4 ms·

I'm in the camp that thinks celebrities take way too much mental space of the regular person on the internet. It distorts ones ability to differentiate as there

by 127 2y ago

I'm in the camp that thinks celebrities take way too much mental space of the regular person on the internet. It distorts ones ability to differentiate as there are these huge gravity centers that everybody makes comparisons to, even subconsciously. If Scarlett Johansson wasn't famous and Sam Altman didn't offer her the job, everybody would have no trouble in recognizing the differences in the voice. Priming is an extraordinarily powerful cognitive bias.

johnnyanmac 2y ago
you're being a bit misleading here by implying that humans have perfect voice recognition to begin with. Try to go to a foreign language and figure out the difference between 10 famous voices. Odds are at least half of them will blend to you. Becuase you do not spend everyday listening to that language. Now try and find a person who has a similar voice to your parent, then ask 10 random people to see if they can tell the difference. I'm sure 8/10 wouldn't be able to. I'm sure you can, though. Voice recognition is a mix of factors, which includes familiarity and language processing. If Scarlet wasn't famous, it wouldn't have been as huge an issue because not enough fans would be familiar enough. Friends would still complain though. >and Sam Altman didn't offer her the job Handwaving this doesn't help. That's the entire basis of Ford v. Milton that made Ford lose the case. You can't just go behind a VA's back once they decline and use their likeness anyway. Even outside of law, that's just scummy.
- pmarreck 2y ago
  I googled "Ford v. Milton" and found something regarding the "slayer's rule", which is unlikely to be what you were referring to... The whole point I made was that it was not her "likeness". Except in the way that the voice of any young woman speaking clearly resembles the voice of any other young woman speaking clearly, because I would argue that if you took 10 random young women's voices who speak clearly (say, 10 voice actresses) and listened to them all together, you wouldn't be able to distinguish them much either.
  - johnnyanmac 2y ago
    Apologies. The case is Midler v. Ford Motor Co. >a United States Court of Appeals case in which Bette Midler sought remedy against Ford Motor Company for a series of commercials in the 1980s which used a Midler impersonator. The case brought into question if a unique feature, such as a voice, can distinguish someone and thus must be authorized for impersonation.
    - pmarreck 2y ago
      Wow, interesting and relevant case! I am very narrowly on the side of Midler here, only because they ALSO used her song (and even though the copyright owner of the song agreed to it). I don't think OpenAI's use of the other voice actress falls under the purview of this case though. If I was defending such a case (IANAL), I'd hire 10 voice actresses of the same age and record them saying the same thing and see if the jury could detect the differences among them and to what degree.
pmarreck 2y ago
Thank you. This is 100% correct (IMHO).

by 127 2y ago

johnnyanmac 2y ago

you're being a bit misleading here by implying that humans have perfect voice recognition to begin with. Try to go to a foreign language and figure out the difference between 10 famous voices. Odds are at least half of them will blend to you. Becuase you do not spend everyday listening to that language. Now try and find a person who has a similar voice to your parent, then ask 10 random people to see if they can tell the difference. I'm sure 8/10 wouldn't be able to. I'm sure you can, though. Voice recognition is a mix of factors, which includes familiarity and language processing. If Scarlet wasn't famous, it wouldn't have been as huge an issue because not enough fans would be familiar enough. Friends would still complain though. >and Sam Altman didn't offer her the job Handwaving this doesn't help. That's the entire basis of Ford v. Milton that made Ford lose the case. You can't just go behind a VA's back once they decline and use their likeness anyway. Even outside of law, that's just scummy.

pmarreck 2y ago
I googled "Ford v. Milton" and found something regarding the "slayer's rule", which is unlikely to be what you were referring to... The whole point I made was that it was not her "likeness". Except in the way that the voice of any young woman speaking clearly resembles the voice of any other young woman speaking clearly, because I would argue that if you took 10 random young women's voices who speak clearly (say, 10 voice actresses) and listened to them all together, you wouldn't be able to distinguish them much either.
- johnnyanmac 2y ago
  Apologies. The case is Midler v. Ford Motor Co. >a United States Court of Appeals case in which Bette Midler sought remedy against Ford Motor Company for a series of commercials in the 1980s which used a Midler impersonator. The case brought into question if a unique feature, such as a voice, can distinguish someone and thus must be authorized for impersonation.
  - pmarreck 2y ago
    Wow, interesting and relevant case! I am very narrowly on the side of Midler here, only because they ALSO used her song (and even though the copyright owner of the song agreed to it). I don't think OpenAI's use of the other voice actress falls under the purview of this case though. If I was defending such a case (IANAL), I'd hire 10 voice actresses of the same age and record them saying the same thing and see if the jury could detect the differences among them and to what degree.

pmarreck 2y ago

Thank you. This is 100% correct (IMHO).