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> Not once had I any serious issues updating when pulling new updated images I've run it for about a year until the upgrade tipped me over. I am sure that corr

> Not once had I any serious issues updating when pulling new updated images I've run it for about a year until the upgrade tipped me over. I am sure that correct upgrades (n to n+1) are fine - I tried n to n+2 and instead of explaining to me that this is not possible, Nextcloud explained to me that this is not possible and fucked up big my install. I had to recover from a backup.

VertanaNinjai 2y ago
So they told you that’s not supported and don’t do it. You then did it and seem surprised at a bad outcome. And you’re blaming the software and/or vendor?
- BrandoElFollito 2y ago
  Seriously do you think that for software that manages data the proper way is for someone who starts the upgrade process to say "this is not supported, and now we fucked up your database and you cannot recover from that"? They knew that I was upgrading N+2, this is not a surprise - and I did not realize that upgrading N+2 is not supported. The proper way would be to abort the upgrade upon discovering that I am going for an unsupported way. This is not serious software.
  - stavros 2y ago
    I don't understand how commenters here can seriously argue this. There should be no UX for "oh this is not supported? Eh give it a shot anyway, I don't care about literally all my files". If you don't support upgrading, don't expose that in the UI. There's no excuse for having UI that will let the user do something unsupported and then screw up their data.
    - rustcleaner 2y ago
      Not saying it's the case here, but I wonder how much deniably malicious incompetence out there gets covertly injected into projects by competitors.
      - stavros 2y ago
        That's a very interesting conspiracy theory, I assume the amount is nonzero.
        jospoortvliet 2y ago
        It's risky business, though, as code of course gets reviewed a few times (at least at Nextcloud). If it gets detected once ppl are put on notice. If somebody can squirrel out that the code came from a competitor, a lawsuit is waiting... And just imagine the bad publicity it causes. Besides that, it is unethical and I wouldn't want to work at a company that pulls such stunts. I think a lot of people wouldn't. It'd be hard to keep secret, too, I mean, 5 years later the employee that was asked to do it works somewhere else and BOOM. So all together, I think it's extremely unlikely to happen. I CAN imagine a disgruntled ex employee or angry employee at a competitor would pull something like this. We have seen employees at a competitor create social media sock puppet accounts to spread FUD about us - but management at the competitor put a stop to that once we notified them.
thowawatp302 2y ago
Why did you do that when the instructions say not to?
- donmcronald 2y ago
  I don't understand why this attitude is so prevalent in the tech industry. The person writing the upgrade script knows if upgrades can't support n+2 jumps and it takes about 30s to build in a check: if(target_version > current_version + 1) // not allowed It's more work to add it to the docs than it is to put a fail-fast check in the upgrade script, so why put it in the docs where 250k+ admins need to be aware of the limitation and avoid it? It might be creating 100k hours of waste on the sysadmin side to save 30m of work on the dev side. I just don't get it.
  - rustcleaner 2y ago
    It's to sit at the top of the tower smugly. I know because truthfully I enjoy it myself from time to time, we all do in our own little ways. :^)
  - jospoortvliet 2y ago
    This is, of course, exactly what Nextcloud does. It will most certainly refuse to run and break your system. And yes, it also refused that 3-4 years ago. Not saying it never breaks anything, but since 2016 we for example check PHP versions and other infra to not update to a broken system. We rewrote the updater in 2016 for this purpose. It's possible this has had a bug at some point of course - but it is more likely that the original poster who had this issue had this in the ownCloud times before 2016.
GTP 2y ago
Strange, my experience is that, if I don't upgrade in a while, the automatic updater goes to the next version, and after installing it it tells me there's another update and so on. Or maybe you didn't use the built-in updater?
- BrandoElFollito 2y ago
  I did use the built in updater. It was 3 or 4 years ago so things may have changed

VertanaNinjai 2y ago

So they told you that’s not supported and don’t do it. You then did it and seem surprised at a bad outcome. And you’re blaming the software and/or vendor?

BrandoElFollito 2y ago
Seriously do you think that for software that manages data the proper way is for someone who starts the upgrade process to say "this is not supported, and now we fucked up your database and you cannot recover from that"? They knew that I was upgrading N+2, this is not a surprise - and I did not realize that upgrading N+2 is not supported. The proper way would be to abort the upgrade upon discovering that I am going for an unsupported way. This is not serious software.
- stavros 2y ago
  I don't understand how commenters here can seriously argue this. There should be no UX for "oh this is not supported? Eh give it a shot anyway, I don't care about literally all my files". If you don't support upgrading, don't expose that in the UI. There's no excuse for having UI that will let the user do something unsupported and then screw up their data.
  - rustcleaner 2y ago
    Not saying it's the case here, but I wonder how much deniably malicious incompetence out there gets covertly injected into projects by competitors.
    - stavros 2y ago
      That's a very interesting conspiracy theory, I assume the amount is nonzero.
      - jospoortvliet 2y ago
        It's risky business, though, as code of course gets reviewed a few times (at least at Nextcloud). If it gets detected once ppl are put on notice. If somebody can squirrel out that the code came from a competitor, a lawsuit is waiting... And just imagine the bad publicity it causes. Besides that, it is unethical and I wouldn't want to work at a company that pulls such stunts. I think a lot of people wouldn't. It'd be hard to keep secret, too, I mean, 5 years later the employee that was asked to do it works somewhere else and BOOM. So all together, I think it's extremely unlikely to happen. I CAN imagine a disgruntled ex employee or angry employee at a competitor would pull something like this. We have seen employees at a competitor create social media sock puppet accounts to spread FUD about us - but management at the competitor put a stop to that once we notified them.

thowawatp302 2y ago

Why did you do that when the instructions say not to?

donmcronald 2y ago
I don't understand why this attitude is so prevalent in the tech industry. The person writing the upgrade script knows if upgrades can't support n+2 jumps and it takes about 30s to build in a check: if(target_version > current_version + 1) // not allowed It's more work to add it to the docs than it is to put a fail-fast check in the upgrade script, so why put it in the docs where 250k+ admins need to be aware of the limitation and avoid it? It might be creating 100k hours of waste on the sysadmin side to save 30m of work on the dev side. I just don't get it.
- rustcleaner 2y ago
  It's to sit at the top of the tower smugly. I know because truthfully I enjoy it myself from time to time, we all do in our own little ways. :^)
- jospoortvliet 2y ago
  This is, of course, exactly what Nextcloud does. It will most certainly refuse to run and break your system. And yes, it also refused that 3-4 years ago. Not saying it never breaks anything, but since 2016 we for example check PHP versions and other infra to not update to a broken system. We rewrote the updater in 2016 for this purpose. It's possible this has had a bug at some point of course - but it is more likely that the original poster who had this issue had this in the ownCloud times before 2016.

GTP 2y ago

Strange, my experience is that, if I don't upgrade in a while, the automatic updater goes to the next version, and after installing it it tells me there's another update and so on. Or maybe you didn't use the built-in updater?

BrandoElFollito 2y ago
I did use the built in updater. It was 3 or 4 years ago so things may have changed