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It's interesting to see the discussion from two different angles—there's a lot of support for the type of A/B/C delineation in parts of this thread, and some pe

It's interesting to see the discussion from two different angles—there's a lot of support for the type of A/B/C delineation in parts of this thread, and some people who decry it in other parts. I was on the set for one of the productions, and I'll just say at the time I thought the experience was a one-off for one of the bigger productions they've put on. Since reading other people's stories, it seems more a case where the pressure to push, push, push for the next big video is a ginormous machine that grinds people pretty hard. An early stage startup, with a few employees, pushing to hit some milestone, could survive like that a while. But you can only burn through so many creative minds driving them at 110% all day like that. IMO, you have to find a sustainable burn rate that might be too much for some, but isn't going to drive away everyone desiring normal family / outside work life balance, especially 5-10 years into an org's lifetime. MrBeast (the org) has hundreds of employees and probably 5-10 major active productions (in pre-prod, prod, and post-prod). They've achieved a lot of impressive results, but they also get to cut a lot of corners traditional media (Hollywood, TV production) can't due to labor laws and unions. Edit: Not to mention, the 'No does not mean no' section was a bit alarming. There are plenty of times when no most certainly means no, and you can really damage business and personal relationships if you can't figure those out.

slt2021 2y ago
MrBeast has given up his life for his youtube channel (he writes exactly this in the doc) - and he is looking for other people willing to give up theirs for his channel
- sanderjd 2y ago
  People should not do that, though. There are better things to dedicate lives to.
  - slt2021 2y ago
    who are you to dictate what people do with their lives and deny them their free will?
    - sgu999 2y ago
      [flagged]
      - gosub100 2y ago
        An opinion would be stated like "I believe" or "I feel". The GP comment said "people shouldn't", which is a directive/command. Words actually mean specific things, who'd have thought?
        sgu999 2y ago
        And who would think that context matters to derive meaning from words. "In my opinion people shouldn't" is the very obvious meaning of "People shouldn't" when a rando with no authority whatsoever comments on an obscure internet forum.
        sanderjd 2y ago
        So, you can look at my comment history to find me waffling about whether every opinion ought to be prefaced with "I believe". Lots of writing advice suggests not doing that, because it's obvious from context and thus redundant, but I find that there is almost always at least one comment like this one when it is elided, which does make me question this writing advice. Having said that, in this case, I think this is just wrong: > "people shouldn't", which is a directive/command I think this is a misreading of the word "shouldn't"... It does not mean "are forbidden to". I honestly struggle to see how you could possibly read it as a "directive/command", especially in a random comment on the internet rather than, like, a legal document (where it wouldn't appear anyway). I think it's pretty clearly a value judgment, and thus fairly clear that it is a subjective opinion, as all value judgments are.
        sgu999 2y ago
        > I honestly struggle to see how you could possibly read it as a "directive/command" I feel like they don't. I believe it's just an attempt at making you refrain from giving your opinion in the future, because reading your opinion bothers them.
  - saintradon 2y ago
    > There are better things to dedicate lives to. Then those aren't people Jimmy wants to hire for his company. There are hundreds of millions of teenagers on this planet that want to stake everything they own to make a YouTube channel and reap the rewards - ownership of their work, being their own boss, potentially lucrative amounts of money, microcelebrity if not greater levels of fame, etc. Some will do it, and some won't. Jimmy is very clearly talking to those people. I know because I was one of them, making my first few hundred dollars ever from adsense at the age of 14 (till I was demonetized a year later and my channel got taken down for copyright, but hey, you learn). I've since grown a bit a taken that energy and it's helped guide me as I learn to make my own startup right now - it's the same adrenaline rush and pursuit of the American dream.
    - pests 2y ago
      It's interesting to me that you did this with YouTube, as I did the same when I was 16 (almost 20 years ago now) but with AdSense. I earned about $70 (mostly off my buddies anime site) which I never collected. Seven years later Google sends the money to my state's unclaimed fund. Even more years later I finally collect that $70 check. Just wanted to share some fond memories.
    - sanderjd 2y ago
      Yep, I get it. This is all true. What I'm saying is that, in my opinion, it's also bad and those people (and perhaps you) ought to choose a better path. I recognize that many of them won't. There are lots of things I think people (including myself!) ought not do, which we still do anyway.
  - earnesti 2y ago
    Or, you can go work there for 1-2 years, learn a lot and move on. Maybe to some more relaxed work, or start your own venture. It actually sounds like a place where you might learn something.
    - sanderjd 2y ago
      Yep, to the extent that this is a sensible thing to do, this is the sensible way to do it. This is clearly analogous to working in high-pressure finance shops or in startups for a fairly short period of time in order to drink from a firehose. The problem is that the kind of people who are ambitious enough to think this sounds like a good idea often (maybe usually) get sucked deeply into it. But yep, I do think it's a reasonable model if you can avoid that outcome and get in and out early in your career.
  - TrapLord_Rhodo 2y ago
    >There are better things to dedicate lives to. Everyone seems to think that they have the answers to this question... Family, friends, community, god, volunteering at the local soup kitchen.. All over your own wants? If you are a video creator/ creative and that's what gives you energy and all the feel good chems, why not work your ASS off for THE CREATOR of our generation? Cause from the way i see it, success and the confidence* it brings, solves all other issues. *As long as you can avoid the pitfall of arrogance.
    - sanderjd 2y ago
      Because, in my opinion, this is a worse thing to do with your life than the many better options. I don't have some One Right Answer to what the best thing to do with your life is, but I'm comfortable having a personal - but strong - opinion on a rough ordering that, for instance, puts family and friends much higher than a life dedicated to "THE CREATOR of our generation". Maybe you think that sounds impressive? I think it just sounds very sad.
- AndyMcConachie 2y ago
  This is what we call a cult.
  - valval 2y ago
    You can call it whatever you want, it’s obvious you’re never going to be part of it.
- malthaus 2y ago
  the audacity to ask other people to give up their life for helping you fulfil your dream and even sell it to them as them fulfilling their dream. is it the same "temporarily embarrassed millionaires" shtick the american dream brainwashed americans with? if you have that much drive and want to invest so heavily in work - do yourself a favour and do it as a leader where you call the shots and have the equity instead of as a follower.
  - Aeglaecia 2y ago
    [flagged]
  - TrapLord_Rhodo 2y ago
    THIS. I would like to tell you a bit of a personal story and this may shed some light on your question. Disclaimer* I am American. I was working at Tesla on the CapEx team, and unless you were doing something "interesting", like going to Tahoe or something, then you were expected to be in the office on Saturday and Sunday. I worked my ass off, pulling 70 hour weeks, catching naps in a conference room when there was a big push. I learned to be energized by my work, seeing the factory cells come together gave me this giant rush. Eventually, I got the thought you had but i worded it differently. "I will never be Elon, working for Elon". So when Covid hit, i got put fully remote and started having some conversations with potential clients to launch my own consultancy. After a couple of months, our managers told us to start coming back into office. I had gotten some traction with the consultancy, so i decideded to "do [myself] a favour and do it as a leader where [i] call[ed] the shots and have the equity instead of as a follower." At first it was great! I was learning an absolute ton, designed my own website from scratch, wrote a bunch of automation code, my sales ration was like 85% because i was just calling on all my old associates and references of references... life was great! Then after i scaled, I realized I wasn't actually doing anything... I have these meetings, and my schedule is always swamped with evaluating this peice of software/this person, generating "Work" for different people, and i freaking hated it! I stopped learning... I had no peers, only employees. I had "Mentors" but my consultancy was so nitch so outside "Executive mentorship" i had no one to guide me. I tried to focus on growth opportunities within the company, scaling different verticles as different companies and other things to keep my mind working, but i slowly but surely lost interest. I couldn't push myself 70 hours a week because i didn't have anyone pushing me, and i hated "Consulting". but every chance i got i would be watching drone videos over the Giga Texas progress. I kept up with every SpaceX, Tesla update ever... And suddenly i realised, i deeply missed working at Tesla... i don't want to be Elon... But that Elon is building some pretty cool shit, and factories, robots, automation is super cool and fun. So i sold my consultancy for 1.5X revenues (Pretty shit deal but i wanted out). It didn't give me fuck you money but i could have chilled for a bit... but now I'm happily working my ass off back at Tesla, fulfilling Elons dream. But i get to "Give up my life" to get to play with robots all day. I'm learning a ton again, i love my team, and i've never met a smarter group of people.
- earnesti 2y ago
  He is fricking 26 years old. He hasn't given his life for anything. At the moment he is, yes, but likely after some years he is retired on his yacht.
  - _zamorano_ 2y ago
    Some things leave a permanent mark on you. Try being a workaholic a few years and tell me later how easy is to disconnect, and rejoin with familiy and friends.
    - FrankoDelMar 2y ago
      Yeah, working constantly for a few years leaves permanent marks. You know what makes it better in ways we'll never have? Millions of dollars, luxury yachts, and fame. Mr. Beast isn't a doctor. He isn't a teacher. He doesn't fight our wars. He makes entertainment for children. He'll be fine.
      - geerlingguy 2y ago
        I think parent comment was referring to employees who are willing to dig in and sacrifice a few years of their lives for MrBeast productions, not to Jimmy Donaldson (though I could be interpreting it wrong).
- OJFord 2y ago
  That's like me saying I've given up my life to have the job that I have currently and live where I do. Or you've given up your life for however you spend it. It just about makes some sort of sense in the context of something like giving up a professional career in a developed country and moving to a remote African village to do aid work, but giving up your life to make a tonne of money creating viral YouTube videos is an absurd description.
- jrochkind1 2y ago
  Giving up your life for many millions of dollar is a choice. His employees are probably payed well, but obviously don't make as much as he. So I guess asking them to give up their lives for less compensation is to say their lives are or less value...
  - Wolfenstein98k 2y ago
    No, it's to offer them a chance to make a lot of money in exchange for a lot of work. No one is forced to work there and they are not taken advantage of. Any of them are free to start their own channel and outcompete him! It's literally how he did it!
pests 2y ago
One thing I find interesting over the last few weeks since this was released (and other MrBeast drama) is how there is now a separation between MrBeast the person and MrBeast the company. Before today, it was never differentiated. Since the drama started, I've seen more news and people (like yourself) clarify that you mean the company vs the person, and I'm not sure its warranted. While everything was going good, MrBeast the person took all credit for MrBeast the company. Now, it seems like everyone is on tip-toes to clarify they are trash-talking MrBeast the company, not MrBeast the person. It just seems a bit weird to me.
- geerlingguy 2y ago
  Honestly I never met Jimmy even though I was in his studio for two weeks working on the video. I did meet a ton of his employees, many of whom I'd gladly work with again, just not on a MrBeast production. I just can't speak to Jimmy Donaldson himself. Not even sure how much he's involved in the day to day at the company (outside of being the public face).
- saghm 2y ago
  > While everything was going good, MrBeast the person took all credit for MrBeast the company. Now, it seems like everyone is on tip-toes to clarify they are trash-talking MrBeast the company, not MrBeast the person. Yeah, I can't really understand why someone would craft a persona with a unique bespoke name and then name the company the same thing other than to try to make sure that the company is viewed as synonymous with the persona.
- Wolfenstein98k 2y ago
  The bigger the company gets, the more separate it becomes from its founder/face/whatever. Inevitable. (Although this document clearly sets out that this distinction should be fought at every step, so that counts against what I'm saying. It is trying desperately to ensure the company reflects the man as much as possible)
gonzo41 2y ago
The no doesn't mean no section was about contractors and dealing with other people. It was a way of conveying that if you ask for something and get an outright refusal, then it's ok to ask again and pivot on details to try and find a fit. MrBeasts company drove a train into a big pit (one of the few videos I watched). That call, would have started with, I'd like to buy a train and a big pit. It probably started as a flat out refusal before he turned up with money.
- valval 2y ago
  I bet the folks at Train & Pit Co. Couldn’t believe their ears.
yard2010 2y ago
You don't understand. In this culture if you have enough money no does not mean no. You have less laws to care about. In some cases you ARE the law.
citizenpaul 2y ago
My biggest critizism of A/B/C is it is always either a delusion, lie, or manipulation. People that talk frequently about "A players/employees" are almost certainly not the ones hiring them. Why? "A players" don't work someplace where they are not respected and ground to dust as a non-owner. That means at best the best employees are "B-players" and probably most of their staff is actually "C-players" "A players" know their worth and go somewhere that either has prestige, high pay or work life balance and respect. Like all such places in my experience Mrbeast does not appear to provide those things to all but his inner circle. Which by the way an "Inner circle" is a hallmark of places that like to make noise about A/B/C dynamics.
- lukas099 2y ago
  I would like to believe that's true, but honestly, I know some really hard workers who are gluttons for abuse.
  - citizenpaul 2y ago
    Sure. My point really was though that if you find a place that is openly discussing A/B/C dynamics it is a huge red flag.
- grensley 2y ago
  "C-Players" tend to keep "A-Players" out of legal trouble, so Jimmy might just now be learning their value.
next_xibalba 2y ago
> labor laws and unions Perhaps this is as much a commentary on the state of labor laws and unions as anything else.

slt2021 2y ago

MrBeast has given up his life for his youtube channel (he writes exactly this in the doc) - and he is looking for other people willing to give up theirs for his channel

sanderjd 2y ago
People should not do that, though. There are better things to dedicate lives to.
- slt2021 2y ago
  who are you to dictate what people do with their lives and deny them their free will?
  - sgu999 2y ago
    [flagged]
    - gosub100 2y ago
      An opinion would be stated like "I believe" or "I feel". The GP comment said "people shouldn't", which is a directive/command. Words actually mean specific things, who'd have thought?
      - sgu999 2y ago
        And who would think that context matters to derive meaning from words. "In my opinion people shouldn't" is the very obvious meaning of "People shouldn't" when a rando with no authority whatsoever comments on an obscure internet forum.
      - sanderjd 2y ago
        So, you can look at my comment history to find me waffling about whether every opinion ought to be prefaced with "I believe". Lots of writing advice suggests not doing that, because it's obvious from context and thus redundant, but I find that there is almost always at least one comment like this one when it is elided, which does make me question this writing advice. Having said that, in this case, I think this is just wrong: > "people shouldn't", which is a directive/command I think this is a misreading of the word "shouldn't"... It does not mean "are forbidden to". I honestly struggle to see how you could possibly read it as a "directive/command", especially in a random comment on the internet rather than, like, a legal document (where it wouldn't appear anyway). I think it's pretty clearly a value judgment, and thus fairly clear that it is a subjective opinion, as all value judgments are.
        sgu999 2y ago
        > I honestly struggle to see how you could possibly read it as a "directive/command" I feel like they don't. I believe it's just an attempt at making you refrain from giving your opinion in the future, because reading your opinion bothers them.
- saintradon 2y ago
  > There are better things to dedicate lives to. Then those aren't people Jimmy wants to hire for his company. There are hundreds of millions of teenagers on this planet that want to stake everything they own to make a YouTube channel and reap the rewards - ownership of their work, being their own boss, potentially lucrative amounts of money, microcelebrity if not greater levels of fame, etc. Some will do it, and some won't. Jimmy is very clearly talking to those people. I know because I was one of them, making my first few hundred dollars ever from adsense at the age of 14 (till I was demonetized a year later and my channel got taken down for copyright, but hey, you learn). I've since grown a bit a taken that energy and it's helped guide me as I learn to make my own startup right now - it's the same adrenaline rush and pursuit of the American dream.
  - pests 2y ago
    It's interesting to me that you did this with YouTube, as I did the same when I was 16 (almost 20 years ago now) but with AdSense. I earned about $70 (mostly off my buddies anime site) which I never collected. Seven years later Google sends the money to my state's unclaimed fund. Even more years later I finally collect that $70 check. Just wanted to share some fond memories.
  - sanderjd 2y ago
    Yep, I get it. This is all true. What I'm saying is that, in my opinion, it's also bad and those people (and perhaps you) ought to choose a better path. I recognize that many of them won't. There are lots of things I think people (including myself!) ought not do, which we still do anyway.
- earnesti 2y ago
  Or, you can go work there for 1-2 years, learn a lot and move on. Maybe to some more relaxed work, or start your own venture. It actually sounds like a place where you might learn something.
  - sanderjd 2y ago
    Yep, to the extent that this is a sensible thing to do, this is the sensible way to do it. This is clearly analogous to working in high-pressure finance shops or in startups for a fairly short period of time in order to drink from a firehose. The problem is that the kind of people who are ambitious enough to think this sounds like a good idea often (maybe usually) get sucked deeply into it. But yep, I do think it's a reasonable model if you can avoid that outcome and get in and out early in your career.
- TrapLord_Rhodo 2y ago
  >There are better things to dedicate lives to. Everyone seems to think that they have the answers to this question... Family, friends, community, god, volunteering at the local soup kitchen.. All over your own wants? If you are a video creator/ creative and that's what gives you energy and all the feel good chems, why not work your ASS off for THE CREATOR of our generation? Cause from the way i see it, success and the confidence* it brings, solves all other issues. *As long as you can avoid the pitfall of arrogance.
  - sanderjd 2y ago
    Because, in my opinion, this is a worse thing to do with your life than the many better options. I don't have some One Right Answer to what the best thing to do with your life is, but I'm comfortable having a personal - but strong - opinion on a rough ordering that, for instance, puts family and friends much higher than a life dedicated to "THE CREATOR of our generation". Maybe you think that sounds impressive? I think it just sounds very sad.
AndyMcConachie 2y ago
This is what we call a cult.
- valval 2y ago
  You can call it whatever you want, it’s obvious you’re never going to be part of it.
malthaus 2y ago
the audacity to ask other people to give up their life for helping you fulfil your dream and even sell it to them as them fulfilling their dream. is it the same "temporarily embarrassed millionaires" shtick the american dream brainwashed americans with? if you have that much drive and want to invest so heavily in work - do yourself a favour and do it as a leader where you call the shots and have the equity instead of as a follower.
- Aeglaecia 2y ago
  [flagged]
- TrapLord_Rhodo 2y ago
  THIS. I would like to tell you a bit of a personal story and this may shed some light on your question. Disclaimer* I am American. I was working at Tesla on the CapEx team, and unless you were doing something "interesting", like going to Tahoe or something, then you were expected to be in the office on Saturday and Sunday. I worked my ass off, pulling 70 hour weeks, catching naps in a conference room when there was a big push. I learned to be energized by my work, seeing the factory cells come together gave me this giant rush. Eventually, I got the thought you had but i worded it differently. "I will never be Elon, working for Elon". So when Covid hit, i got put fully remote and started having some conversations with potential clients to launch my own consultancy. After a couple of months, our managers told us to start coming back into office. I had gotten some traction with the consultancy, so i decideded to "do [myself] a favour and do it as a leader where [i] call[ed] the shots and have the equity instead of as a follower." At first it was great! I was learning an absolute ton, designed my own website from scratch, wrote a bunch of automation code, my sales ration was like 85% because i was just calling on all my old associates and references of references... life was great! Then after i scaled, I realized I wasn't actually doing anything... I have these meetings, and my schedule is always swamped with evaluating this peice of software/this person, generating "Work" for different people, and i freaking hated it! I stopped learning... I had no peers, only employees. I had "Mentors" but my consultancy was so nitch so outside "Executive mentorship" i had no one to guide me. I tried to focus on growth opportunities within the company, scaling different verticles as different companies and other things to keep my mind working, but i slowly but surely lost interest. I couldn't push myself 70 hours a week because i didn't have anyone pushing me, and i hated "Consulting". but every chance i got i would be watching drone videos over the Giga Texas progress. I kept up with every SpaceX, Tesla update ever... And suddenly i realised, i deeply missed working at Tesla... i don't want to be Elon... But that Elon is building some pretty cool shit, and factories, robots, automation is super cool and fun. So i sold my consultancy for 1.5X revenues (Pretty shit deal but i wanted out). It didn't give me fuck you money but i could have chilled for a bit... but now I'm happily working my ass off back at Tesla, fulfilling Elons dream. But i get to "Give up my life" to get to play with robots all day. I'm learning a ton again, i love my team, and i've never met a smarter group of people.
earnesti 2y ago
He is fricking 26 years old. He hasn't given his life for anything. At the moment he is, yes, but likely after some years he is retired on his yacht.
- _zamorano_ 2y ago
  Some things leave a permanent mark on you. Try being a workaholic a few years and tell me later how easy is to disconnect, and rejoin with familiy and friends.
  - FrankoDelMar 2y ago
    Yeah, working constantly for a few years leaves permanent marks. You know what makes it better in ways we'll never have? Millions of dollars, luxury yachts, and fame. Mr. Beast isn't a doctor. He isn't a teacher. He doesn't fight our wars. He makes entertainment for children. He'll be fine.
    - geerlingguy 2y ago
      I think parent comment was referring to employees who are willing to dig in and sacrifice a few years of their lives for MrBeast productions, not to Jimmy Donaldson (though I could be interpreting it wrong).
OJFord 2y ago
That's like me saying I've given up my life to have the job that I have currently and live where I do. Or you've given up your life for however you spend it. It just about makes some sort of sense in the context of something like giving up a professional career in a developed country and moving to a remote African village to do aid work, but giving up your life to make a tonne of money creating viral YouTube videos is an absurd description.
jrochkind1 2y ago
Giving up your life for many millions of dollar is a choice. His employees are probably payed well, but obviously don't make as much as he. So I guess asking them to give up their lives for less compensation is to say their lives are or less value...
- Wolfenstein98k 2y ago
  No, it's to offer them a chance to make a lot of money in exchange for a lot of work. No one is forced to work there and they are not taken advantage of. Any of them are free to start their own channel and outcompete him! It's literally how he did it!

pests 2y ago

One thing I find interesting over the last few weeks since this was released (and other MrBeast drama) is how there is now a separation between MrBeast the person and MrBeast the company. Before today, it was never differentiated. Since the drama started, I've seen more news and people (like yourself) clarify that you mean the company vs the person, and I'm not sure its warranted. While everything was going good, MrBeast the person took all credit for MrBeast the company. Now, it seems like everyone is on tip-toes to clarify they are trash-talking MrBeast the company, not MrBeast the person. It just seems a bit weird to me.

geerlingguy 2y ago
Honestly I never met Jimmy even though I was in his studio for two weeks working on the video. I did meet a ton of his employees, many of whom I'd gladly work with again, just not on a MrBeast production. I just can't speak to Jimmy Donaldson himself. Not even sure how much he's involved in the day to day at the company (outside of being the public face).
saghm 2y ago
> While everything was going good, MrBeast the person took all credit for MrBeast the company. Now, it seems like everyone is on tip-toes to clarify they are trash-talking MrBeast the company, not MrBeast the person. Yeah, I can't really understand why someone would craft a persona with a unique bespoke name and then name the company the same thing other than to try to make sure that the company is viewed as synonymous with the persona.
Wolfenstein98k 2y ago
The bigger the company gets, the more separate it becomes from its founder/face/whatever. Inevitable. (Although this document clearly sets out that this distinction should be fought at every step, so that counts against what I'm saying. It is trying desperately to ensure the company reflects the man as much as possible)

gonzo41 2y ago

The no doesn't mean no section was about contractors and dealing with other people. It was a way of conveying that if you ask for something and get an outright refusal, then it's ok to ask again and pivot on details to try and find a fit. MrBeasts company drove a train into a big pit (one of the few videos I watched). That call, would have started with, I'd like to buy a train and a big pit. It probably started as a flat out refusal before he turned up with money.

valval 2y ago
I bet the folks at Train & Pit Co. Couldn’t believe their ears.

yard2010 2y ago

You don't understand. In this culture if you have enough money no does not mean no. You have less laws to care about. In some cases you ARE the law.

citizenpaul 2y ago

My biggest critizism of A/B/C is it is always either a delusion, lie, or manipulation. People that talk frequently about "A players/employees" are almost certainly not the ones hiring them. Why? "A players" don't work someplace where they are not respected and ground to dust as a non-owner. That means at best the best employees are "B-players" and probably most of their staff is actually "C-players" "A players" know their worth and go somewhere that either has prestige, high pay or work life balance and respect. Like all such places in my experience Mrbeast does not appear to provide those things to all but his inner circle. Which by the way an "Inner circle" is a hallmark of places that like to make noise about A/B/C dynamics.

lukas099 2y ago
I would like to believe that's true, but honestly, I know some really hard workers who are gluttons for abuse.
- citizenpaul 2y ago
  Sure. My point really was though that if you find a place that is openly discussing A/B/C dynamics it is a huge red flag.
grensley 2y ago
"C-Players" tend to keep "A-Players" out of legal trouble, so Jimmy might just now be learning their value.

next_xibalba 2y ago

> labor laws and unions Perhaps this is as much a commentary on the state of labor laws and unions as anything else.