7 ms·

The answer isn't straight forward. 1980s invasion of Lebanon by Israel and it's withdrawal in 2000 was what made Hezbollah into the force that it is today. The

The answer isn't straight forward. 1980s invasion of Lebanon by Israel and it's withdrawal in 2000 was what made Hezbollah into the force that it is today. The conflict has been simmering for decades

mupuff1234 2y ago
I think the answer is fairly straightforward if you limit it to the current round in the conflict Not to mention that Israel is no longer in Lebanon and Hezbollah can just stop firing rockets and the situation will go back to relative peace. So sure the history is complicated, but current events are fairly straightfoward, you had relatively peaceful status que until Hezbollah broke it.
- nick_ 2y ago
  I mean... yes... if you limit any context by excluding important elements of the context the takeaways will be different.
  - mupuff1234 2y ago
    So given the context, why is Hezbollah not responsible for the current escalation? Hezbollah was founded to drive Israel out of Lebanon, and Israel is no longer in Lebanon, so not sure how that context makes any difference to who started and is to blame for the current round of escalation.
    - nick_ 2y ago
      You are implying that the context that matters is equal to the context where Israel hasn't done anything wrong. If you don't know you're doing that, I don't know what to tell you. Maybe you're used to entertaining a much less observant audience on this topic.
      - mupuff1234 2y ago
        It's pretty simple - tell me why you think it's justified for Lebanon to attack Israel? You're dancing around the "context" but not actually saying why that context makes it legitimate for Lebanon to attack based on the pre Oct 7th status quo. Sure Lebanon and Israel have some territorial dispute, but it's like 20 sq km, not something you should start a war for. Lots of neighboring countries have a bloody history, that doesn't mean starting a new war is legitimate, right? Can Poland start firing rockets at Germany because Germany invaded them in the past?
        nick_ 2y ago
        No thanks. You're obviously brainwashed by particular narratives, and have only absorbed one perspective of the facts that you were already emotionally dependent on. Not at all unusual on this topic.
        mupuff1234 2y ago
        I'm very open to hear different narratives, but seems like you aren't exactly willing to hear or share, so not even sure why you commented from the get go. This is a discussion board, and in more than happy to discuss the topic, there's no need for personal attacks.
- anigbrowl 2y ago
  Texas sharpshooter fallacy
yoavm 2y ago
The answer is pretty straight forward in the sense that the current round of war was initiated (proudly) by Hezbollah, and that while if Hezbollah stops shooting Israel would have no business with Lebanon, if Israel stops shooting into Lebanon Hezbollah has no intention of stopping too. Hezbollah wants to destroy Israel (they say that, not me), while Israel has no desire to destroy Lebanon. Hinting at some kind of symmetry here seems weird. Israel invading into Lebanon in the late 1970 was a response to an attack originating there [0]. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coastal_Road_massacre#Israeli_response https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coastal_Road_massacre#Israeli_...
- pphysch 2y ago
  > Hinting at some kind of symmetry here seems weird. Both sides (Israeli state, and Hezbollah) want to destroy each other. It's a simple symmetry. Conflating the military force with the territory and civilians living on it only obfuscates this.
  - yoavm 2y ago
    [flagged]
    - pphysch 2y ago
      Sorry, I can't take you seriously when you equate a clearly defined military-political organization ("Hezbollah") with a broad ethnoreligious group ("Jews"). That's totally absurd and borders on Holocaust denial.
      - yoavm 2y ago
        This is the first time ever someone blames me for Holocaust denial [0], but I'll give you another example then. If someone breaks into your house and tries to kill you, you might want to kill them too, but it's a little funny to say that there's symmetry there because "both want to kill each other!". [0] to remove any doubt, I am not. I'm not sure how you got there, but I would insane to deny an event the took the lives of many from my family.
grumple 2y ago
It is straightforward. There was no conflict there for that past decade plus, Hezbollah started attacking Israel in October to join their Islamic brethren.

The answer isn't straight forward. 1980s invasion of Lebanon by Israel and it's withdrawal in 2000 was what made Hezbollah into the force that it is today. The conflict has been simmering for decades

mupuff1234 2y ago

I think the answer is fairly straightforward if you limit it to the current round in the conflict Not to mention that Israel is no longer in Lebanon and Hezbollah can just stop firing rockets and the situation will go back to relative peace. So sure the history is complicated, but current events are fairly straightfoward, you had relatively peaceful status que until Hezbollah broke it.

nick_ 2y ago
I mean... yes... if you limit any context by excluding important elements of the context the takeaways will be different.
- mupuff1234 2y ago
  So given the context, why is Hezbollah not responsible for the current escalation? Hezbollah was founded to drive Israel out of Lebanon, and Israel is no longer in Lebanon, so not sure how that context makes any difference to who started and is to blame for the current round of escalation.
  - nick_ 2y ago
    You are implying that the context that matters is equal to the context where Israel hasn't done anything wrong. If you don't know you're doing that, I don't know what to tell you. Maybe you're used to entertaining a much less observant audience on this topic.
    - mupuff1234 2y ago
      It's pretty simple - tell me why you think it's justified for Lebanon to attack Israel? You're dancing around the "context" but not actually saying why that context makes it legitimate for Lebanon to attack based on the pre Oct 7th status quo. Sure Lebanon and Israel have some territorial dispute, but it's like 20 sq km, not something you should start a war for. Lots of neighboring countries have a bloody history, that doesn't mean starting a new war is legitimate, right? Can Poland start firing rockets at Germany because Germany invaded them in the past?
      - nick_ 2y ago
        No thanks. You're obviously brainwashed by particular narratives, and have only absorbed one perspective of the facts that you were already emotionally dependent on. Not at all unusual on this topic.
        mupuff1234 2y ago
        I'm very open to hear different narratives, but seems like you aren't exactly willing to hear or share, so not even sure why you commented from the get go. This is a discussion board, and in more than happy to discuss the topic, there's no need for personal attacks.
anigbrowl 2y ago
Texas sharpshooter fallacy

yoavm 2y ago

The answer is pretty straight forward in the sense that the current round of war was initiated (proudly) by Hezbollah, and that while if Hezbollah stops shooting Israel would have no business with Lebanon, if Israel stops shooting into Lebanon Hezbollah has no intention of stopping too. Hezbollah wants to destroy Israel (they say that, not me), while Israel has no desire to destroy Lebanon. Hinting at some kind of symmetry here seems weird. Israel invading into Lebanon in the late 1970 was a response to an attack originating there [0]. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coastal_Road_massacre#Israeli_response https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coastal_Road_massacre#Israeli_...

pphysch 2y ago
> Hinting at some kind of symmetry here seems weird. Both sides (Israeli state, and Hezbollah) want to destroy each other. It's a simple symmetry. Conflating the military force with the territory and civilians living on it only obfuscates this.
- yoavm 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - pphysch 2y ago
    Sorry, I can't take you seriously when you equate a clearly defined military-political organization ("Hezbollah") with a broad ethnoreligious group ("Jews"). That's totally absurd and borders on Holocaust denial.
    - yoavm 2y ago
      This is the first time ever someone blames me for Holocaust denial [0], but I'll give you another example then. If someone breaks into your house and tries to kill you, you might want to kill them too, but it's a little funny to say that there's symmetry there because "both want to kill each other!". [0] to remove any doubt, I am not. I'm not sure how you got there, but I would insane to deny an event the took the lives of many from my family.

grumple 2y ago

It is straightforward. There was no conflict there for that past decade plus, Hezbollah started attacking Israel in October to join their Islamic brethren.