3 ms·

This 100%. Many of us on the Mac are there in part because the environment and conventions make more sense to us than the conventions on other platforms. X-pla

• nottorp 2y ago
  I like the Mac conventions most of the time. However for keyboard shortcuts said conventions are defined for crippled keyboards without dedicated navigation keys and the extension for PgUp/Down is simply inefficient when programming.
  • tpmoney 2y ago
    The cursor movement conventions have existed in macos since the classic mac days, when Apple was routinely shipping keyboards with "dedicated navigation keys": Up / Down: move cursor one line up or down Left / Right: move cursor one character left or right Option+ Up / Down: Move cursor up or down a whole paragraph Left / Right: move cursor left or right a whole word Command+ Up / Down: Move cursor to the beginning of the document Left / Right: Move cursor to the beginning or end of the document Page Up / Page Down: Move the scrolled display area up or down a "page" without moving the cursor Home / End: Move the scrolled display area to the beginning or end of the document The latter two are nice to have because it means you can scroll up through a window to view something, and start typing to have your view snap back to your cursor position.
    • nottorp 2y ago
      > "dedicated navigation keys" I don't think they ever had PgUp and PgDown. Same thin/small fetish as today. Jobs wasn't typing much, I think.
      • tpmoney 2y ago
        When I said this convention was old, I meant it: Apple Extended Keyboard M0115 (1987): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Apple_Extended_Keyboard_M0115.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Apple_Extended_Keyboard_M... Apple Extended Keyboard II M0312/M3501 (1990): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Apple_Extended_Keyboard.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Apple_Extended_Keyboard.j... Apple Adjustable Keyboard M1242 (1993): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Apple_Adjustable_Keyboard_M1242_different_views.jpeg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Apple_Adjustable_Keyboard... Apple Design Keyboard M2980 (1994): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:AppleDesign_Keyboard_black.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:AppleDesign_Keyboard_blac... Apple USB Keyboard M2453 (1998) (not in their usual position, above the number pad instead): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Apple_USB_Keyboard_B.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Apple_USB_Keyboard_B.jpg / https://deskthority.net/wiki/Apple_USB_Keyboard https://deskthority.net/wiki/Apple_USB_Keyboard Apple Pro Keyboard M7803 (2000): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Apple_Pro_Keyboard_black.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Apple_Pro_Keyboard_black.... Apple Keyboard A1048 (2003): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Apple_Keyboard_(A1048).jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Apple_Keyboard_(A1048).jp... Apple Keyboard A1243 (2007): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Apple_iMac_Keyboard_A1243.png https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Apple_iMac_Keyboard_A1243... Apple Magic Keyboard w/ Numeric Keypad A1843 (2017): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Apple_Magic_Keyboard_with_Numeric_Keypad_Traditional_Chinese_(Zhuyin_%26_Cangjie).jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Apple_Magic_Keyboard_with... Additionally at least as far back as the Powerbook G3 "Wallstreet" in 1998, and including the iBook lines from the same time period, to the best of my knowledge every Apple portable since (as well as any wireless/compact keyboards with Fn keys) then has supported Fn + Left/Right for Home/End respectively and Fn + Up/Down for Page Up / Page Down respectively. They were even marked as such through the early non-unibody MBPs but continue to function that way today even without the markings. While these aren't dedicated keys, they're convenient enough in combination with the other modifiers that you'd be using to move the cursor that I don't personally consider it a significant difference.