4 ms·

So that was how long ago? I guess the super zoom satellite footage from movies might not be unrealistic like I thought. . .

sbierwagen 2y ago
There's a hard physical limit (the Rayleigh criterion) on the resolution of an optical system by how big the open end is. You won't get "super zoom" capabilities without a satellite the size of a stadium. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KH-11_KENNEN#Resolution_and_ground_sample_distance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KH-11_KENNEN#Resolution_and_gr...
- alganet 2y ago
  What about multiple satellites working to get one image? Like the arrays we have on Earth pointing to space, but instead, arrays on space pointing to Earth. I know there probably isn't that many KH-style satellites to do it, but would it be possible?
  - GlenTheMachine 2y ago
    The alignment has to be better than half a wavelength. That's doable for RF, but for optical telescopes you're talking nanometers. That's not possible (currently or in the foreseeable future) for a spacecraft constellation.
    - sbierwagen 2y ago
      Amusingly enough, there's been some groundwork laid here by gravity wave interferometer constellations: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_Interferometer_Space_Antenna https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_Interferometer_Space_Ant... You could imagine a deep-infrared mission (longer wavelength, to soften the alignment requirements) launched into deep space (Jupiter+) where both the solar wind density is lower (reducing space weather perturbations) and reduced solar flux would reduce heat loads on the structure, (objects in Jupiter orbit get 3.6% as much light as in Earth orbits) making cooling easier. An interferometer design would also improve resolution. A not-widely advertised feature of the JWST is that, due to the same Rayleigh limits, its far infrared modes have dramatically lower resolution than its near infrared camera. A problem with a 6 meter mirror, less of a problem with a kilometer mirror.
    - wuming2 2y ago
      I remembered European Southern Observatory employing optical interferometry on the ground. And indeed it does: https://www.eso.org/public/news/eso1905/ https://www.eso.org/public/news/eso1905/
- wkat4242 2y ago
  Cool to see Clifford Stoll mentioned there, he was also the one detecting one of the first international state-sponsored hacking attacks on the US and wrote a book about it, The Cuckoo's Egg.
coolspot 2y ago
In 2022 Trump declassified this satellite picture showing amazing resolution of current generation: https://media.npr.org/assets/img/2019/09/05/ap_19243153034473_custom-c1ad60c7bc2267a1eae7e449ed88497dde3d33d4-s1100-c50.jpg https://media.npr.org/assets/img/2019/09/05/ap_1924315303447...
- pests 2y ago
  By declassified, you mean accidently tweeted a cell phone picture of the image printed out. Which is his right, just wanted to add context.
  - adastra22 2y ago
    It wasn't on accident.
    - riedel 2y ago
      Depends on what you call the accident. However, we will only know after November 5th.
      - pests 2y ago
        No no, he is actually correct and I misspoke. He definitely tweeted on purpose (haha) but did he intend to declassify the image or just didn't realize?
        adastra22 2y ago
        Yes he quite possibly unintentionally revealed US spy satellite capabilities with an otherwise purposeful tweet. I say the not out of niceness to give him the benefit of the doubt, but because he's probably too stupid to understand the implications of what he was doing.
        me-vs-cat 2y ago
        According to NBC[1], attempts were made to explain the ramifications to him. At that point, he knew he was declassifying the photo and knew he was revealing what his experts told him shouldn't be revealed. He simply didn't care. [1] https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/oval-office-incident-2019-perfectly-illustrates-trumps-approach-state-rcna43293 https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/oval-offi...
philistine 2y ago
Trump famously tweeted images from an Iranian launch facility that had exploded. They were incredibly revealing of US satellite capabilities, even though that was probably not as zoomed-in as they could go. https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/oval-office-incident-2019-perfectly-illustrates-trumps-approach-state-rcna43293 https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/oval-offi...

sbierwagen 2y ago

There's a hard physical limit (the Rayleigh criterion) on the resolution of an optical system by how big the open end is. You won't get "super zoom" capabilities without a satellite the size of a stadium. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KH-11_KENNEN#Resolution_and_ground_sample_distance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KH-11_KENNEN#Resolution_and_gr...

alganet 2y ago
What about multiple satellites working to get one image? Like the arrays we have on Earth pointing to space, but instead, arrays on space pointing to Earth. I know there probably isn't that many KH-style satellites to do it, but would it be possible?
- GlenTheMachine 2y ago
  The alignment has to be better than half a wavelength. That's doable for RF, but for optical telescopes you're talking nanometers. That's not possible (currently or in the foreseeable future) for a spacecraft constellation.
  - sbierwagen 2y ago
    Amusingly enough, there's been some groundwork laid here by gravity wave interferometer constellations: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_Interferometer_Space_Antenna https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_Interferometer_Space_Ant... You could imagine a deep-infrared mission (longer wavelength, to soften the alignment requirements) launched into deep space (Jupiter+) where both the solar wind density is lower (reducing space weather perturbations) and reduced solar flux would reduce heat loads on the structure, (objects in Jupiter orbit get 3.6% as much light as in Earth orbits) making cooling easier. An interferometer design would also improve resolution. A not-widely advertised feature of the JWST is that, due to the same Rayleigh limits, its far infrared modes have dramatically lower resolution than its near infrared camera. A problem with a 6 meter mirror, less of a problem with a kilometer mirror.
  - wuming2 2y ago
    I remembered European Southern Observatory employing optical interferometry on the ground. And indeed it does: https://www.eso.org/public/news/eso1905/ https://www.eso.org/public/news/eso1905/
wkat4242 2y ago
Cool to see Clifford Stoll mentioned there, he was also the one detecting one of the first international state-sponsored hacking attacks on the US and wrote a book about it, The Cuckoo's Egg.

coolspot 2y ago

In 2022 Trump declassified this satellite picture showing amazing resolution of current generation: https://media.npr.org/assets/img/2019/09/05/ap_19243153034473_custom-c1ad60c7bc2267a1eae7e449ed88497dde3d33d4-s1100-c50.jpg https://media.npr.org/assets/img/2019/09/05/ap_1924315303447...

pests 2y ago
By declassified, you mean accidently tweeted a cell phone picture of the image printed out. Which is his right, just wanted to add context.
- adastra22 2y ago
  It wasn't on accident.
  - riedel 2y ago
    Depends on what you call the accident. However, we will only know after November 5th.
    - pests 2y ago
      No no, he is actually correct and I misspoke. He definitely tweeted on purpose (haha) but did he intend to declassify the image or just didn't realize?
      - adastra22 2y ago
        Yes he quite possibly unintentionally revealed US spy satellite capabilities with an otherwise purposeful tweet. I say the not out of niceness to give him the benefit of the doubt, but because he's probably too stupid to understand the implications of what he was doing.
      - me-vs-cat 2y ago
        According to NBC[1], attempts were made to explain the ramifications to him. At that point, he knew he was declassifying the photo and knew he was revealing what his experts told him shouldn't be revealed. He simply didn't care. [1] https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/oval-office-incident-2019-perfectly-illustrates-trumps-approach-state-rcna43293 https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/oval-offi...

philistine 2y ago

Trump famously tweeted images from an Iranian launch facility that had exploded. They were incredibly revealing of US satellite capabilities, even though that was probably not as zoomed-in as they could go. https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/oval-office-incident-2019-perfectly-illustrates-trumps-approach-state-rcna43293 https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/oval-offi...