7 ms·
A manual wheelchair is less complex than a bicycle, and I can get a decent bicycle for a few hundred bucks. The fact that basic wheelchairs are crazy expensive
by bradley13 2y ago
A manual wheelchair is less complex than a bicycle, and I can get a decent bicycle for a few hundred bucks. The fact that basic wheelchairs are crazy expensive has little to do with the chairs and a lot to do with insane bureaucracy.
- johnisgood 2y agoYeah, but can you climb chairs with a bicycle? There are wheelchairs that can do that.
- paledot 2y agoPresuming that you mean "stairs", these exist and impress Hacker News users who think any problem can be solved with enough overengineering, but nobody really uses them because they're so much worse at everything else. I've used one to board an airplane embarking from the tarmac, that's about all they're good for.
- TaylorAlexander 2y agoWell, bicycles have more demand and volume (presumably), so that would play in to it. But yes, bicycles are a good point of reference.
- spaceman_2020 2y agoWhy? The comfort level and ergonomics demands are completely different. Bicycles are for a few hours of weekly use. Wheelchairs are for 16 hours of daily use.
- throwaway346434 2y agoBicycles built for long duration use - people do ride for 16-24 hours straight more than you'd think do exist.
- zxexz 2y agoHow many of them do that every day? And of those people that do, how much do you think they spend on their bikes?
- roywiggins 2y agoAnd, when people do use cheap bikes that don't really fit them out of necessity long-term, what's the toll on their body? It's probably not zero!
- spaceman_2020 2y agoThe parent comment is so bizarre No one who uses a wheelchair does it because they like doing it Everyone who rides a bike for 16 hours a day does it because they like doing it, and/or they’re an athlete When you’re done riding your bike for 16 hours a day - likely one week in a year - you can go to the gym, stretch out The wheelchair guy has to drag himself everywhere
- Mashimo 2y agoI don't think many people do that, and if so, how many of them do it on one that cost "couple of hundreds"?
- alistairSH 2y agoSure, but those bicycles don’t cost 100 bucks they probably cost 5000+. The last bicycle I bought was $7000 and that was midmarket (my recreational cyclist standards).
- fvdessen 2y agoI was recently in Rwanda where seemingly half the goods of this very hilly country are transported by bicycle, and those are single speed old english style bikes with steel frame reinforced with rebar. (they carry hundred of kgs on the racks). The bike are run 8 hours a day for years and cost $100.
- 2y ago
- PeterStuer 2y agoThird party payment markets tend to have prices spin out of control. Usually the end user demand is fairly inelastic, and the third party is not driven by cost efficiencies in the negotiation. Getting into those markets as a new supplier is very hard as typically a select few incumbents have longstanding relations/deals with the third party.
- jajko 2y agoEconomies of scale and lack of competition. When you have all the components for a cheap bike made in 100s of thousands by ie Shimano, the price goes down dramatically. Wheelchairs? Unless there is 1 dominant manufacturer its not going to happen to smaller shops, and monopoly has its own issues. When you have regulatory tape which require some steep price hikes to cover some specific aspect (which may not be that important), combined with above you get what you get. I was recently wheelchair-bound for a month due to my recent paragliding accident (crutches now for at least 1 month more, overall an interesting experience of various limits lying everywhere you don't even realize until you are there), and can appreciate even basic wheelchair and its various functionalities. Its simpler than bike for sure, but its also foldable (at least mine) and relatively easy to pack into trunk of any decent car in a minute (not for me of course but accompanying person).
- space_oddity 2y agoIs there any hope for more affordable options becoming available in the future..?
- giorgioz 2y agoAnd also economy of scale, there are 1 billion bikes in the world VS 65 million wheelchairs.
- eru 2y agoInteresting, only 1 billion bicycles? I would have expected more than that. In most of the places I lived (Europe, Asia) there seems to be more than one beater bike per person lying around somewhere (and some nice bikes, too, but much fewer).
- DrammBA 2y agoI'm actually surprised it's 1 billion, when you remove children, elderly, people simply out of shape for a bike, people unable to afford a bike no matter how cheap, people with disabilities incompatible with bikes, that billion is like 75%+ coverage of TAM.
- bityard 2y agoIs that 1 billion adult bikes in particular? Because in the US, anywhere outside of big cities or college towns, children are ALMOST the only people who ride bikes regularly.
- spaceman_2020 2y agoI don’t think most bicycles are designed for 16 hours of daily use…
- space_oddity 2y agoThat being said, the significant price gap still seems disproportionate
- spaceman_2020 2y agoHow much does a quality ergonomic chair cost vs a pair of walking shoes?
- ChrisMarshallNY 2y agoIn nations where bicycles are the norm, I would not be surprised if many of them get used 12+ per day. NYC is awash in bicycle couriers, and they probably ride all the time.
- spaceman_2020 2y agoSome of these comments are so bizarre that they could only be made by AI Do people here really not grasp the difference between a disabled person being forced to use a wheelchair - which they can’t get out of casually and stretch about - vs a fit person willingly using a bicycle?
- ChrisMarshallNY 2y agoWhat is the malfunction? > I don’t think most bicycles are designed for 16 hours of daily use… Was stated. The answer directly to the statement was: > In nations where bicycles are the norm, I would not be surprised if many of them get used 12+ per day. NYC is awash in bicycle couriers, and they probably ride all the time. No AI needed. Looks like it might be necessary for interpretation, though. That's not something I have any control over. BTW: I am quite familiar with Serving disabled folks. That's pretty much my job, at home.
- throwaway346434 2y agoYou cannot get a custom designed bicycle for your body for a few hundred bucks, particularly from a US manufacturer
- joelhaasnoot 2y agoHow many wheelchairs are actually truely customized? I hear a lot of complaints from wheelchair manufacturers that this isn't really customized
- srockets 2y agoPart of the problem is the cost. Very few daily wheelchair users can afford to pay a 5-digit price for one.
- tim333 2y agoIf you look on ebay there are loads of wheelchairs for sale from about $100-$200 (£80-150 if british). They are mostly made in China and I think work ok - I bought one for £80 to use with my dad and it was fine. But that was for occasional use. I guess if you were to use it all the time you might want something fancier.
- Damogran6 2y agoThat raises a whole host of other issues. They're $200, because they don't have to pay their employees or provide a safe environment, the Government is subsidizing the manufacture or other unsavoury reasons. You can make things really cheap if you don't care about your staff.
- valval 2y agoComplete speculation, you’ve downed too much propaganda. Manufacturing is cheaper in cheaper countries because of less taxes, inflation, bureaucracy, and a dozen other factors that aren’t negative socialist bullshit. Their workers get by just fine with the wages they’re paid.
- extua 2y agoThe Chinese government subsidising the manufacture of wheelchairs doesn't sound as nefarious as you're making out. I would be proud if my government did the same thing.
- alistairSH 2y agoYou probably don’t want to sit on that cheap bicycle for 16 hours a day. Almost guaranteed it won’t fit property and at best will give you saddle, sores and worse cause back knee issues.