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You could've labeled it terrorism had Lebanon and Israel weren't at war with each other over the past 12 months, and had the people carrying those devices were

You could've labeled it terrorism had Lebanon and Israel weren't at war with each other over the past 12 months, and had the people carrying those devices were random uninvolved civilians. If you were to consider the fact that Hezbollah has been shelling Israeli cities and civilians on a daily basis for the past 12 months (killing many, also children, and driving hundreds of thousands of people out of their homes), with the UN peacekeeping force failing to keep Hezbollah north of the Litani river - then perhaps you would understand that this is likely as close as you can get to a "precision strike" on an enemy you're at war with. This may in-fact be the most precise military strike on an enemy paramilitary group in the history of modern warfare. You either have a very unrealistic idea of what a war actually looks like (0% civilians casualties or injuries), or an agenda.

ignoramous 2y ago
Let's just say, I don't believe war is a cover for terrorism against any peoples, be it in the West or East, Arab or Caucasian.
- csmpltn 2y ago
  Fair enough, and thanks for being open about this. With this in mind, all I can say is that your original comment is based on 100% emotion and 0% analysis and rationality.
  - mistermann 2y ago
    [flagged]
    - csmpltn 2y ago
      I certainly agree that war, as experienced by humans on all sides of a conflict, is a form of terror. That's a simple emotional argument that everybody can relate to. It doesn't touch on the realities of war, especially a war that was forced on one side by another (which is the case here, with Hezbollah willingly deciding to shell and bomb Israel on a daily basis for the past 12 months, despite Israel not waging any war on Lebanon). What are you so fascinated with here, exactly?
      - mistermann 2y ago
        This: > 100% emotion and 0% analysis I love the irony of it.
        ignoramous 2y ago
        Unsure why that comment was flagged. smh
        mistermann 2y ago
        Western culture and epistemology have a tumultuous relationship here in the early 21st century.
- s1artibartfast 2y ago
  Do you think that any military action with civilian impact constitutes terrorism? no war has ever been waged without collateral damage.
  - knodi123 2y ago
    war waged without collateral damage: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emu_War https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emu_War
    - ineedasername 2y ago
      At least one innocent farmer just trying to safeguard their farm might have suffered contusions and destruction of property! "Farmers attempted to herd the emus using trucks, but this proved ineffective; one truck even crashed after hitting an emu" https://www.britannica.com/topic/Emu-War https://www.britannica.com/topic/Emu-War
shihab 2y ago
do you realize that nurses in hospital, civil servants workers are among people carrying this device? That not all, not even majority of Hizbollah personnel have no military responsibility whatsoever?
- csmpltn 2y ago
  There's absolutely no reason for uninvolved, random and peaceful civilians to be carrying a classified wartime-ready pager issued by a paramilitary terrorist organization. If you were carrying the device you're either Hezbollah, or cooperating with them - which makes you a legitimate military target. Israel has given Lebanon and Hezbollah enough ultimatums to stop the aggressions. This is what happens when diplomacy fails.
  - koolba 2y ago
    > If you were carrying the device you're either Hezbollah, or cooperating with them - which makes you a legitimate military target. Or you were standing in line next to a guy holding one while waiting to buy groceries. It’s clearly indiscriminate to the collateral damage.
    - csmpltn 2y ago
      But we already have videos of people standing in very close proximity to the devices being detonated - and not getting hurt. In-fact, many of the people carrying the device in their pockets ended up not sustaining life-threatening injuries. I'm not saying civilians weren't hurt by this. But I'm also saying that no war has 0% civilian casualties. Those two countries are at war with each other.
    - s1artibartfast 2y ago
      If they were truly indiscriminate and and indifferent to collateral damage, there are far easier and more effective ways to kill a few dozen people in Lebanon. The whole complex and contrived attack speaks of tying to minimize collateral damage.
    - 2y ago
jajko 2y ago
Terrorism definition is independent of whether there is ongoing war or not, lets not divert the subject with simple whataboutism. We all know what happened, on both sides, including deaths of tens of thousands of civilians including thousands of palestinian children who did fuck nothing to anybody, just were born at bad place at bad time. What would be enough kill ratio israeli : palestinian civilian, or even better israeli civilian : palestinian kid/baby that would satiate Israeli government to stop the war? Very conservative estimates put deaths of direct US invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq to around 500k, meaning its 500:3 ratio and factual defeat of US army to withdraw and cut losses. So thats the threshold of civilized western world? Israel already surpassed that long time ago. They can't and won't win with Hamas and they know it, its exactly same situation as Taliban, ISIS etc. Regroup, strike back, stronger, smarter, better equipped, more motivated. Spiral of death can go on and on till there is nobody standing on neither side. If I had to choose where the next nuclear detonation happens it would be for me 50:50 Ukraine : Israel, and this is how you get there.
- csmpltn 2y ago
  [flagged]
dnakqozkfnrjq 2y ago
[flagged]
- csmpltn 2y ago
  > It’s a mistake not to acknowledge civilian casualties, and not to feel sorrow and even anger. I agree with you 100%, it's important to acknowledge civilian casualties. Many uninvolved Lebanese people don't want a war with Israel, and they don't deserve any of this. I truly feel very sorry for those people and I wish they would never have had to go through this. But at the same time, we can't let emotions alone dictate everything. There's a murderous paramilitary death cult operating from within the Lebanese territory that uses Lebanon for all its territory and resources to kill as many Jewish people (and non-Jews, as demonstrated recently with the missile attack that killed 10 Druze children in a football game) as possible and erase Israel. They don't care about your feelings, or who their victims are. They'll gladly kidnap and murder civilians, children, elderly - as long as they are an Israeli. It's truly tragic, but there really aren't too many ways out of this.
  - bamboozled 2y ago
    [flagged]
captainkrtek 2y ago
The unfortunate thing is that regardless of politics, this will be seen as further escalation that ratchets up the risk of greater regional conflict. All wars eventually end, its just a question of how long, and how much death (both militarily and civilian) will be endured by everyone in the region. I hope there are diplomatic possibilities to de-escalate, but it seems those windows are closing.
- coding123 2y ago
  I don't know - it would seem that the wars there don't end, it's just continuous with intermittent slow downs.
dredmorbius 2y ago
[flagged]

ignoramous 2y ago

Let's just say, I don't believe war is a cover for terrorism against any peoples, be it in the West or East, Arab or Caucasian.

csmpltn 2y ago
Fair enough, and thanks for being open about this. With this in mind, all I can say is that your original comment is based on 100% emotion and 0% analysis and rationality.
- mistermann 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - csmpltn 2y ago
    I certainly agree that war, as experienced by humans on all sides of a conflict, is a form of terror. That's a simple emotional argument that everybody can relate to. It doesn't touch on the realities of war, especially a war that was forced on one side by another (which is the case here, with Hezbollah willingly deciding to shell and bomb Israel on a daily basis for the past 12 months, despite Israel not waging any war on Lebanon). What are you so fascinated with here, exactly?
    - mistermann 2y ago
      This: > 100% emotion and 0% analysis I love the irony of it.
      - ignoramous 2y ago
        Unsure why that comment was flagged. smh
        mistermann 2y ago
        Western culture and epistemology have a tumultuous relationship here in the early 21st century.
s1artibartfast 2y ago
Do you think that any military action with civilian impact constitutes terrorism? no war has ever been waged without collateral damage.
- knodi123 2y ago
  war waged without collateral damage: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emu_War https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emu_War
  - ineedasername 2y ago
    At least one innocent farmer just trying to safeguard their farm might have suffered contusions and destruction of property! "Farmers attempted to herd the emus using trucks, but this proved ineffective; one truck even crashed after hitting an emu" https://www.britannica.com/topic/Emu-War https://www.britannica.com/topic/Emu-War

shihab 2y ago

do you realize that nurses in hospital, civil servants workers are among people carrying this device? That not all, not even majority of Hizbollah personnel have no military responsibility whatsoever?

csmpltn 2y ago
There's absolutely no reason for uninvolved, random and peaceful civilians to be carrying a classified wartime-ready pager issued by a paramilitary terrorist organization. If you were carrying the device you're either Hezbollah, or cooperating with them - which makes you a legitimate military target. Israel has given Lebanon and Hezbollah enough ultimatums to stop the aggressions. This is what happens when diplomacy fails.
- koolba 2y ago
  > If you were carrying the device you're either Hezbollah, or cooperating with them - which makes you a legitimate military target. Or you were standing in line next to a guy holding one while waiting to buy groceries. It’s clearly indiscriminate to the collateral damage.
  - csmpltn 2y ago
    But we already have videos of people standing in very close proximity to the devices being detonated - and not getting hurt. In-fact, many of the people carrying the device in their pockets ended up not sustaining life-threatening injuries. I'm not saying civilians weren't hurt by this. But I'm also saying that no war has 0% civilian casualties. Those two countries are at war with each other.
  - s1artibartfast 2y ago
    If they were truly indiscriminate and and indifferent to collateral damage, there are far easier and more effective ways to kill a few dozen people in Lebanon. The whole complex and contrived attack speaks of tying to minimize collateral damage.
  - 2y ago

jajko 2y ago

Terrorism definition is independent of whether there is ongoing war or not, lets not divert the subject with simple whataboutism. We all know what happened, on both sides, including deaths of tens of thousands of civilians including thousands of palestinian children who did fuck nothing to anybody, just were born at bad place at bad time. What would be enough kill ratio israeli : palestinian civilian, or even better israeli civilian : palestinian kid/baby that would satiate Israeli government to stop the war? Very conservative estimates put deaths of direct US invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq to around 500k, meaning its 500:3 ratio and factual defeat of US army to withdraw and cut losses. So thats the threshold of civilized western world? Israel already surpassed that long time ago. They can't and won't win with Hamas and they know it, its exactly same situation as Taliban, ISIS etc. Regroup, strike back, stronger, smarter, better equipped, more motivated. Spiral of death can go on and on till there is nobody standing on neither side. If I had to choose where the next nuclear detonation happens it would be for me 50:50 Ukraine : Israel, and this is how you get there.

csmpltn 2y ago
[flagged]

dnakqozkfnrjq 2y ago

[flagged]

csmpltn 2y ago
> It’s a mistake not to acknowledge civilian casualties, and not to feel sorrow and even anger. I agree with you 100%, it's important to acknowledge civilian casualties. Many uninvolved Lebanese people don't want a war with Israel, and they don't deserve any of this. I truly feel very sorry for those people and I wish they would never have had to go through this. But at the same time, we can't let emotions alone dictate everything. There's a murderous paramilitary death cult operating from within the Lebanese territory that uses Lebanon for all its territory and resources to kill as many Jewish people (and non-Jews, as demonstrated recently with the missile attack that killed 10 Druze children in a football game) as possible and erase Israel. They don't care about your feelings, or who their victims are. They'll gladly kidnap and murder civilians, children, elderly - as long as they are an Israeli. It's truly tragic, but there really aren't too many ways out of this.
- bamboozled 2y ago
  [flagged]

captainkrtek 2y ago

The unfortunate thing is that regardless of politics, this will be seen as further escalation that ratchets up the risk of greater regional conflict. All wars eventually end, its just a question of how long, and how much death (both militarily and civilian) will be endured by everyone in the region. I hope there are diplomatic possibilities to de-escalate, but it seems those windows are closing.

coding123 2y ago
I don't know - it would seem that the wars there don't end, it's just continuous with intermittent slow downs.

dredmorbius 2y ago

[flagged]