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The writer of the article was poor when young but at some point got internet working on an old computer and suddenly they would have access to learn a lot about

The writer of the article was poor when young but at some point got internet working on an old computer and suddenly they would have access to learn a lot about information technology, thanks to mostly freely shared info. What I wonder... would they have reached out back then not just for computer info but also for psychological support and a way out of poverty, would that have worked? And why didn't they?

dbalatero 2y ago
It sounds like computers were an outlet away from the hardship - something the author could sink into. I didn't get the sense he was in practical problem solving mode, but more coping and survival mode. Lucky him that this particular form of coping led to greener pastures.
- nuancebydefault 2y ago
  He seemed indeed in survival mode. It's indeed unfortunate that in such situations, people, especially minors, cannot find to reach out for a practical solution for, for example, cheap food (leftovers in shops?) or good advice in such situation.
  - Tijdreiziger 2y ago
    Here in the Netherlands we have the Kindertelefoon (Children’s Telephone), a free hotline for children to call and talk about anything. [1] I never called when I was young, but I think it’s great that such an initiative exists. Even for adults, there are such initiatives, such as the Luisterlijn [2] and MIND Korrelatie [3]. [1] https://www.kindertelefoon.nl/ https://www.kindertelefoon.nl/ [2] https://www.deluisterlijn.nl/ https://www.deluisterlijn.nl/ [3] https://mindkorrelatie.nl/ https://mindkorrelatie.nl/
    - nuancebydefault 2y ago
      I really can't imagine these kind of initiatives not to exist on the other side of the ocean. From all i read here, i must assume so though.
      - throwanem 2y ago
        There is nothing remotely similar. Have you noticed it's only in our cities you seem to really hear about the homeless poor? It isn't the corollary of overall population distribution that it might intuitively look like.
        nuancebydefault 2y ago
        I just read following are available throughout the entire USA so I guess there is some hope? Childhelp National Child Abuse Hotline. This hotline provides 24/7 support for children and adults concerned about child abuse. National Runaway Safeline (1-800-RUNAWAY) Boys Town National Hotline (1-800-448-3000).
        throwanem 2y ago
        Oh, I didn't say we have nothing that we could call a system, just that there's nothing remotely similar. There are some people that some of those don't fail, and one on that list with so pervasive a documented history of child sexual abuse among its caretakers that I'm honestly shocked if they still answer the phone - although if I recall correctly, Boys Town also has a history for giving kickbacks to judges in exchange for remanding children whose unpaid labor the organization then can exploit, so I suppose it's worth some money to them to take the calls. I might misremember, though; there are so many such stories, it's hard to keep them straight without checking. Churches also answer much of what need anyone does, most places this being small, poorly resourced local evangelical congregations. These also, in the form of the revelations around the conduct of the Southern Baptist Convention, have this year seen the breaking of a major child sex abuse scandal which has not yet ceased to ramify. There is no general oversight or coordination anywhere, and for entry into "the system" to result even in safe, much less beneficial, placement, is much more than anything else a matter of chance. And you only hear about homeless poor as a city problem because those who can't make it to a city typically end up imprisoned or dead. I was being a little hard on you earlier, maybe. If I'd lived a life in the environment of a northern/western-European style system of social welfare, it would also I think be easy for me to see something in America that looks vaguely similar and assume it must be much the same. I took that as a rather arrogant sort of assumption, and might in that have earned the accusation of incharity that I earlier criticized. Specifically, I think I might have failed to account for how, to someone raised in a country that looks after its people, the situation in America might seem far too grim to easily credit. If I did make that error, I apologize.
hesdeadjim 2y ago
I hope you are aware of your immense luck in life if you think a kid in a situation like this has agency of any kind, let alone access to resources to help them “escape poverty” as a minor. You know why no-questions asked, free lunch programs for everyone are so hugely important for kids suffering from food scarcity? Often it’s because their shitty parents won’t even sign forms to get them free lunch. Please educate yourself in what actual suffering looks like in this world.
- nuancebydefault 2y ago
  Biweekly I work freely at an initiative in our city to help deliver food to the needy. I believe i know what poverty looks like. I'm not sure what this has to do with my question, probably it was ill formed, for which i apologize.
  - throwanem 2y ago
    From how you all use the language, I suspect you and your critical interlocutors are speaking across the Atlantic to one another. Poverty in Europe looks a lot different from poverty in the US. It is not wise to assume much at all about one from the other. You also failed in reading the article to notice that the author plainly did derive considerable psychological support from improving his skill. This was not explicitly stated but was trivially implicit, which I think not only for me may add to the sense you more pattern-matched on the article than read it. For myself, I'm much more unfavorably impressed with your failure to notice the kid plainly was solving his own problems with computers and in life, and deriving from that success a stronger sense of personal agency which helped him approach the larger tasks that faced him. It seems to me only a view of poverty which is paternalistic unto contempt could fail to attend this process which was explicitly described in the article, but then I am an American, and would not wish to risk commenting on a culture I don't understand well enough to form opinions about.
    - nuancebydefault 2y ago
      Like i wrote, the question was probably ill formed, but it is a question, not an opinion nonetheless. I am a bit touched that it seemed like i did not read or understand the article, in fact i read the article in its entirety, as one of the first to comment, even to my surprise for such a compelling story. I understood he was getting support and feeling strengthened by his learning on the internet. I feel my questions seem to be taken as rhetorical. I feel it is still unanswered, even no hints towards how or why, only that 'i should not ask such questions'. I guess American culture is very different from European (can it even be seen as having a culture as a whole, there is so much diversity)... and hence my question not being appreciated?
Dansvidania 2y ago
while it might have been theoretically possible.. it's not obvious to me that a kid growing up poor would know of that possibility, or know how to find that information. Sometimes it's a matter of luck, like how he had met someone that knew about linux.
tbrownaw 2y ago
> What I wonder... would they have reached out back then not just for computer info but also for psychological support and a way out of poverty, would that have worked? Joining someone in their hobbies is a much much smaller ask than having that same someone listen to (and maybe advise about) your problems, or having them provide career coaching / direct financial support. One is "lets have fun together", the other is "please stranger, do me this huge favor". > And why didn't they? Knowing who to ask might be a bit much to ask of a kid. Even aside from asking for unreciprocated favors being generally not a thing most people do easily (or look on favorably).

dbalatero 2y ago

It sounds like computers were an outlet away from the hardship - something the author could sink into. I didn't get the sense he was in practical problem solving mode, but more coping and survival mode. Lucky him that this particular form of coping led to greener pastures.

nuancebydefault 2y ago
He seemed indeed in survival mode. It's indeed unfortunate that in such situations, people, especially minors, cannot find to reach out for a practical solution for, for example, cheap food (leftovers in shops?) or good advice in such situation.
- Tijdreiziger 2y ago
  Here in the Netherlands we have the Kindertelefoon (Children’s Telephone), a free hotline for children to call and talk about anything. [1] I never called when I was young, but I think it’s great that such an initiative exists. Even for adults, there are such initiatives, such as the Luisterlijn [2] and MIND Korrelatie [3]. [1] https://www.kindertelefoon.nl/ https://www.kindertelefoon.nl/ [2] https://www.deluisterlijn.nl/ https://www.deluisterlijn.nl/ [3] https://mindkorrelatie.nl/ https://mindkorrelatie.nl/
  - nuancebydefault 2y ago
    I really can't imagine these kind of initiatives not to exist on the other side of the ocean. From all i read here, i must assume so though.
    - throwanem 2y ago
      There is nothing remotely similar. Have you noticed it's only in our cities you seem to really hear about the homeless poor? It isn't the corollary of overall population distribution that it might intuitively look like.
      - nuancebydefault 2y ago
        I just read following are available throughout the entire USA so I guess there is some hope? Childhelp National Child Abuse Hotline. This hotline provides 24/7 support for children and adults concerned about child abuse. National Runaway Safeline (1-800-RUNAWAY) Boys Town National Hotline (1-800-448-3000).
        throwanem 2y ago
        Oh, I didn't say we have nothing that we could call a system, just that there's nothing remotely similar. There are some people that some of those don't fail, and one on that list with so pervasive a documented history of child sexual abuse among its caretakers that I'm honestly shocked if they still answer the phone - although if I recall correctly, Boys Town also has a history for giving kickbacks to judges in exchange for remanding children whose unpaid labor the organization then can exploit, so I suppose it's worth some money to them to take the calls. I might misremember, though; there are so many such stories, it's hard to keep them straight without checking. Churches also answer much of what need anyone does, most places this being small, poorly resourced local evangelical congregations. These also, in the form of the revelations around the conduct of the Southern Baptist Convention, have this year seen the breaking of a major child sex abuse scandal which has not yet ceased to ramify. There is no general oversight or coordination anywhere, and for entry into "the system" to result even in safe, much less beneficial, placement, is much more than anything else a matter of chance. And you only hear about homeless poor as a city problem because those who can't make it to a city typically end up imprisoned or dead. I was being a little hard on you earlier, maybe. If I'd lived a life in the environment of a northern/western-European style system of social welfare, it would also I think be easy for me to see something in America that looks vaguely similar and assume it must be much the same. I took that as a rather arrogant sort of assumption, and might in that have earned the accusation of incharity that I earlier criticized. Specifically, I think I might have failed to account for how, to someone raised in a country that looks after its people, the situation in America might seem far too grim to easily credit. If I did make that error, I apologize.

hesdeadjim 2y ago

I hope you are aware of your immense luck in life if you think a kid in a situation like this has agency of any kind, let alone access to resources to help them “escape poverty” as a minor. You know why no-questions asked, free lunch programs for everyone are so hugely important for kids suffering from food scarcity? Often it’s because their shitty parents won’t even sign forms to get them free lunch. Please educate yourself in what actual suffering looks like in this world.

nuancebydefault 2y ago
Biweekly I work freely at an initiative in our city to help deliver food to the needy. I believe i know what poverty looks like. I'm not sure what this has to do with my question, probably it was ill formed, for which i apologize.
- throwanem 2y ago
  From how you all use the language, I suspect you and your critical interlocutors are speaking across the Atlantic to one another. Poverty in Europe looks a lot different from poverty in the US. It is not wise to assume much at all about one from the other. You also failed in reading the article to notice that the author plainly did derive considerable psychological support from improving his skill. This was not explicitly stated but was trivially implicit, which I think not only for me may add to the sense you more pattern-matched on the article than read it. For myself, I'm much more unfavorably impressed with your failure to notice the kid plainly was solving his own problems with computers and in life, and deriving from that success a stronger sense of personal agency which helped him approach the larger tasks that faced him. It seems to me only a view of poverty which is paternalistic unto contempt could fail to attend this process which was explicitly described in the article, but then I am an American, and would not wish to risk commenting on a culture I don't understand well enough to form opinions about.
  - nuancebydefault 2y ago
    Like i wrote, the question was probably ill formed, but it is a question, not an opinion nonetheless. I am a bit touched that it seemed like i did not read or understand the article, in fact i read the article in its entirety, as one of the first to comment, even to my surprise for such a compelling story. I understood he was getting support and feeling strengthened by his learning on the internet. I feel my questions seem to be taken as rhetorical. I feel it is still unanswered, even no hints towards how or why, only that 'i should not ask such questions'. I guess American culture is very different from European (can it even be seen as having a culture as a whole, there is so much diversity)... and hence my question not being appreciated?

Dansvidania 2y ago

while it might have been theoretically possible.. it's not obvious to me that a kid growing up poor would know of that possibility, or know how to find that information. Sometimes it's a matter of luck, like how he had met someone that knew about linux.

tbrownaw 2y ago

> What I wonder... would they have reached out back then not just for computer info but also for psychological support and a way out of poverty, would that have worked? Joining someone in their hobbies is a much much smaller ask than having that same someone listen to (and maybe advise about) your problems, or having them provide career coaching / direct financial support. One is "lets have fun together", the other is "please stranger, do me this huge favor". > And why didn't they? Knowing who to ask might be a bit much to ask of a kid. Even aside from asking for unreciprocated favors being generally not a thing most people do easily (or look on favorably).