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I wish that this was seen as a good thing, not a bad thing. Everyone who wants an iPhone already has one, Apple makes good products that last, and new phones th

I wish that this was seen as a good thing, not a bad thing. Everyone who wants an iPhone already has one, Apple makes good products that last, and new phones these days are incremental updates rather than revolutionary new products, so there’s not a large incentive to upgrade.

RockRobotRock 2y ago
I agree! People also criticize Apple harshly for not massively redesigning the iPhone every year. That's a positive in my view.
- gregoriol 2y ago
  Then they shouldn't release one every year.
  - poincaredisk 2y ago
    Why not? They can release a slightly improved version every year. I know that some people feel obliged to stay on the "latest version" and buy a new iphone every year, but it's their decision.
    - gregoriol 2y ago
      It would reduce this compulsive behaviour, reduce the waste of boxes and transport, reduce industrial complexity and costs.
      - Terretta 2y ago
        Their ability to manage the "industrial complexity" is an incredible competitive advantage, and means than in consumer comparisons among flagship models, theirs is rarely behind. This would not be the case if they had every other year releases, that would leave the off years open to attack by, say, Samsung, "Why buy last year's phone when you can get a current model?" It doesn't mean consumers are or have to update every year, it's about having something up to date when the consumer goes phone shopping. As for reducing compulsive behavior, nobody's forcing anyone to update. If one looks beneath the glass, Apple generally updates on a "tick tock" (more obvious when every other model was called "S"). Look back at the S years, and you see those generally tried out the new camera systems and other non-phone internals, while the integer models were the phone capability updates. Folks more interested in the camera or processing tended to upgrade on S years, folks wanting "new" designs or looking for mobile (radio) updates tended to upgrade on integer years. Apple still does this, though a less clear tick tock, and are now cascading these features. Think of it as a kind of "canary" release channel, with the "Pro" features being constrained production till it ramps, and those same features can go in the next cycle's base model (as made clear across the 14, 15, and 16 models' feature cascade. Once they have this cascade flowing, it allows a much longer subcomponent life cycle (as the subcomponents can be used across multiple generations without having to do a repackage. That's fantastic for reducing waste reduction, industrial complexity, defraying costs across many model years, all the things you say you want. Automobiles do a similar thing with their "platforms" that change slowly and are used across models or even across badges, even as "model years" refresh each year. It's far more efficient for both pre-assembly and post sale supply chains.
        gregoriol 2y ago
        Other brands are releasing yearly new devices because they like to copy Apple
  - joshstrange 2y ago
    Every year we get some level of improvement to the phone. Year-to-year it might be relatively minor but it’s /always/ an improvement (less power usage, more cpu power, more GPU power, more ml power, etc). These, sometimes, small improvements add up so that if you upgrade every 2-4 years they can cumulatively add up to a big improvement. People complain about Apple comparing the new iPhone (or MBP) to a 2-3 year ago model saying it’s just so they can say it’s 50%/100%/etc faster but for the vast majority of people that /is/ the model they are upgrading from. While us nerds might want to gauge the year-to-year gain the average consumer benefits more from it being compared to what they have (a 2-4 year old device). This method also lets people upgrade whenever they want (“on ramps” every year) vs having to wait X years for the next release or having to replace a broken phone with a N-2 year version because new phones only come out ever few years.
  - manuelmoreale 2y ago
    I know this is not going to happen for obvious marketing reasons but they should just drop the number, call it iPhone and stop making these pointless presentations. Then just drop a press release when they tweak something worth knowing about. Everything is so incremental that doing entirely presentations feels rather dumb.
  - JCharante 2y ago
    Why? We don’t force software to not ship non-major versions. Why does hardware have to be that way?
    - ornornor 2y ago
      Shareholders’ expectations I suspect.
  - pjmlp 2y ago
    Think of the poor shareholders. Plus US has this strange thing where shareholders can sue the CEO if they think not enough is being done.
maximus-decimus 2y ago
I bought a note 8 6 years ago and honestly, I don't see why I would ever need anything better than that. We've reached peak phone a long time ago.
- psb217 2y ago
  Mostly to keep up with website/app bloat, and better cameras if you like taking photos or videos. Other improvements like better screens or battery life are nice too, but only really noticeable if you're jumping a few phone generations at a time.
ornornor 2y ago
Also, paying 1000+$ for a… phone is insane when you think about it.
- mostlysimilar 2y ago
  Not a phone, a mobile computer with a lot of connectivity, senors, compute power, etc.
  - hu3 2y ago
    iPhone? A very restricted mobile computer. You can barely choose what software runs on it.
    - musicale 2y ago
      Kind of a shame that Windows Phone died.
      - hu3 2y ago
        Indeed. We need competition
  - ornornor 2y ago
    Nevertheless, it is a lot of money to ask for something you will drop, break, lose, replace in a couple of years because its battery has failed. And you can’t even really do what you want with it.
    - Gud 2y ago
      Define “a couple of years”. I am using an iPhone 11 Pro and only just now am I upgrading to a 16 pro, mostly for the camera. The phone itself still works well, including the battery.
      - ornornor 2y ago
        Most iPhone users keep their phones less than three years: https://9to5mac.com/2023/05/10/how-long-people-keep-iphones/ https://9to5mac.com/2023/05/10/how-long-people-keep-iphones/ I’m also buying used iPhones and keeping them longer than that but we’re outliers.
dkobia 2y ago
The iPhone, and really, most phones today, are pretty amazing pieces of technology in a glass slab. Expecting phenomenal changes between versions at this point might be asking for too much. Apple stuck itself in a corner with "stock" driven development.

RockRobotRock 2y ago

I agree! People also criticize Apple harshly for not massively redesigning the iPhone every year. That's a positive in my view.

gregoriol 2y ago
Then they shouldn't release one every year.
- poincaredisk 2y ago
  Why not? They can release a slightly improved version every year. I know that some people feel obliged to stay on the "latest version" and buy a new iphone every year, but it's their decision.
  - gregoriol 2y ago
    It would reduce this compulsive behaviour, reduce the waste of boxes and transport, reduce industrial complexity and costs.
    - Terretta 2y ago
      Their ability to manage the "industrial complexity" is an incredible competitive advantage, and means than in consumer comparisons among flagship models, theirs is rarely behind. This would not be the case if they had every other year releases, that would leave the off years open to attack by, say, Samsung, "Why buy last year's phone when you can get a current model?" It doesn't mean consumers are or have to update every year, it's about having something up to date when the consumer goes phone shopping. As for reducing compulsive behavior, nobody's forcing anyone to update. If one looks beneath the glass, Apple generally updates on a "tick tock" (more obvious when every other model was called "S"). Look back at the S years, and you see those generally tried out the new camera systems and other non-phone internals, while the integer models were the phone capability updates. Folks more interested in the camera or processing tended to upgrade on S years, folks wanting "new" designs or looking for mobile (radio) updates tended to upgrade on integer years. Apple still does this, though a less clear tick tock, and are now cascading these features. Think of it as a kind of "canary" release channel, with the "Pro" features being constrained production till it ramps, and those same features can go in the next cycle's base model (as made clear across the 14, 15, and 16 models' feature cascade. Once they have this cascade flowing, it allows a much longer subcomponent life cycle (as the subcomponents can be used across multiple generations without having to do a repackage. That's fantastic for reducing waste reduction, industrial complexity, defraying costs across many model years, all the things you say you want. Automobiles do a similar thing with their "platforms" that change slowly and are used across models or even across badges, even as "model years" refresh each year. It's far more efficient for both pre-assembly and post sale supply chains.
      - gregoriol 2y ago
        Other brands are releasing yearly new devices because they like to copy Apple
- joshstrange 2y ago
  Every year we get some level of improvement to the phone. Year-to-year it might be relatively minor but it’s /always/ an improvement (less power usage, more cpu power, more GPU power, more ml power, etc). These, sometimes, small improvements add up so that if you upgrade every 2-4 years they can cumulatively add up to a big improvement. People complain about Apple comparing the new iPhone (or MBP) to a 2-3 year ago model saying it’s just so they can say it’s 50%/100%/etc faster but for the vast majority of people that /is/ the model they are upgrading from. While us nerds might want to gauge the year-to-year gain the average consumer benefits more from it being compared to what they have (a 2-4 year old device). This method also lets people upgrade whenever they want (“on ramps” every year) vs having to wait X years for the next release or having to replace a broken phone with a N-2 year version because new phones only come out ever few years.
- manuelmoreale 2y ago
  I know this is not going to happen for obvious marketing reasons but they should just drop the number, call it iPhone and stop making these pointless presentations. Then just drop a press release when they tweak something worth knowing about. Everything is so incremental that doing entirely presentations feels rather dumb.
- JCharante 2y ago
  Why? We don’t force software to not ship non-major versions. Why does hardware have to be that way?
  - ornornor 2y ago
    Shareholders’ expectations I suspect.
- pjmlp 2y ago
  Think of the poor shareholders. Plus US has this strange thing where shareholders can sue the CEO if they think not enough is being done.

maximus-decimus 2y ago

I bought a note 8 6 years ago and honestly, I don't see why I would ever need anything better than that. We've reached peak phone a long time ago.

psb217 2y ago
Mostly to keep up with website/app bloat, and better cameras if you like taking photos or videos. Other improvements like better screens or battery life are nice too, but only really noticeable if you're jumping a few phone generations at a time.

ornornor 2y ago

Also, paying 1000+$ for a… phone is insane when you think about it.

mostlysimilar 2y ago
Not a phone, a mobile computer with a lot of connectivity, senors, compute power, etc.
- hu3 2y ago
  iPhone? A very restricted mobile computer. You can barely choose what software runs on it.
  - musicale 2y ago
    Kind of a shame that Windows Phone died.
    - hu3 2y ago
      Indeed. We need competition
- ornornor 2y ago
  Nevertheless, it is a lot of money to ask for something you will drop, break, lose, replace in a couple of years because its battery has failed. And you can’t even really do what you want with it.
  - Gud 2y ago
    Define “a couple of years”. I am using an iPhone 11 Pro and only just now am I upgrading to a 16 pro, mostly for the camera. The phone itself still works well, including the battery.
    - ornornor 2y ago
      Most iPhone users keep their phones less than three years: https://9to5mac.com/2023/05/10/how-long-people-keep-iphones/ https://9to5mac.com/2023/05/10/how-long-people-keep-iphones/ I’m also buying used iPhones and keeping them longer than that but we’re outliers.

dkobia 2y ago

The iPhone, and really, most phones today, are pretty amazing pieces of technology in a glass slab. Expecting phenomenal changes between versions at this point might be asking for too much. Apple stuck itself in a corner with "stock" driven development.