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the union’s demand for a ban on automation seems quite absurd. Particularly given that they walked away from talks this summer because of an autogate system th

by rnrn 2y ago

the union’s demand for a ban on automation seems quite absurd. Particularly given that they walked away from talks this summer because of an autogate system that has been in use since 2008. Surely if automated cranes is bad for employment, then having motorized cranes is too, and they should hire 10000x more people to move containers using muscle strength alone.

diggan 2y ago
> the union’s demand for a ban on automation seems quite absurd. I don't see where this is coming from? The only thing I find from the union is that there is an existing agreement since 2018 that any automation the companies want to be implemented, needs to be discussed with the union beforehand. So there doesn't seem to be any "ban on automation" as far as I can tell, so wondering where you are getting this from?
- gruez 2y ago
  https://apnews.com/article/port-strike-ila-dockworkers-begins-e5468e760f46a64e4322d1702beb1f72 https://apnews.com/article/port-strike-ila-dockworkers-begin... >the alliance said it had increased its offer to 50% raises over six years, and it pledged to keep limits on automation in place from the old contract. The union wants a complete ban on automation. It wasn’t clear just how far apart both sides are
  - diggan 2y ago
    > The union wants a complete ban on automation I only find media reports about "complete ban on automation". The only thing I can find from the union itself is "keep limits on automation in place", which was already in the existing agreement. "Limits" is very different from "ban".
    - rnrn 2y ago
      > Bottom line: the ILA does not support any kind of automation, including semi-automation. These companies cannot be trusted! They continue to sneak in automated programs and eliminate our clerical functions behind our backs. They better get ready for the biggest fight they’ve ever seen. We are done with them unilaterally implementing work processes and having zero respect for our members and their work functions. https://ilaunion.org/letter-of-opposition-to-usmxs-misleading-statement/ https://ilaunion.org/letter-of-opposition-to-usmxs-misleadin...
JoeAltmaier 2y ago
retreating to an extreme is a fairly ineffective argument strategy. The idea is to keep employed people, employed. They have that in the very front of their minds. Understand that and you can sort out behavior quickly. The union, of course, supports people who are currently members of the union! Perfectly understandable.
- rnrn 2y ago
  Don’t much care how effective it is since I’m not negotiating Not particularly extreme either, given the history of the ILA’s opposition to shipping containers and cranes

by rnrn 2y ago

diggan 2y ago

> the union’s demand for a ban on automation seems quite absurd. I don't see where this is coming from? The only thing I find from the union is that there is an existing agreement since 2018 that any automation the companies want to be implemented, needs to be discussed with the union beforehand. So there doesn't seem to be any "ban on automation" as far as I can tell, so wondering where you are getting this from?

gruez 2y ago
https://apnews.com/article/port-strike-ila-dockworkers-begins-e5468e760f46a64e4322d1702beb1f72 https://apnews.com/article/port-strike-ila-dockworkers-begin... >the alliance said it had increased its offer to 50% raises over six years, and it pledged to keep limits on automation in place from the old contract. The union wants a complete ban on automation. It wasn’t clear just how far apart both sides are
- diggan 2y ago
  > The union wants a complete ban on automation I only find media reports about "complete ban on automation". The only thing I can find from the union itself is "keep limits on automation in place", which was already in the existing agreement. "Limits" is very different from "ban".
  - rnrn 2y ago
    > Bottom line: the ILA does not support any kind of automation, including semi-automation. These companies cannot be trusted! They continue to sneak in automated programs and eliminate our clerical functions behind our backs. They better get ready for the biggest fight they’ve ever seen. We are done with them unilaterally implementing work processes and having zero respect for our members and their work functions. https://ilaunion.org/letter-of-opposition-to-usmxs-misleading-statement/ https://ilaunion.org/letter-of-opposition-to-usmxs-misleadin...

JoeAltmaier 2y ago

retreating to an extreme is a fairly ineffective argument strategy. The idea is to keep employed people, employed. They have that in the very front of their minds. Understand that and you can sort out behavior quickly. The union, of course, supports people who are currently members of the union! Perfectly understandable.

rnrn 2y ago
Don’t much care how effective it is since I’m not negotiating Not particularly extreme either, given the history of the ILA’s opposition to shipping containers and cranes