4 ms·

Israel is in their 9/11 moment and is not backing down due to international hand wringing. Ultimately it’s a test of the international institutions and US gover

by leoqa 2y ago

Israel is in their 9/11 moment and is not backing down due to international hand wringing. Ultimately it’s a test of the international institutions and US government support.

flyinglizard 2y ago
What you're saying is true. Israeli citizens have had enough and demand a military solution. The fighting doctrine of Israel's adversaries is attacking and then running for the cover of the international community, but post October 7th that doesn't really work anymore with Israel.
- ngcazz 2y ago
  [flagged]
- mistermann 2y ago
  > Israeli citizens have had enough and demand a military solution. Enthusiasts of Rhetoric or Logic may notice how interesting this sentence is, in that it is both true and false simultaneously. They may also notice that is also true of a rather large percentage of discussion/cognition regarding these matters. Gosh, how do people manage to understand what's going on if language is used this way???
fwip 2y ago
At this point, I wonder if Israel isn't intentionally trying to provoke more 9/11 moments. If they lose the direct support of the US or the tolerance of the wider international community, they can't fulfill their goals.
- bushbaba 2y ago
  Or the flip side. Hamas promised to continue slaughtering Israeli Arabs, Jews, and Christians until they are all dead. Hezbollah has launched rockets into northern Israel for a year…with 100k+ Israelis forced to relocate south. What exactly other option does Israel had. Peace talks didn’t go anywhere for last few decades
  - ngcazz 2y ago
    Even if Hamas hadn't eliminated the anti-semitic language from their charter in 2007, that argument would require one to accept that preventatively mass murdering whole families and generations of children is a moral means of dealing with a political opponent. Options? Israel (the people anyway) has always had the option of finally dropping the ethno-nationalism and apartheid of their foundational principles, and accepting that the Palestinians have a way more material right to Palestinian territory than an American or a European who Israel brought over on a birthright trip.
    - HDThoreaun 2y ago
      [flagged]
      - fwip 2y ago
        You say "moralizing about being mean," other people say "opposing genocide." Deliberately trivializing the objections of others is not a good faith argument. Surely you don't think that a 100:1 civilian-to-combatant casualty ratio is par for the course in "every war ever waged," so why say it? You waste everyone's time Further, you must know that the beliefs you say that Palestinians profess are only actually held by a minority of them. On the same page, Israeli officials have said things like "all Gazans must be destroyed,"[1] but everyone here knows that quotes like these represent the far end of aggression among the group. 1. https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2024/01/05/wv-israel-hamas/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2024/01/05/wv-israel-ha...
        HDThoreaun 2y ago
        > Israeli officials have said things like "all Gazans must be destroyed,"[1] but everyone here knows that quotes like these represent the far end of aggression among the group. I unfortunately believe that most Israelis believe this or something like it. You are right, let me rephrase. They have all the power, opposing the genocide of the palestinians will accomplish nothing as long as the palestinians make the isrealis feel unsafe.
beaglesss 2y ago
They have the support of a state 30x their size. In a unique way few others do, almost in a parent child undying and asymmetrical way. This is 9/11 but the US backed by an entire alien planet, unafraid to go in the direction of scorched earth even when totally surrounded because the aliens will bail them out.

by leoqa 2y ago

Israel is in their 9/11 moment and is not backing down due to international hand wringing. Ultimately it’s a test of the international institutions and US government support.

flyinglizard 2y ago

What you're saying is true. Israeli citizens have had enough and demand a military solution. The fighting doctrine of Israel's adversaries is attacking and then running for the cover of the international community, but post October 7th that doesn't really work anymore with Israel.

ngcazz 2y ago
[flagged]
mistermann 2y ago
> Israeli citizens have had enough and demand a military solution. Enthusiasts of Rhetoric or Logic may notice how interesting this sentence is, in that it is both true and false simultaneously. They may also notice that is also true of a rather large percentage of discussion/cognition regarding these matters. Gosh, how do people manage to understand what's going on if language is used this way???

fwip 2y ago

At this point, I wonder if Israel isn't intentionally trying to provoke more 9/11 moments. If they lose the direct support of the US or the tolerance of the wider international community, they can't fulfill their goals.

bushbaba 2y ago
Or the flip side. Hamas promised to continue slaughtering Israeli Arabs, Jews, and Christians until they are all dead. Hezbollah has launched rockets into northern Israel for a year…with 100k+ Israelis forced to relocate south. What exactly other option does Israel had. Peace talks didn’t go anywhere for last few decades
- ngcazz 2y ago
  Even if Hamas hadn't eliminated the anti-semitic language from their charter in 2007, that argument would require one to accept that preventatively mass murdering whole families and generations of children is a moral means of dealing with a political opponent. Options? Israel (the people anyway) has always had the option of finally dropping the ethno-nationalism and apartheid of their foundational principles, and accepting that the Palestinians have a way more material right to Palestinian territory than an American or a European who Israel brought over on a birthright trip.
  - HDThoreaun 2y ago
    [flagged]
    - fwip 2y ago
      You say "moralizing about being mean," other people say "opposing genocide." Deliberately trivializing the objections of others is not a good faith argument. Surely you don't think that a 100:1 civilian-to-combatant casualty ratio is par for the course in "every war ever waged," so why say it? You waste everyone's time Further, you must know that the beliefs you say that Palestinians profess are only actually held by a minority of them. On the same page, Israeli officials have said things like "all Gazans must be destroyed,"[1] but everyone here knows that quotes like these represent the far end of aggression among the group. 1. https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2024/01/05/wv-israel-hamas/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2024/01/05/wv-israel-ha...
      - HDThoreaun 2y ago
        > Israeli officials have said things like "all Gazans must be destroyed,"[1] but everyone here knows that quotes like these represent the far end of aggression among the group. I unfortunately believe that most Israelis believe this or something like it. You are right, let me rephrase. They have all the power, opposing the genocide of the palestinians will accomplish nothing as long as the palestinians make the isrealis feel unsafe.

beaglesss 2y ago

They have the support of a state 30x their size. In a unique way few others do, almost in a parent child undying and asymmetrical way. This is 9/11 but the US backed by an entire alien planet, unafraid to go in the direction of scorched earth even when totally surrounded because the aliens will bail them out.