This has been my mindset for a long time. I don't buy new computers, I buy older refurbished ones from my local electronics recycler. I do it because I only very rarely need the sort of grunt that would make an older computer struggle, the cost is substantially lower, and reusing what's already built is better for everyone than buying something new and letting perfectly usable equipment go into the waste stream just because it's not the new shiny anymore.
snakeyjake 2y ago
The number 1 reason to purchase a new laptop is their improved battery life. Simultaneous advancements in power efficiency of CPUs and better battery chemistries have led to even mid-range laptops having 3x-4x the endurance of an older machine. > More recent computers, however are non-removable spyware by design and, yes, the NSA can monitor any machine with a Management Engine. lol nevermind
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
kutenai 2y ago
When did software engineers adopt this "cheapest is best" strategy? - Only use free ides - Cheapest computers - Get it free, blah blah I'm a Software professional - most reading this are also. We get paid pretty well in general. I don't compromise on my tools, my hardware, my monitors, etc. I buy software tools that make me happy, better IDE's, licenses to tools I find useful, etc. This mindset that a "good" software engineer should be a cheap bastard is insane to me. I respect my craft such that I'm willing to pay OTHERS that develop good software, and good hardware. I buy the most expensive computer I can afford. Period. You want to get by on some old boat anchor? You have something to prove? Fuck you. You don't respect yourself. My Macbook pro has the fastest 4TB SSD you'll ever see. I use about half of it.. so what. I get no brownie points for "using all of my disk" More is better. I can run dozens of apps simultaneously -- I have so many apps running I can't count them. I rarely reboot -- get annoyed when I have to. I could probably "get by' with less of a machine, but fuck that. I live my laptop, and I can run 4 full screen large format monitors with it. Have some self respect. You are a professional, buy yourself professional tools. Nobody gives a shit that you are some cheapskate that "gets by" with less.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- hddherman 2y ago
  I heard a saying recently that went along the lines of "engineering without constraints isn't engineering", and after reading "The Performance Inequality Gap"[0] and its follow-up series "Reckoning"[1], I'm convinced that software developers should use lower end devices so that they, too, feel the pain they're inflicting on others. Running cheap hardware is fun and will make you want to improve your craft. [0] - https://infrequently.org/series/performance-inequality/ https://infrequently.org/series/performance-inequality/ [1] - https://infrequently.org/series/reckoning/ https://infrequently.org/series/reckoning/
  - titusjohnson 2y ago
    You should be testing your software on the typical device it will run on. It's just good engineering to do so. If you have to eBay a bog-standard laptop to do this, do it. Developing software on the average potato device? Hell no. What a waste of time.
sneed_chucker 2y ago
Does anyone know what happened to Luke Smith? His website and YouTube channel haven't been updated in over a year. Has he gone full Orthodox monk and withdrawn from the modern world to some monastery up in the mountains in Serbia?

16 points by Tomte 2y ago

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

> "Use many massive Electron apps and other inexcusably bad software written by soydevs and other people who shouldn't be writing software. The last two reasons aren't really real reasons at all because they are totally unnecessary and avoidable things." Sadly its hard to get away from "massive electron apps" these days if you have a job. I appreciate the sentiment but you're going to have to shift a lot of corporate mindset to get that to happen

slackfan 2y ago
If corps want me to use them, they can provide the hardware. Seems fine to me?
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]

efficax 2y ago

there are so many falsehoods in this post it’s hard to know where to begin, but it’s true that about 10-15 years ago computers got fast enough for the normal business/office use case and one from 2010 is perfectly serviceable in a way that seems wild if you remember the difference between a system from 2000 and 2010 or 2000 and 1990. but, display quality and battery life have improved dramatically on new systems. i’ll probably use my m1 mac studio for at least 3 more years, long after the m4 comes out, since it’s plenty fast and drives two 6k displays. i guess i’m just a soydev but no computer from 2008 can do that

karmakaze 2y ago
I don't know when that was written, but the spirit of it holds. I don't do video rendering, compile massive programs, or play AAA games on high settings. I only run massive Electron apps for work, which supplies the computer to run it. My personal daily driver is a Surface Go 3 with 8 GB RAM. I do have a dual-core desktop with GPU for a game (SC2) and videos. I do plug in an external display, keyboard, mouse.
JohnFen 2y ago
> display quality and battery life have improved dramatically on new systems. Which is valid. Nothing wrong with that. But it only applies to laptops. I stopped using laptops about a decade ago (except at work, where that's what they issue) when I realized that I never actually took them anywhere so I didn't have to make the tradeoffs that they come with.

JohnFen 2y ago

This has been my mindset for a long time. I don't buy new computers, I buy older refurbished ones from my local electronics recycler. I do it because I only very rarely need the sort of grunt that would make an older computer struggle, the cost is substantially lower, and reusing what's already built is better for everyone than buying something new and letting perfectly usable equipment go into the waste stream just because it's not the new shiny anymore.

snakeyjake 2y ago

The number 1 reason to purchase a new laptop is their improved battery life. Simultaneous advancements in power efficiency of CPUs and better battery chemistries have led to even mid-range laptops having 3x-4x the endurance of an older machine. > More recent computers, however are non-removable spyware by design and, yes, the NSA can monitor any machine with a Management Engine. lol nevermind

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

kutenai 2y ago

When did software engineers adopt this "cheapest is best" strategy? - Only use free ides - Cheapest computers - Get it free, blah blah I'm a Software professional - most reading this are also. We get paid pretty well in general. I don't compromise on my tools, my hardware, my monitors, etc. I buy software tools that make me happy, better IDE's, licenses to tools I find useful, etc. This mindset that a "good" software engineer should be a cheap bastard is insane to me. I respect my craft such that I'm willing to pay OTHERS that develop good software, and good hardware. I buy the most expensive computer I can afford. Period. You want to get by on some old boat anchor? You have something to prove? Fuck you. You don't respect yourself. My Macbook pro has the fastest 4TB SSD you'll ever see. I use about half of it.. so what. I get no brownie points for "using all of my disk" More is better. I can run dozens of apps simultaneously -- I have so many apps running I can't count them. I rarely reboot -- get annoyed when I have to. I could probably "get by' with less of a machine, but fuck that. I live my laptop, and I can run 4 full screen large format monitors with it. Have some self respect. You are a professional, buy yourself professional tools. Nobody gives a shit that you are some cheapskate that "gets by" with less.

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
hddherman 2y ago
I heard a saying recently that went along the lines of "engineering without constraints isn't engineering", and after reading "The Performance Inequality Gap"[0] and its follow-up series "Reckoning"[1], I'm convinced that software developers should use lower end devices so that they, too, feel the pain they're inflicting on others. Running cheap hardware is fun and will make you want to improve your craft. [0] - https://infrequently.org/series/performance-inequality/ https://infrequently.org/series/performance-inequality/ [1] - https://infrequently.org/series/reckoning/ https://infrequently.org/series/reckoning/
- titusjohnson 2y ago
  You should be testing your software on the typical device it will run on. It's just good engineering to do so. If you have to eBay a bog-standard laptop to do this, do it. Developing software on the average potato device? Hell no. What a waste of time.

sneed_chucker 2y ago

Does anyone know what happened to Luke Smith? His website and YouTube channel haven't been updated in over a year. Has he gone full Orthodox monk and withdrawn from the modern world to some monastery up in the mountains in Serbia?