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They could just as easily have trumped up treason charges. Whether the charges are valid or not is irrelevant. Both of these countries are clearly sending a m

They could just as easily have trumped up treason charges. Whether the charges are valid or not is irrelevant. Both of these countries are clearly sending a message. Get too greedy, corrupt, ..etc and we will kill you. Whereas in the US there are 0 real consequences. It is the message that is important here. The US needs to start putting executives involved in these crimes in federal prison with very long sentences. Fining them doesn’t work they need to lose their freedom.

jncfhnb 2y ago
No, that’s really not clear at all. You are still assuming corruption is the cause of these actions. China consistently ranks far worse in terms of corruption on pretty much all organizations that do such evaluations.
- ToucanLoucan 2y ago
  And you're assuming political backroom antics. Neither assumption is borne out in any way beyond the fact you seem to think China is inherently scary because it's China. What we do know for certain is that Well Fargo, based in the US, has a long and well documented history of financial tom-fuckery that has been proven, in US courts, to be tom-fuckery that they were given absolute, by any standard you'd care to apply, slap-on-the-wrist punishments for. In contrast, China sentenced a man to die for his financial tom-fuckery that was proven in their justice system to be tom-fuckery. Whether or not you agree with that being his punishment, it was certainly, IMO, more appropriate to at least punish the person responsible rather than parking liability in an LLC, issueing middling fines, and calling it a fucking day. And considering how many times Wells Fargo (and others!) have had these kinds of cases come up, be proven, be slapped with fines that don't even remotely approach a real consequence, and have gone on to do additional tom-fuckery, I'd say it's well established at this point that the fines aren't doing shit. Like, to be clear, I'm anti-death penalty and that would include bankers, I don't think Wells Fargo's CEO should be shot for what he did. That being said, if him being shot was a possible outcome, I have a strong feeling he'd be much more hesitant to do financial crimes via his business.
  - jncfhnb 2y ago
    > And you're assuming political backroom antics. Neither assumption is borne out in any way beyond the fact you seem to think China is inherently scary because it's China. I’m not assuming anything. You’re the one claiming that this factoid means something. The onus is entirely on you. A good way to demonstrate this would be something that shows China is systematically less corrupt. Russia also has arrested individuals for corruption. is that supposed to be evidence that Russia is less corruption friendly than the US?
    - CRConrad 2y ago
      [flagged]
    - riehwvfbk 2y ago
      By the same token: you are making these statements with the same level of certainty as "water is wet": the US is less corrupt because duh. However, the main reason for your argument is mostly marketing: the US has successfully marketed itself as "free" and "fair" over the years. Whether or not this is factual is very much debatable. Oh, and don't bother looking up studies by US-based think tanks ranking the US as awesome at fighting corruption. Because duh.
      - jncfhnb 2y ago
        There are many studies that are not run by the US. Even the US based one’s tend to put the US at maybe the bottom of the top quartile. There’s many countries that score significantly better. I think it’s kind of stupid to argue that corruption is more prevalent in the US than China, but mostly I’m just here to shit on the argument that a cherry picked conviction is worth anything as an argument that corruption is less tolerated. Targeted convictions on charges of corruption are like the hallmark of corrupt governments. It’s not a useful data point at all.

jncfhnb 2y ago

No, that’s really not clear at all. You are still assuming corruption is the cause of these actions. China consistently ranks far worse in terms of corruption on pretty much all organizations that do such evaluations.

ToucanLoucan 2y ago
And you're assuming political backroom antics. Neither assumption is borne out in any way beyond the fact you seem to think China is inherently scary because it's China. What we do know for certain is that Well Fargo, based in the US, has a long and well documented history of financial tom-fuckery that has been proven, in US courts, to be tom-fuckery that they were given absolute, by any standard you'd care to apply, slap-on-the-wrist punishments for. In contrast, China sentenced a man to die for his financial tom-fuckery that was proven in their justice system to be tom-fuckery. Whether or not you agree with that being his punishment, it was certainly, IMO, more appropriate to at least punish the person responsible rather than parking liability in an LLC, issueing middling fines, and calling it a fucking day. And considering how many times Wells Fargo (and others!) have had these kinds of cases come up, be proven, be slapped with fines that don't even remotely approach a real consequence, and have gone on to do additional tom-fuckery, I'd say it's well established at this point that the fines aren't doing shit. Like, to be clear, I'm anti-death penalty and that would include bankers, I don't think Wells Fargo's CEO should be shot for what he did. That being said, if him being shot was a possible outcome, I have a strong feeling he'd be much more hesitant to do financial crimes via his business.
- jncfhnb 2y ago
  > And you're assuming political backroom antics. Neither assumption is borne out in any way beyond the fact you seem to think China is inherently scary because it's China. I’m not assuming anything. You’re the one claiming that this factoid means something. The onus is entirely on you. A good way to demonstrate this would be something that shows China is systematically less corrupt. Russia also has arrested individuals for corruption. is that supposed to be evidence that Russia is less corruption friendly than the US?
  - CRConrad 2y ago
    [flagged]
  - riehwvfbk 2y ago
    By the same token: you are making these statements with the same level of certainty as "water is wet": the US is less corrupt because duh. However, the main reason for your argument is mostly marketing: the US has successfully marketed itself as "free" and "fair" over the years. Whether or not this is factual is very much debatable. Oh, and don't bother looking up studies by US-based think tanks ranking the US as awesome at fighting corruption. Because duh.
    - jncfhnb 2y ago
      There are many studies that are not run by the US. Even the US based one’s tend to put the US at maybe the bottom of the top quartile. There’s many countries that score significantly better. I think it’s kind of stupid to argue that corruption is more prevalent in the US than China, but mostly I’m just here to shit on the argument that a cherry picked conviction is worth anything as an argument that corruption is less tolerated. Targeted convictions on charges of corruption are like the hallmark of corrupt governments. It’s not a useful data point at all.