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Just in case, let’s check if one of Jupiter’s moons, packed with salt and freezing near absolute zero, happens to have life. Sounds like a great way to spend pu

by _7acn 2y ago

Just in case, let’s check if one of Jupiter’s moons, packed with salt and freezing near absolute zero, happens to have life. Sounds like a great way to spend public money.

_7acn 2y ago
"What an ignorant fool! There could totally be life there!"
selectnull 2y ago
"near absolute zero" is not nearly correct. The temperature of Europa ocean is believed to be between 0 and -4 degrees Celsius.
Aaron2222 2y ago
From Wikipedia[0]: "The scientific consensus is that a layer of liquid water exists beneath Europa's surface, and that heat from tidal flexing allows the subsurface ocean to remain liquid." Liquid water is hardly "freezing near absolute zero". [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europa_(moon)#Subsurface_ocean https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europa_(moon)#Subsurface_ocean
gilleain 2y ago
Why would salt be a problem? There are single celled organisms known as halophiles that survive extreme salt. Do you know what range of concentrations are reasonable for life, or which salts might be present on Europa?
9dev 2y ago
Just one aircraft carrier less, and NASA can send probes to most of Jupiter‘s moons and still have money left for marketing…
- hoseja 2y ago
  Yeah but it won't be NASA sending them but CNSA.
  - protomolecule 2y ago
    Which is all the same for humanity.
firtoz 2y ago
> "We’re not a life search mission. We’re a habitability mission,” says Robert Pappalardo, Clipper’s project scientist at the Jet Propulsion Laboratory (JPL), which manages the mission. But even Pappalardo, a cautious scientist who is constitutionally averse to hyperbole, says finding a hint of life is “not out of the question.”
holoduke 2y ago
What more important can we human beings do than exploring space and improve our tech?
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago
  > What more important can we human beings do than exploring space and improve our tech? This is a value statement. Every answer from heroin to petting my cat is technically a valid answer. OP's question is written obnoxiously. But it raises a valid point: why should we do these things, and why should it matter to people who don't find it inherently valuable?
ungreased0675 2y ago
I wouldn’t put it that way, but I’d rather space exploration money focus on colonization and improving life on earth. For example, asteroid mining has massive potential. What if rare metals suddenly were no longer rare? What could we make? What if we had outposts on other planets? How might that change perspectives and culture on earth? How might R&D to colonize Mars make life on Earth more resilient and sustainable? Searching for life elsewhere seems so empty and unsatisfying. Almost like a religious quest for enlightenment or something. If we found a fossil snail on another planet, then what?
- selectnull 2y ago
  > Searching for life elsewhere seems so empty and unsatisfying. To me, finding any extra terrestrial life, or even just a fossil of past life, would be the most exciting find in the history.
  - dotancohen 2y ago
    It would answer humanity's longest open philosophical question. The religious and social consequences would likely change the course of human history. Imagine humans no longer fighting each other, but rather working together towards a goal. I can think of nothing that would catalyze such a change more than the discovery of extra terrestrial life. Even climate change isn't doing it.
    - ungreased0675 2y ago
      How do you think the discovery of extraterrestrial life would do that? I think most people would say “that’s neat” and continue living their life unchanged.
      - XorNot 2y ago
        Yes, I guess new ideas have never contributed to any change in social dynamics ever. That's the course of history you know: the social psychology and accepted wisdom is exactly as it is now, unchanged from Roman times because no new thinking based on discovery or philosophy ever led to a shift in the structure and beliefs of society.
wheatgreaser 2y ago
nasa's budget is miniscule compared to the funds allocated to the military
- rvnx 2y ago
  They complete each other, first step is to explore other planets, then send the military to protect it and take the resources there before other nations.
space_oddity 2y ago
It might seem like a long shot, but exploring moons like Europa isn't just about finding life... It's about expanding our understanding of life's potential across the universe

by _7acn 2y ago

Just in case, let’s check if one of Jupiter’s moons, packed with salt and freezing near absolute zero, happens to have life. Sounds like a great way to spend public money.

_7acn 2y ago

"What an ignorant fool! There could totally be life there!"

selectnull 2y ago

"near absolute zero" is not nearly correct. The temperature of Europa ocean is believed to be between 0 and -4 degrees Celsius.

Aaron2222 2y ago

From Wikipedia[0]: "The scientific consensus is that a layer of liquid water exists beneath Europa's surface, and that heat from tidal flexing allows the subsurface ocean to remain liquid." Liquid water is hardly "freezing near absolute zero". [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europa_(moon)#Subsurface_ocean https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europa_(moon)#Subsurface_ocean

gilleain 2y ago

Why would salt be a problem? There are single celled organisms known as halophiles that survive extreme salt. Do you know what range of concentrations are reasonable for life, or which salts might be present on Europa?

9dev 2y ago

Just one aircraft carrier less, and NASA can send probes to most of Jupiter‘s moons and still have money left for marketing…

hoseja 2y ago
Yeah but it won't be NASA sending them but CNSA.
- protomolecule 2y ago
  Which is all the same for humanity.

firtoz 2y ago

> "We’re not a life search mission. We’re a habitability mission,” says Robert Pappalardo, Clipper’s project scientist at the Jet Propulsion Laboratory (JPL), which manages the mission. But even Pappalardo, a cautious scientist who is constitutionally averse to hyperbole, says finding a hint of life is “not out of the question.”

holoduke 2y ago

What more important can we human beings do than exploring space and improve our tech?

JumpCrisscross 2y ago
> What more important can we human beings do than exploring space and improve our tech? This is a value statement. Every answer from heroin to petting my cat is technically a valid answer. OP's question is written obnoxiously. But it raises a valid point: why should we do these things, and why should it matter to people who don't find it inherently valuable?

ungreased0675 2y ago

I wouldn’t put it that way, but I’d rather space exploration money focus on colonization and improving life on earth. For example, asteroid mining has massive potential. What if rare metals suddenly were no longer rare? What could we make? What if we had outposts on other planets? How might that change perspectives and culture on earth? How might R&D to colonize Mars make life on Earth more resilient and sustainable? Searching for life elsewhere seems so empty and unsatisfying. Almost like a religious quest for enlightenment or something. If we found a fossil snail on another planet, then what?

selectnull 2y ago
> Searching for life elsewhere seems so empty and unsatisfying. To me, finding any extra terrestrial life, or even just a fossil of past life, would be the most exciting find in the history.
- dotancohen 2y ago
  It would answer humanity's longest open philosophical question. The religious and social consequences would likely change the course of human history. Imagine humans no longer fighting each other, but rather working together towards a goal. I can think of nothing that would catalyze such a change more than the discovery of extra terrestrial life. Even climate change isn't doing it.
  - ungreased0675 2y ago
    How do you think the discovery of extraterrestrial life would do that? I think most people would say “that’s neat” and continue living their life unchanged.
    - XorNot 2y ago
      Yes, I guess new ideas have never contributed to any change in social dynamics ever. That's the course of history you know: the social psychology and accepted wisdom is exactly as it is now, unchanged from Roman times because no new thinking based on discovery or philosophy ever led to a shift in the structure and beliefs of society.

wheatgreaser 2y ago

nasa's budget is miniscule compared to the funds allocated to the military

rvnx 2y ago
They complete each other, first step is to explore other planets, then send the military to protect it and take the resources there before other nations.

space_oddity 2y ago

It might seem like a long shot, but exploring moons like Europa isn't just about finding life... It's about expanding our understanding of life's potential across the universe