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> but it's being run just fine As a Californian I have to disagree. The only reason you think it's being run just fine is because of the success of the privat

> but it's being run just fine As a Californian I have to disagree. The only reason you think it's being run just fine is because of the success of the private sector. The only reason California would be the 4th/5th largest economy in the world is because of the the tech industry and other industries that are in California (Hollywood, agriculture, etc). It's not because we have some awesome efficiently run state government.

WWLink 2y ago
What are you getting at? Is a state government supposed to be profitable? LOL
nashashmi 2y ago
Do you mean to say that the government was deeply underwater a few years ago? And the state marred by forest fires that it was frightening to see if it could ever come back ?
cma 2y ago
> The only reason you think it's being run just fine is because of the success of the private sector. Tesla received billions in subsidies from CA as an example.
- toephu2 2y ago
  Which it paid back in full + interest.
  - cma 2y ago
    Here's an example, took the money and delivered mostly an infeasible version of battery swapping with probably their existing factory install tech lightly modified: https://centerforjobs.org/?p=4600 https://centerforjobs.org/?p=4600
labster 2y ago
I think California might have a better run government if it had an electable conservative party. The Republican Party is not that, being tied to the national Trump-Vance-Orbán axis. A center-right party could hold Democratic officers accountable but it’s not being offered and moderates gravitate to the electable Dem side. An independent California would largely fix that. As a lifelong California Democrat, I realize that my party does not have all the answers. But the conservatives have all gone AWOL or gone batshit so we’re doing the best we can without the other half of the dialectic.
- dangus 2y ago
  Pre-Trump Republicans had no problem absurdly mismanaging Kansas’ coffers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansas_experiment https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansas_experiment I think the Republican Party’s positive reputation for handling the economy and running an efficient government is entirely unearned. Closing down major parts of the government entirely (as Project 2025 proposes), making taxation more regressive, and offering fewer social services isn’t “efficiency.” I don’t know if you know this but you’re already in the center-right party. The actual problem is that there’s no left of center party, as well as the general need for a number of aspects of our democracy to be reformed (like how it really doesn’t allow for more than two parties to exist, or how out of control campaign finance rules have become).
  - telotortium 2y ago
    Democrats (especially in California) are somewhat to the right of socialist parties in Europe, and of course they’re neoliberal. But on most non-economic social issues, they’re quite far to the left compared to most European countries. So it really depends on what you consider more important to the left.
    - dangus 2y ago
      You could consider my definition of “left” and “right” to mean economic policy in this case. Considering that the economy is supposedly to be the number one concern to most US voters, there really isn’t anything very far left available to vote for in that area.
shiroiushi 2y ago
>It's not because we have some awesome efficiently run state government. Can you point to any place in the world that has an "awesome efficiently run" government?
- logicchains 2y ago
  Singapore, Dubai, Monaco..
- jandrewrogers 2y ago
  We don't need to look at other countries, just look at other States. California is quite poorly run by the standards of other States. I'm a California native but I've lived in and worked with many other States. You don't realize how appallingly bad California government is until you have to work with their counterparts in other States. It isn't a red versus blue thing, even grift-y one-party States like Washington are plainly better run than California.
- toephu2 2y ago
  Singapore...
dangus 2y ago
It’s easy to disagree when you aren’t looking the grass that’s not so green on the other side. California is run amazingly well compared to a significant number of states.

WWLink 2y ago

What are you getting at? Is a state government supposed to be profitable? LOL

nashashmi 2y ago

Do you mean to say that the government was deeply underwater a few years ago? And the state marred by forest fires that it was frightening to see if it could ever come back ?

cma 2y ago

> The only reason you think it's being run just fine is because of the success of the private sector. Tesla received billions in subsidies from CA as an example.

toephu2 2y ago
Which it paid back in full + interest.
- cma 2y ago
  Here's an example, took the money and delivered mostly an infeasible version of battery swapping with probably their existing factory install tech lightly modified: https://centerforjobs.org/?p=4600 https://centerforjobs.org/?p=4600

labster 2y ago

I think California might have a better run government if it had an electable conservative party. The Republican Party is not that, being tied to the national Trump-Vance-Orbán axis. A center-right party could hold Democratic officers accountable but it’s not being offered and moderates gravitate to the electable Dem side. An independent California would largely fix that. As a lifelong California Democrat, I realize that my party does not have all the answers. But the conservatives have all gone AWOL or gone batshit so we’re doing the best we can without the other half of the dialectic.

dangus 2y ago
Pre-Trump Republicans had no problem absurdly mismanaging Kansas’ coffers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansas_experiment https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansas_experiment I think the Republican Party’s positive reputation for handling the economy and running an efficient government is entirely unearned. Closing down major parts of the government entirely (as Project 2025 proposes), making taxation more regressive, and offering fewer social services isn’t “efficiency.” I don’t know if you know this but you’re already in the center-right party. The actual problem is that there’s no left of center party, as well as the general need for a number of aspects of our democracy to be reformed (like how it really doesn’t allow for more than two parties to exist, or how out of control campaign finance rules have become).
- telotortium 2y ago
  Democrats (especially in California) are somewhat to the right of socialist parties in Europe, and of course they’re neoliberal. But on most non-economic social issues, they’re quite far to the left compared to most European countries. So it really depends on what you consider more important to the left.
  - dangus 2y ago
    You could consider my definition of “left” and “right” to mean economic policy in this case. Considering that the economy is supposedly to be the number one concern to most US voters, there really isn’t anything very far left available to vote for in that area.

shiroiushi 2y ago

>It's not because we have some awesome efficiently run state government. Can you point to any place in the world that has an "awesome efficiently run" government?

logicchains 2y ago
Singapore, Dubai, Monaco..
jandrewrogers 2y ago
We don't need to look at other countries, just look at other States. California is quite poorly run by the standards of other States. I'm a California native but I've lived in and worked with many other States. You don't realize how appallingly bad California government is until you have to work with their counterparts in other States. It isn't a red versus blue thing, even grift-y one-party States like Washington are plainly better run than California.
toephu2 2y ago
Singapore...

dangus 2y ago

It’s easy to disagree when you aren’t looking the grass that’s not so green on the other side. California is run amazingly well compared to a significant number of states.