8 ms·

iPhone 16 is much easier to repair

53 points by vincentchau 2y ago

aucisson_masque 2y ago
Are they seriously praising apple for repairability ? The same company that locks people people and third party company out of repairing their phone with parts that are serial coded. I don't know any other company that does that. And they can't even pretend it's for security like with faceid, it would be possible to wipe the phone when a part is not recognized. I'm sure people would be fine with it. I believe they are only making these changes to appease the law makers, and in the case of the battery because Europe said they will need to be replaceable. This is just corporate doing corporate stuff, nothing to praise. For me the day they locked me out of my apple watch because I dared to replace it's broken screen is when I realized apple is full of shit when it's about repairability and especially about environment.
- popol12 2y ago
  Well, they just introduced the “Repair Assistant” which allows you to pair new parts after a repair. They talk about it in this article, had you read it. But, yeah, about fucking time, I agree on that.
  - myspy 2y ago
    It's good that we go in a direction where we have accessibility to the devices components and the high end technology. I can't assess how easy it is for the layman to repair an iPhone, but the inertia is there to make a device longer usable.
  - aucisson_masque 2y ago
    i did read it in full but i knew too well apple to not trust it, i believe it's going to be another half done attempt that is overcomplicated and totally inefficient. Like, i don't know... the recent self repair program. cost as much as sending your device to apple but you get to do the manual labor and take the risk to break it. WHAT A DEAL ! Edit: went to look on the Repair Assistant, it sounded promising until i read that it requires you (who repair the phone) to be able to authenticate with the Apple Account of the owner of the phone that you are taking a part of. Basically it means that every iphone thrown away that the owner didn't take the time to remove it's apple account, and god knows people don't care about this even if they should, is useless. You also can't buy a part on the internet because how do you know it's been taken from a phone that got it's apple id logged off ? it throws away 90% of the available phone to scavenge. And most important, you can't buy third party parts. Why can i replace the shaft drive on my bmw, which is deadly important part, with third party shaft drive yet i can't replace iphone battery with a non apple one ?? Does apple consider us to be that retarded that we can't buy batteries from genuine reseller ?
    - mjamesaustin 2y ago
      Are you upset that you won't be able to buy stolen parts anymore? The fact that Apple will make it impossible to use stolen parts is a great feature for me as a customer. I want potential thieves to get nothing when they steal my phone. If I buy a phone from someone else, asking them to remove it from their account before the transaction is already a good idea, and trivial to do. Beyond the physical parts, I don't want any of their data or account info on my new phone.
      - Double_a_92 2y ago
        Where do you live that getting your phone stolen is a bigger concern than being able to repair your stuff? Thats more a society issue, not something that Apple needs to fix.
      - aucisson_masque 2y ago
        I'm not upset anymore since i ditch my iphone for an android, i'm merely pointing the corporate hypocrisy from apple. > If I buy a phone from someone else, asking them to remove it from their account before the transaction is already a good idea, and trivial to do. Beyond the physical parts, I don't want any of their data or account info on my new phone. Do it with the ssd then. you don't need to lock the screen, the battery or the faceid sensor. it makes no sense security wise. I'm all in for fighting against stealer and pickpocket, but also lucid enough to know that it doesn't prevent them from stealing it. They still steal them and then sell them on internet, only for people to buy it and receive a brick. It just doesn't work. And honestly if i get my samsung stolen, i'd rather know it's been resold by some scumbag, but still being used, than having it get shiped to india for 'recycling' into one of the many landfill site.
        syrgian 2y ago
        If you are going scam people with locked iPhones over the internet, why send an iPhone at all? You should just send a literal paperweight. It will serve the same purpose. It's not like the marketplace will be like "It's an iPhone. Even if it is locked, the seller is right. We will remove the negative rating and let the seller keep their reputation". By the way, I recently sold an iPhone 8 (through App, but the transfer was in person) and out of 5 potential buyers, all of them asked the same three questions: "Is it on and unlocked?, is it carrier sim-locked?, which is the battery %?".
  - Double_a_92 2y ago
    How about they just get rid of that nonsense instead?
- Sakos 2y ago
  All this just means that replacement parts are expensive, repairs are expensive and Apple continues to control the ecosystem. I can't believe people are praising Apple for it.
- terhechte 2y ago
  The reason they do the serial coding is to reduce the incentive for stealing iPhones. Due to locking, you can't really sell a stolen iPhone. Instead, thieves break it apart and sell the parts. Serial coding disincentives this. I know many people that had their iPhone stolen and it is an awful experience. I'm a simple man, I'd never have the ability to solder and fix my own phone. Instead of repairing it myself, I'd always go to an official repair shop. I'm not benefitting from non-coded parts. On the other hand, reducing the likelihood of people stealing my phone is a huge upside for me. So for me, and people like me, these measures that Apple takes are a net benefit. I understand that for tinkerers it is a different equation - but you have to agree that for the majority of iPhone owners the equation might also tip in favour of not having to worry about stolen phones instead of being able to fix their own hardware (which most normal people also would never do).
  - jocaal 2y ago
    This would be a valid response if first party parts were easily available to be bought directly from manufacturers.
    - argsnd 2y ago
      They are, https://selfservicerepair.com/home https://selfservicerepair.com/home
      - jocaal 2y ago
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qV4_mLw2BGM&t=270 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qV4_mLw2BGM&t=270 TLDW Apple has slow response times. Not all parts are available. Parts are super expensive. Liability with heavy NDA's.
        threeseed 2y ago
        Maybe you can talk about which parts are not available and/or are unreasonably expensive. Because looking at the repair site it looks pretty comprehensive and you can even hire everything you need for $49 a week.
- bzzzt 2y ago
  > I don't know any other company that does that. It's common in the car industry as well. Seems to be the reason my airbags are still in place after 10 years while a certain popular german brand here is uninsurable because it's not a question if but when the airbags will be stolen.
  - Etheryte 2y ago
    Yeah, wasn't it an Audi a few series back where the headlights were ridiculously expensive, but you didn't even need to unlock the car to remove the whole light fixture? If you had a long metal rod you could reach in under the light, release a hook and then just walk off with the lights.
icpmacdo 2y ago
Always cool to see innovative solutions like this
- nesarkvechnep 2y ago
  Forgot the /s
xandrius 2y ago
Let's just remember that the reason behind these "innovations" are strictly coming because of external pressures, if it wasn't for those, they would probably make the phones implode into a tiny black hole and charge you an implosion fee for that. Cool that they are doing this but it's not out of their own kind heart.
- euroderf 2y ago
  The EU being EUseful.
- chongli 2y ago
  I think it's important to recognize that morality does not apply to any corporation. Corporations respond to incentives and disincentives, that's it. If we want to change the way a corporation behaves we need to arrange things so that its incentives align with our own. People like to ascribe malice to Apple's history of making difficult-to-repair devices. I think that's wrong-headed. It's more appropriate to say that Apple had higher priorities such as miniaturization, performance, battery life, and ease of manufacture. Now that the right to repair movement has been gaining steam and regulations are being drafted, Apple has been given the incentive to prioritize repairability. Thus they are responding to that incentive with the iPhone 16 (with its new battery adhesive), the repair kits, and the documentation they've provided. They likely also see the opportunity to get ahead of their competitors and tout repairability as a competitive advantage. I would not be surprised at all to see future models have even higher repairability scores with Apple aiming to become the market leader. As for the serial numbering and activation of replacement parts: that also has a simple explanation that doesn't involve a nefarious lock-in plot. Witness the recent attacks in Lebanon. How were they carried out? By a supply-chain attack! This sort of capability represents more than a physical danger from explosives or chemical weapons, it's also a major cyber security and privacy threat. Supply-chain attacks via counterfeit, backdoored parts is a huge area of concern for Apple. The potential is there for the company to suffer severe reputational damage should a large-scale attack occur.
  - benoau 2y ago
    Downplaying how much Apple fought to prevent R2R around the world. Meanwhile Steam chose to make the Steam Deck as reparable as possible then revised it to be even easier. Both of these options exist, but Apple is one of the greediest companies in the world.
roschdal 2y ago
No.
Stem0037 2y ago
This is a significant step forward for Apple. As someone who's struggled with battery replacements in the past, I'm impressed by this innovation. The use of electrically debonding adhesive is clever and could be a game-changer for repairability. However, I'm curious about the long-term implications. Will this adhesive maintain its properties over the device's lifespan? And what about the environmental impact of this new material?
- morpheuskafka 2y ago
  I'm actually curious what would happen if the adhesive did stop working? The phone is so tightly packed, it doesn't seem like there is any room for the battery to move around anyway.
Double_a_92 2y ago
Or, crazy idea: Just use adhevise that isn't unnecessarily strong.
- sgt 2y ago
  How does your crazy idea perform when that adhesive comes loose after being exposed to 100 hours of vibration?
  - Double_a_92 2y ago
    The battery is still held in there pretty well even without any adhesive. See also: Any phone battery before ~2015.
impure 2y ago
This was mentioned in the Apple environmental report. They want their devices to be more repairable.
ChrisArchitect 2y ago
Related: Apple Shares Full iPhone 16 and iPhone 16 Pro Repair Manuals https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41606530 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41606530
ChrisArchitect 2y ago
More discussion on the iFixit post: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41623251 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41623251

53 points by vincentchau 2y ago

Are they seriously praising apple for repairability ? The same company that locks people people and third party company out of repairing their phone with parts that are serial coded. I don't know any other company that does that. And they can't even pretend it's for security like with faceid, it would be possible to wipe the phone when a part is not recognized. I'm sure people would be fine with it. I believe they are only making these changes to appease the law makers, and in the case of the battery because Europe said they will need to be replaceable. This is just corporate doing corporate stuff, nothing to praise. For me the day they locked me out of my apple watch because I dared to replace it's broken screen is when I realized apple is full of shit when it's about repairability and especially about environment.

popol12 2y ago
Well, they just introduced the “Repair Assistant” which allows you to pair new parts after a repair. They talk about it in this article, had you read it. But, yeah, about fucking time, I agree on that.
- myspy 2y ago
  It's good that we go in a direction where we have accessibility to the devices components and the high end technology. I can't assess how easy it is for the layman to repair an iPhone, but the inertia is there to make a device longer usable.
- aucisson_masque 2y ago
  i did read it in full but i knew too well apple to not trust it, i believe it's going to be another half done attempt that is overcomplicated and totally inefficient. Like, i don't know... the recent self repair program. cost as much as sending your device to apple but you get to do the manual labor and take the risk to break it. WHAT A DEAL ! Edit: went to look on the Repair Assistant, it sounded promising until i read that it requires you (who repair the phone) to be able to authenticate with the Apple Account of the owner of the phone that you are taking a part of. Basically it means that every iphone thrown away that the owner didn't take the time to remove it's apple account, and god knows people don't care about this even if they should, is useless. You also can't buy a part on the internet because how do you know it's been taken from a phone that got it's apple id logged off ? it throws away 90% of the available phone to scavenge. And most important, you can't buy third party parts. Why can i replace the shaft drive on my bmw, which is deadly important part, with third party shaft drive yet i can't replace iphone battery with a non apple one ?? Does apple consider us to be that retarded that we can't buy batteries from genuine reseller ?
  - mjamesaustin 2y ago
    Are you upset that you won't be able to buy stolen parts anymore? The fact that Apple will make it impossible to use stolen parts is a great feature for me as a customer. I want potential thieves to get nothing when they steal my phone. If I buy a phone from someone else, asking them to remove it from their account before the transaction is already a good idea, and trivial to do. Beyond the physical parts, I don't want any of their data or account info on my new phone.
    - Double_a_92 2y ago
      Where do you live that getting your phone stolen is a bigger concern than being able to repair your stuff? Thats more a society issue, not something that Apple needs to fix.
    - aucisson_masque 2y ago
      I'm not upset anymore since i ditch my iphone for an android, i'm merely pointing the corporate hypocrisy from apple. > If I buy a phone from someone else, asking them to remove it from their account before the transaction is already a good idea, and trivial to do. Beyond the physical parts, I don't want any of their data or account info on my new phone. Do it with the ssd then. you don't need to lock the screen, the battery or the faceid sensor. it makes no sense security wise. I'm all in for fighting against stealer and pickpocket, but also lucid enough to know that it doesn't prevent them from stealing it. They still steal them and then sell them on internet, only for people to buy it and receive a brick. It just doesn't work. And honestly if i get my samsung stolen, i'd rather know it's been resold by some scumbag, but still being used, than having it get shiped to india for 'recycling' into one of the many landfill site.
      - syrgian 2y ago
        If you are going scam people with locked iPhones over the internet, why send an iPhone at all? You should just send a literal paperweight. It will serve the same purpose. It's not like the marketplace will be like "It's an iPhone. Even if it is locked, the seller is right. We will remove the negative rating and let the seller keep their reputation". By the way, I recently sold an iPhone 8 (through App, but the transfer was in person) and out of 5 potential buyers, all of them asked the same three questions: "Is it on and unlocked?, is it carrier sim-locked?, which is the battery %?".
- Double_a_92 2y ago
  How about they just get rid of that nonsense instead?
Sakos 2y ago
All this just means that replacement parts are expensive, repairs are expensive and Apple continues to control the ecosystem. I can't believe people are praising Apple for it.
terhechte 2y ago
The reason they do the serial coding is to reduce the incentive for stealing iPhones. Due to locking, you can't really sell a stolen iPhone. Instead, thieves break it apart and sell the parts. Serial coding disincentives this. I know many people that had their iPhone stolen and it is an awful experience. I'm a simple man, I'd never have the ability to solder and fix my own phone. Instead of repairing it myself, I'd always go to an official repair shop. I'm not benefitting from non-coded parts. On the other hand, reducing the likelihood of people stealing my phone is a huge upside for me. So for me, and people like me, these measures that Apple takes are a net benefit. I understand that for tinkerers it is a different equation - but you have to agree that for the majority of iPhone owners the equation might also tip in favour of not having to worry about stolen phones instead of being able to fix their own hardware (which most normal people also would never do).
- jocaal 2y ago
  This would be a valid response if first party parts were easily available to be bought directly from manufacturers.
  - argsnd 2y ago
    They are, https://selfservicerepair.com/home https://selfservicerepair.com/home
    - jocaal 2y ago
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qV4_mLw2BGM&t=270 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qV4_mLw2BGM&t=270 TLDW Apple has slow response times. Not all parts are available. Parts are super expensive. Liability with heavy NDA's.
      - threeseed 2y ago
        Maybe you can talk about which parts are not available and/or are unreasonably expensive. Because looking at the repair site it looks pretty comprehensive and you can even hire everything you need for $49 a week.
bzzzt 2y ago
> I don't know any other company that does that. It's common in the car industry as well. Seems to be the reason my airbags are still in place after 10 years while a certain popular german brand here is uninsurable because it's not a question if but when the airbags will be stolen.
- Etheryte 2y ago
  Yeah, wasn't it an Audi a few series back where the headlights were ridiculously expensive, but you didn't even need to unlock the car to remove the whole light fixture? If you had a long metal rod you could reach in under the light, release a hook and then just walk off with the lights.

icpmacdo 2y ago

Always cool to see innovative solutions like this

nesarkvechnep 2y ago
Forgot the /s

xandrius 2y ago

Let's just remember that the reason behind these "innovations" are strictly coming because of external pressures, if it wasn't for those, they would probably make the phones implode into a tiny black hole and charge you an implosion fee for that. Cool that they are doing this but it's not out of their own kind heart.

euroderf 2y ago
The EU being EUseful.
chongli 2y ago
I think it's important to recognize that morality does not apply to any corporation. Corporations respond to incentives and disincentives, that's it. If we want to change the way a corporation behaves we need to arrange things so that its incentives align with our own. People like to ascribe malice to Apple's history of making difficult-to-repair devices. I think that's wrong-headed. It's more appropriate to say that Apple had higher priorities such as miniaturization, performance, battery life, and ease of manufacture. Now that the right to repair movement has been gaining steam and regulations are being drafted, Apple has been given the incentive to prioritize repairability. Thus they are responding to that incentive with the iPhone 16 (with its new battery adhesive), the repair kits, and the documentation they've provided. They likely also see the opportunity to get ahead of their competitors and tout repairability as a competitive advantage. I would not be surprised at all to see future models have even higher repairability scores with Apple aiming to become the market leader. As for the serial numbering and activation of replacement parts: that also has a simple explanation that doesn't involve a nefarious lock-in plot. Witness the recent attacks in Lebanon. How were they carried out? By a supply-chain attack! This sort of capability represents more than a physical danger from explosives or chemical weapons, it's also a major cyber security and privacy threat. Supply-chain attacks via counterfeit, backdoored parts is a huge area of concern for Apple. The potential is there for the company to suffer severe reputational damage should a large-scale attack occur.
- benoau 2y ago
  Downplaying how much Apple fought to prevent R2R around the world. Meanwhile Steam chose to make the Steam Deck as reparable as possible then revised it to be even easier. Both of these options exist, but Apple is one of the greediest companies in the world.

roschdal 2y ago

No.

Stem0037 2y ago

This is a significant step forward for Apple. As someone who's struggled with battery replacements in the past, I'm impressed by this innovation. The use of electrically debonding adhesive is clever and could be a game-changer for repairability. However, I'm curious about the long-term implications. Will this adhesive maintain its properties over the device's lifespan? And what about the environmental impact of this new material?

morpheuskafka 2y ago
I'm actually curious what would happen if the adhesive did stop working? The phone is so tightly packed, it doesn't seem like there is any room for the battery to move around anyway.

Double_a_92 2y ago

Or, crazy idea: Just use adhevise that isn't unnecessarily strong.

sgt 2y ago
How does your crazy idea perform when that adhesive comes loose after being exposed to 100 hours of vibration?
- Double_a_92 2y ago
  The battery is still held in there pretty well even without any adhesive. See also: Any phone battery before ~2015.

impure 2y ago

This was mentioned in the Apple environmental report. They want their devices to be more repairable.

ChrisArchitect 2y ago

Related: Apple Shares Full iPhone 16 and iPhone 16 Pro Repair Manuals https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41606530 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41606530

ChrisArchitect 2y ago

More discussion on the iFixit post: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41623251 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41623251