5 ms·

I wish someone would measure the bang-for-the-buck without considering politically correct metrics.

lotsofpulp 2y ago
Bang for the buck exists if you get into a top 10 or 20 school where admission standards are so high that people are impressed simply by the fact that you were admitted and/or you get to network with resourceful people. Otherwise, any state university should suffice. A few states have some state schools with very low acceptance rates and difficulty to get in that might serve to advertise/network you better than another state school. If it’s not hard to get admitted, then just buy the education with the lower price.
- BirAdam 2y ago
  You also network with old money, the politically connected, and the global elite. The “top” universities don’t really need to be better, they just need to have the correct names and the prestige to attract those names. You may have the best professor teaching all the most useful knowledge in the middle of no where state university, but the folks attending won’t have as much opportunity despite their education because they won’t get connected to money or to power.
  - WalterBright 2y ago
    An obscure university offering a first class education isn't going to be obscure for long.
DoreenMichele 2y ago
Viewing college through this lens is part of the problem. It's college as job training, not education. Real education covers more than "skills and credentials I need to get a well-paid job."
- WalterBright 2y ago
  > Real education covers more than "skills and credentials I need to get a well-paid job." I'm curious what real education would be that does not impart a skill that others are willing to pay for? I speak as someone who selected classes based on maximizing skills that would be useful in the career I wanted.
  - itronitron 2y ago
    philosophy, fine arts, comparative literature, history, etc. Those are all quite valuable to have in the workplace, but anyone with a bachelors in one of those topics will likely need to get a masters degree in the same field or something else before they can find a decent career.
    - WalterBright 2y ago
      Why does that make comparative literature, for example, a "real" education and, say, math not? BTW, there's no need to go to university to learn history. All that's necessary is to read a history book. I read lots of them. Paying someone to lecture you about history seems a waste of time and money. Just read it. Much more time efficient.
      - itronitron 2y ago
        I'd consider math a real education as well. Going back to the initial comment you were responding to, I'd add that most degrees will cover things that aren't skills and credentials that will help someone get a job. That may explain why people with CS degrees still have to answer fizzbuzz questions in job interviews. Whether reading history is more time efficient than taking a class depends a lot on the topic, the writing about it, and the knowledge and abilities of the professor. It's been my experience that a knowledgeable professor can add important context to a topic that will save the student a lot of time and energy.
      - saagarjha 2y ago
        You could do the same for math. Or any subject, really. There's a reason people go to college for that, and it's not because they want to sit with a book to learn the subject.

Bang for the buck exists if you get into a top 10 or 20 school where admission standards are so high that people are impressed simply by the fact that you were admitted and/or you get to network with resourceful people. Otherwise, any state university should suffice. A few states have some state schools with very low acceptance rates and difficulty to get in that might serve to advertise/network you better than another state school. If it’s not hard to get admitted, then just buy the education with the lower price.

BirAdam 2y ago
You also network with old money, the politically connected, and the global elite. The “top” universities don’t really need to be better, they just need to have the correct names and the prestige to attract those names. You may have the best professor teaching all the most useful knowledge in the middle of no where state university, but the folks attending won’t have as much opportunity despite their education because they won’t get connected to money or to power.
- WalterBright 2y ago
  An obscure university offering a first class education isn't going to be obscure for long.

DoreenMichele 2y ago

Viewing college through this lens is part of the problem. It's college as job training, not education. Real education covers more than "skills and credentials I need to get a well-paid job."

WalterBright 2y ago
> Real education covers more than "skills and credentials I need to get a well-paid job." I'm curious what real education would be that does not impart a skill that others are willing to pay for? I speak as someone who selected classes based on maximizing skills that would be useful in the career I wanted.
- itronitron 2y ago
  philosophy, fine arts, comparative literature, history, etc. Those are all quite valuable to have in the workplace, but anyone with a bachelors in one of those topics will likely need to get a masters degree in the same field or something else before they can find a decent career.
  - WalterBright 2y ago
    Why does that make comparative literature, for example, a "real" education and, say, math not? BTW, there's no need to go to university to learn history. All that's necessary is to read a history book. I read lots of them. Paying someone to lecture you about history seems a waste of time and money. Just read it. Much more time efficient.
    - itronitron 2y ago
      I'd consider math a real education as well. Going back to the initial comment you were responding to, I'd add that most degrees will cover things that aren't skills and credentials that will help someone get a job. That may explain why people with CS degrees still have to answer fizzbuzz questions in job interviews. Whether reading history is more time efficient than taking a class depends a lot on the topic, the writing about it, and the knowledge and abilities of the professor. It's been my experience that a knowledgeable professor can add important context to a topic that will save the student a lot of time and energy.
    - saagarjha 2y ago
      You could do the same for math. Or any subject, really. There's a reason people go to college for that, and it's not because they want to sit with a book to learn the subject.