6 ms·

How to roll your own Mac for under $240

50 points by makimaki 18y ago

pedalpete 18y ago
I'm not sure how this is better than dual-booting on your current machine, or using an old pc. Am I missing something?
- Herring 18y ago
  Yeah well, driver headaches if you don't pick your hardware carefully. Nobody will release OSX drivers & you don't want to depend on third party drivers. They all suck. I actually hit this hard a few months ago while trying to turn my laptop into a hackintosh. It would only boot once every 3 tries. And ultimately there's nothing special about the OS. I missed my apt & kde4
  - mechanical_fish 18y ago
    ultimately there's nothing special about the OS I would dispute that... except that I suspect that it might be much more true if you're foolish enough to go the Hackintosh route. The whole point of the Mac OS is that everybody is using more or less the same thing: similar OS, similar software, similar hardware, similar drivers. That makes it fairly easy to adopt tips and techniques from the community, or to Google for applicable advice, and it makes the user experience smoother and simpler. Once you throw away much of the ease of installation and maintenance, the consistency, and the stability the Mac OS is not that much more than Unix with pretty windows and a stricter set of UI guidelines -- and there are plenty of ways to prettify your Linux windows! You do get access to well-designed, closed-source, Mac-only apps. (The open source Mac apps can generally be cross-compiled for Linux, or more likely vice versa.) But if you're too cheap to buy actual Mac hardware you're less likely to care about the power to pay for nicely designed Mac apps. Especially when some of those apps might exhibit mysterious bugs on your hackintosh hardware. Just spend those hours you'd waste trying to maintain a hackintosh learning more about Linux. It's a better use of your time. Or buy a real Mac like everybody else.
    - Herring 18y ago
      Once you throw away much of the ease of installation and maintenance, the consistency, and the stability the Mac OS is not that much more than Unix with... Oh, I don't know anything about Unix, but you might want to keep a few of those if you want to keep up with Ubuntu. You do get access to well-designed, closed-source, Mac-only apps. If I used windows, I'd also get the privilege of paying for lots of well-designed closed-source windows-only apps.
  - GHFigs 18y ago
    apt and KDE 4 both run on Mac OS X.
cliffy 18y ago
Why is this being voted up? He advocates downloading Leopard from the pirate bay. The only 'Mac' thing about this computer is the OS and he recommends stealing it.
- jodrellblank 18y ago
  Why would that stop it being voted up? Things don't stop being interesting just because they are illegal. Also, he advocates stealing it or buying it.
  - Zev 18y ago
    The stuff you need to know to hack osx on your own isn't something you can read on a forum randomly. Buying -> hacking isn't an option for many people.
    - Radix 18y ago
      Where do you find that knowledge?
      - Zev 18y ago
        If you actually want to do the hacking on your own: Learn x86 or x86_64 (be prepared for Snow Leopard) asm in depth for the kernel. Lots of C/IOKit knowledge for writing your own kext's (drivers for osx). Examine memory dumps and to figure out what gets loaded when (not to mention how. There's a few cryptographically signed things that had to be dumped; Dont Steal Mac OS X.kext is a good example). Look at tons of device and vendor id's and find the corresponding plists within apple-provided kext's. Find where and what to modify in them. Talk to people on IRC (there's some very talented people around there still, and even more talented folks that have quit the scene already). If you can, find old forum posts from osx86project - or concretesurf/win2osx (I'm talking stuff 2.5-3 years old, before they were big and worth indexing) In short: Explore the system at as low of a level as possible. Don't leave a stone unturned. If you just want to copy others work, you can stick with the "Talk to people on IRC.." part and you should manage, assuming you have an idea of what you're doing. All that being said, I'd recommending spending the time working on something more worthwhile.
jws 18y ago
$240 plus a DMCA violation and stealing a $100 piece of software to end up with a beyond low end Mac that breaks as soon as you perform a system software upgrade (according to the article). Just go the mall early with a brick, you know, when the walkers are getting their exercise. Throw the brick through the window of the Apple store and steal a mini. Its a better machine and Apple probably won't mind since they need to flush the inventory before next weeks announcements. Why, you are probably doing them a favor since they can write off the retail price as a loss from theft instead of flushing it at a reduced price. No one gets hurt, same as the original article. (Ok, the mini isn't better if you want the two 3.5" SATA bays, in that case steal it the way the author documents.) [Downvoted? At least I amused myself. Perhaps I should have added a smiley somewhere.]
- dcurtis 18y ago
  You are misinformed. See this fantastic diagram: http://i33.tinypic.com/2yor21y.png http://i33.tinypic.com/2yor21y.png
  - jackowayed 18y ago
    Yeah, but with software, there really is no "original" to steal. They can make new copies and ship them to the store for like $0.50 tops. The real value of software is the information, the compiled code that makes it do something valuable. You're not paying your share towards development costs that make that happen. So you're robbing the company of the money you would pay for the software. With software, the idea of theft only being taking the physical product is stupid because the physical aspect is practically worthless. Some software isn't even distributed through physical means at all.
    - dmix 18y ago
      I don't think he was questioning the value, he was commenting on the use of the word "stealing". Copyright infringement is the better phrase for it.
      - 18y ago
snewe 18y ago
Important caveat at the end: "Also, doing the non-program updates (system updates) seems to screw it up. I'm not sure why and I am finding a fix but for now just update iTunes and the like."
- Zev 18y ago
  Thats because in order for osx86 to work, you have to hack the kernel and several kext's. They all get reset and updated in system updates. FWIW, not even iTunes updates can be safe. They update Quicktime a well - which Apple has used to break osx86 in the past.
- zaius 18y ago
  Also, only 12mbps usb.
weegee 18y ago
it's a copyright violation to use OS X on any non-Apple manufactured computer, so this isn't a great idea. nice cheap computer though, and it was interesting to read the steps the guy had to go through. I don't think HN advocates copyright violations, do they?
- notauser 18y ago
  If you buy a copy of OS X it's probably not copyright violation. At worst it is breach of contract (possibly attracting actual damages of as little as $0, as you bought the software), but that depends on your legal jurisdiction. Not that I advocate installing OS X at all. It seems churlish to insist on using something the creator doesn't want you too when there are free alternatives that benefit from a large user base.
- petercooper 18y ago
  In theory, since you cannot buy this hacked copy of OS X it might be a copyright violation since you can't have a license for that copy. It is possible, however, to buy a legitimate OS X and perform the same patches to get the install image they are using, in which case no copyright violation occurs. Installing shouldn't even be an EULA violation if you're doing it on an "Apple labeled" computer.. so just get an Apple sticker and label it.
  - Zev 18y ago
    I dont think sticking a sticker of an apple sticker on it makes it "Apple labeled" anymore then a tag saying "rolex" would make a fake rolex from the street a real rolex.
    - petercooper 18y ago
      That's still a point of legal contention. In any case, it's perfectly legal for you to buy a cheap watch and put a Rolex sticker on it as long as you don't sell it on as a "genuine" Rolex. Something can be "Apple labeled" but not a genuine Apple product. "Apple manufactured" would have made more sense.
mariomoosum 18y ago
Does Xcode run on this? Does the iPhone emulator work? Can you do iPhone development with this setup?
- matthew-wegner 18y ago
  Yes. I have a friend who has shipped an iPhone game developed on a hackintosh. That said, I've personally found them to be problematic over time. We're a 6-person Mac-based game developer, and we picked up a Psystar hackintosh out of curiosity. We had an intern work on it for awhile, but it had some weird quirks. The biggest problem is updating must be done manually and carefully. The longer you have it the more work you're creating for yourself, if you want to keep current, which is pretty much opposite the goal of using a Mac (less work/maintenance over time).
parenthesis 18y ago
Used genuine Macs are available if you want cheap (or cheaper, at least).
GHFigs 18y ago
Factually inaccurate. The computer described is not a Mac.
codeview 18y ago
The joy of getting things done..

50 points by makimaki 18y ago

pedalpete 18y ago

I'm not sure how this is better than dual-booting on your current machine, or using an old pc. Am I missing something?

Herring 18y ago
Yeah well, driver headaches if you don't pick your hardware carefully. Nobody will release OSX drivers & you don't want to depend on third party drivers. They all suck. I actually hit this hard a few months ago while trying to turn my laptop into a hackintosh. It would only boot once every 3 tries. And ultimately there's nothing special about the OS. I missed my apt & kde4
- mechanical_fish 18y ago
  ultimately there's nothing special about the OS I would dispute that... except that I suspect that it might be much more true if you're foolish enough to go the Hackintosh route. The whole point of the Mac OS is that everybody is using more or less the same thing: similar OS, similar software, similar hardware, similar drivers. That makes it fairly easy to adopt tips and techniques from the community, or to Google for applicable advice, and it makes the user experience smoother and simpler. Once you throw away much of the ease of installation and maintenance, the consistency, and the stability the Mac OS is not that much more than Unix with pretty windows and a stricter set of UI guidelines -- and there are plenty of ways to prettify your Linux windows! You do get access to well-designed, closed-source, Mac-only apps. (The open source Mac apps can generally be cross-compiled for Linux, or more likely vice versa.) But if you're too cheap to buy actual Mac hardware you're less likely to care about the power to pay for nicely designed Mac apps. Especially when some of those apps might exhibit mysterious bugs on your hackintosh hardware. Just spend those hours you'd waste trying to maintain a hackintosh learning more about Linux. It's a better use of your time. Or buy a real Mac like everybody else.
  - Herring 18y ago
    Once you throw away much of the ease of installation and maintenance, the consistency, and the stability the Mac OS is not that much more than Unix with... Oh, I don't know anything about Unix, but you might want to keep a few of those if you want to keep up with Ubuntu. You do get access to well-designed, closed-source, Mac-only apps. If I used windows, I'd also get the privilege of paying for lots of well-designed closed-source windows-only apps.
- GHFigs 18y ago
  apt and KDE 4 both run on Mac OS X.

cliffy 18y ago

Why is this being voted up? He advocates downloading Leopard from the pirate bay. The only 'Mac' thing about this computer is the OS and he recommends stealing it.

jodrellblank 18y ago
Why would that stop it being voted up? Things don't stop being interesting just because they are illegal. Also, he advocates stealing it or buying it.
- Zev 18y ago
  The stuff you need to know to hack osx on your own isn't something you can read on a forum randomly. Buying -> hacking isn't an option for many people.
  - Radix 18y ago
    Where do you find that knowledge?
    - Zev 18y ago
      If you actually want to do the hacking on your own: Learn x86 or x86_64 (be prepared for Snow Leopard) asm in depth for the kernel. Lots of C/IOKit knowledge for writing your own kext's (drivers for osx). Examine memory dumps and to figure out what gets loaded when (not to mention how. There's a few cryptographically signed things that had to be dumped; Dont Steal Mac OS X.kext is a good example). Look at tons of device and vendor id's and find the corresponding plists within apple-provided kext's. Find where and what to modify in them. Talk to people on IRC (there's some very talented people around there still, and even more talented folks that have quit the scene already). If you can, find old forum posts from osx86project - or concretesurf/win2osx (I'm talking stuff 2.5-3 years old, before they were big and worth indexing) In short: Explore the system at as low of a level as possible. Don't leave a stone unturned. If you just want to copy others work, you can stick with the "Talk to people on IRC.." part and you should manage, assuming you have an idea of what you're doing. All that being said, I'd recommending spending the time working on something more worthwhile.

jws 18y ago

$240 plus a DMCA violation and stealing a $100 piece of software to end up with a beyond low end Mac that breaks as soon as you perform a system software upgrade (according to the article). Just go the mall early with a brick, you know, when the walkers are getting their exercise. Throw the brick through the window of the Apple store and steal a mini. Its a better machine and Apple probably won't mind since they need to flush the inventory before next weeks announcements. Why, you are probably doing them a favor since they can write off the retail price as a loss from theft instead of flushing it at a reduced price. No one gets hurt, same as the original article. (Ok, the mini isn't better if you want the two 3.5" SATA bays, in that case steal it the way the author documents.) [Downvoted? At least I amused myself. Perhaps I should have added a smiley somewhere.]

dcurtis 18y ago
You are misinformed. See this fantastic diagram: http://i33.tinypic.com/2yor21y.png http://i33.tinypic.com/2yor21y.png
- jackowayed 18y ago
  Yeah, but with software, there really is no "original" to steal. They can make new copies and ship them to the store for like $0.50 tops. The real value of software is the information, the compiled code that makes it do something valuable. You're not paying your share towards development costs that make that happen. So you're robbing the company of the money you would pay for the software. With software, the idea of theft only being taking the physical product is stupid because the physical aspect is practically worthless. Some software isn't even distributed through physical means at all.
  - dmix 18y ago
    I don't think he was questioning the value, he was commenting on the use of the word "stealing". Copyright infringement is the better phrase for it.
    - 18y ago

snewe 18y ago

Important caveat at the end: "Also, doing the non-program updates (system updates) seems to screw it up. I'm not sure why and I am finding a fix but for now just update iTunes and the like."

Zev 18y ago
Thats because in order for osx86 to work, you have to hack the kernel and several kext's. They all get reset and updated in system updates. FWIW, not even iTunes updates can be safe. They update Quicktime a well - which Apple has used to break osx86 in the past.
zaius 18y ago
Also, only 12mbps usb.

weegee 18y ago

it's a copyright violation to use OS X on any non-Apple manufactured computer, so this isn't a great idea. nice cheap computer though, and it was interesting to read the steps the guy had to go through. I don't think HN advocates copyright violations, do they?

notauser 18y ago
If you buy a copy of OS X it's probably not copyright violation. At worst it is breach of contract (possibly attracting actual damages of as little as $0, as you bought the software), but that depends on your legal jurisdiction. Not that I advocate installing OS X at all. It seems churlish to insist on using something the creator doesn't want you too when there are free alternatives that benefit from a large user base.
petercooper 18y ago
In theory, since you cannot buy this hacked copy of OS X it might be a copyright violation since you can't have a license for that copy. It is possible, however, to buy a legitimate OS X and perform the same patches to get the install image they are using, in which case no copyright violation occurs. Installing shouldn't even be an EULA violation if you're doing it on an "Apple labeled" computer.. so just get an Apple sticker and label it.
- Zev 18y ago
  I dont think sticking a sticker of an apple sticker on it makes it "Apple labeled" anymore then a tag saying "rolex" would make a fake rolex from the street a real rolex.
  - petercooper 18y ago
    That's still a point of legal contention. In any case, it's perfectly legal for you to buy a cheap watch and put a Rolex sticker on it as long as you don't sell it on as a "genuine" Rolex. Something can be "Apple labeled" but not a genuine Apple product. "Apple manufactured" would have made more sense.

mariomoosum 18y ago

Does Xcode run on this? Does the iPhone emulator work? Can you do iPhone development with this setup?

matthew-wegner 18y ago
Yes. I have a friend who has shipped an iPhone game developed on a hackintosh. That said, I've personally found them to be problematic over time. We're a 6-person Mac-based game developer, and we picked up a Psystar hackintosh out of curiosity. We had an intern work on it for awhile, but it had some weird quirks. The biggest problem is updating must be done manually and carefully. The longer you have it the more work you're creating for yourself, if you want to keep current, which is pretty much opposite the goal of using a Mac (less work/maintenance over time).

parenthesis 18y ago

Used genuine Macs are available if you want cheap (or cheaper, at least).

GHFigs 18y ago

Factually inaccurate. The computer described is not a Mac.

codeview 18y ago

The joy of getting things done..