4 ms·

i say this as a former addict. wow people are killing themselves with drugs 10% less? wow, much progress. thank goodness for harm reduction experts and non-prof

i say this as a former addict. wow people are killing themselves with drugs 10% less? wow, much progress. thank goodness for harm reduction experts and non-profits working so hard on the ground to give junkies drugs, needles, and care. history will not look favorably on kicking the can down the road like this. we keep dodging the root cause to prop up a population that will cost the public an astronomical amount of money in healthcare and lifestyle cost. thats not even factoring in turning cities into hellscapes. not only is this anti democratic (literally nobody wants to support junkies) but will lead to the rise of populists. how is it fair for middle class who have to pay tens of thousands, if not more, for healthcare cost every year?

n4r9 2y ago
What's the root cause in your view?
- Eumenes 2y ago
  the inflow of drugs from the southern border and maritime ports. i'm not saying we return to a war on drugs like campaign, but ffs, we need to stop drugs from getting into the country or being created. if the US can shell out billions to NATO, Ukraine, Israel/Palestine, then it sure as hell has the resources to at least attempt to curb the inbound of this stuff. also, go lax on the users, but go after dealers. dealing drugs needs to be met with zero tolerance.
  - n4r9 2y ago
    Is the influx of drugs like fentanyl really the "root cause", though? People wouldn't be trying to smuggle it in unless there was already a demand.
  - pjc50 2y ago
    > i'm not saying we return to a war on drugs like campaign > [describes war on drugs] Doing this via law enforcement is going to require a level of intrusiveness that Americans are unlikely to tolerate (or be compatible with the constitution), along with considerable violence.
  - piva00 2y ago
    You can't stop. Look at how fucking long all the borders are (land and maritime), there's a market for it, someone will try to squeeze it into the country. There's no possible way to guard all the borders 100% of the time, even less if there's huge profits to be made, people are smart and drug traffickers are people, they will find a way through. If you want to play a forever game of whack-a-mole then go ahead. No, the US cannot completely stop the flow of drugs, it's not about the southern border, if that is absolutely sealed off other ways will be found to smuggle them. Stop repeating bullshit propaganda and think for yourself, do you really believe it's possible? What would be the cost of policing 3000+ km 24/7, over and underground? How long would this policing need to happen, what would be the cost of this in total?
    - simoncion 2y ago
      > There's no possible way to guard all the borders 100% of the time... My go-to example is that it's apparently impossible to eliminate illegal drugs from US prisons. If "somehow" illegal drugs are making it into an environment where The Authorities have complete control over the lives of the folks housed in that environment, there is absolutely no hope to stop them anywhere at all. Harm mitigation and minimization are the only things that make any sense in the real world.
    - Eumenes 2y ago
      > Stop repeating bullshit propaganda and think for yourself, do you really believe it's possible? What would be the cost of policing 3000+ km 24/7, over and underground? How long would this policing need to happen, what would be the cost of this in total? You can't stop 100% of it, but you can do whole lot more than what's going on now. The US has a duty to stop banned substances from entering the country, esp when they're killing people. The military budget is almost a trillion, how about reallocating that? But if the border is too porous and impossible to defend against drug smuggling, what is your suggestion? I'll take a guess, because its a famous progressive theory, and based on your vitriol for my view: The government (or associated labs) to produce the drugs and provide them to addicts at low/no-cost, and provide even more $$ and services to addicts to continue their lifestyle? Yeah, thats propaganda and seems to be the leading theory among the technocrats.
tjs8rj 2y ago
This is 100% correct but because society is increasingly apathetic about everything we're only interested in the low lift solutions. You don't fix a drug epidemic by going after the symptoms: narcan and other drugs that are a bandaid only at the very last stage. You go for the root: we've created a society where people are overprescribed pain killers, and where the general outlook is so bleak that escapism is more popular than ever. It's the same reasons people don't have children and mental health is all record lows.

n4r9 2y ago

What's the root cause in your view?

Eumenes 2y ago
the inflow of drugs from the southern border and maritime ports. i'm not saying we return to a war on drugs like campaign, but ffs, we need to stop drugs from getting into the country or being created. if the US can shell out billions to NATO, Ukraine, Israel/Palestine, then it sure as hell has the resources to at least attempt to curb the inbound of this stuff. also, go lax on the users, but go after dealers. dealing drugs needs to be met with zero tolerance.
- n4r9 2y ago
  Is the influx of drugs like fentanyl really the "root cause", though? People wouldn't be trying to smuggle it in unless there was already a demand.
- pjc50 2y ago
  > i'm not saying we return to a war on drugs like campaign > [describes war on drugs] Doing this via law enforcement is going to require a level of intrusiveness that Americans are unlikely to tolerate (or be compatible with the constitution), along with considerable violence.
- piva00 2y ago
  You can't stop. Look at how fucking long all the borders are (land and maritime), there's a market for it, someone will try to squeeze it into the country. There's no possible way to guard all the borders 100% of the time, even less if there's huge profits to be made, people are smart and drug traffickers are people, they will find a way through. If you want to play a forever game of whack-a-mole then go ahead. No, the US cannot completely stop the flow of drugs, it's not about the southern border, if that is absolutely sealed off other ways will be found to smuggle them. Stop repeating bullshit propaganda and think for yourself, do you really believe it's possible? What would be the cost of policing 3000+ km 24/7, over and underground? How long would this policing need to happen, what would be the cost of this in total?
  - simoncion 2y ago
    > There's no possible way to guard all the borders 100% of the time... My go-to example is that it's apparently impossible to eliminate illegal drugs from US prisons. If "somehow" illegal drugs are making it into an environment where The Authorities have complete control over the lives of the folks housed in that environment, there is absolutely no hope to stop them anywhere at all. Harm mitigation and minimization are the only things that make any sense in the real world.
  - Eumenes 2y ago
    > Stop repeating bullshit propaganda and think for yourself, do you really believe it's possible? What would be the cost of policing 3000+ km 24/7, over and underground? How long would this policing need to happen, what would be the cost of this in total? You can't stop 100% of it, but you can do whole lot more than what's going on now. The US has a duty to stop banned substances from entering the country, esp when they're killing people. The military budget is almost a trillion, how about reallocating that? But if the border is too porous and impossible to defend against drug smuggling, what is your suggestion? I'll take a guess, because its a famous progressive theory, and based on your vitriol for my view: The government (or associated labs) to produce the drugs and provide them to addicts at low/no-cost, and provide even more $$ and services to addicts to continue their lifestyle? Yeah, thats propaganda and seems to be the leading theory among the technocrats.

tjs8rj 2y ago

This is 100% correct but because society is increasingly apathetic about everything we're only interested in the low lift solutions. You don't fix a drug epidemic by going after the symptoms: narcan and other drugs that are a bandaid only at the very last stage. You go for the root: we've created a society where people are overprescribed pain killers, and where the general outlook is so bleak that escapism is more popular than ever. It's the same reasons people don't have children and mental health is all record lows.