4 ms·

What Firefox trains are we in?

99 points by joebig 2y ago

gkoberger 2y ago
If you're curious what this means... years ago, Firefox took forever to hit 3.6, and the decision was made (mirroring Chrome) that releases would switch from "release when everything is done" to "the trains always run on time", where the release would go out at a predetermined time and anything that was ready would make it. Mozilla also has a habit of simple question-based domains, such as "arewefastyet.com", for tracking progress.
- culi 2y ago
  Here's a list of sites. The Rust community has also (by extension) adopted the snowclone (e.g. arewegameyet.rs) https://wiki.mozilla.org/Areweyet https://wiki.mozilla.org/Areweyet
  - slightwinder 2y ago
    Do they get a massive discount on domain, or why are they so wasteful with them?
    - tricked 2y ago
      I'm pretty sure this is just a list not necessarily owned by Mozilla.
    - gkoberger 2y ago
      They aren’t all official necessarily; lots of people at the company or community members make them.
    - culi 2y ago
      A highly specific domain like this is what? $12 a year?
- joebig 2y ago
  Thanks. Also makes it easy to browse between releases to check dev notes and in general 'What's new'.
- kirk782 2y ago
  Was it done because Mozilla thought that Chrome's increasing version numbers would make ordinary people think that Chrome was ahead of Firefox ?
  - zamadatix 2y ago
    It's definitely a common thought but there are other considerations too regardless if that's really true or not e.g. browsers needed constant security updates anyways, no reason to not also regularly deliver features that were sitting ready to be used with that update infrastructure.
    - sdk- 2y ago
      It's easier to do small releases often. You have less chances to break multiple parts of the application. You also don't end up in a cycle of "Wait! I'll add just one more thing" which is very common with projects tend to less often.
  - _ZeD_ 2y ago
    Like what happened with Slackware 7
  - eholk 2y ago
    This was back when Internet Explorer was at version 7. Some Mozilla folks told me they used to get questions like "when are you going to upgrade to Internet 7 like Microsoft?" If I remember right, after Firefox 4 they skipped a few versions and started the train model, while also trying to de-emphasize the version number in marketing.
  - abhinavk 2y ago
    Microsoft thought the same for naming their 2nd Xbox the Xbox 360.
    - bee_rider 2y ago
      So revolutionary. They took the Xbox strategy, totally flipped it on its head. Then they flipped it again.
- thrdbndndn 2y ago
  Not that matters, but "what xxx" question really doesn't have the same vibe as "are we xxx yet" ones.
- glandium 2y ago
  You're thinking about Firefox 4.
  - gkoberger 2y ago
    You’re right! It was 3.6 -> 4 took forever.
- graetzer 2y ago
  The numbers reported on arewefastyet.com seem to stop at July 15th though
- lloydatkinson 2y ago
  Why is that site so poorly designed? I tried in both FF and Chrome. In FF I see nothing on any chart. On Chrome, I see a few data points in July and then nothing else.
  - qwertox 2y ago
    I had to switch to "Platform: Windows 11 64bit"
sdk- 2y ago
There's also a nice website to see what landed in a specific Nightly build https://mrotherguy.github.io/fx-nightly-changelog/ https://mrotherguy.github.io/fx-nightly-changelog/
- joebig 2y ago
  Cool. Helped me track down the origin story of the 'dedicated search button' feature which, to me, mysteriously insinuated itself into Android FF:) https://blog.nightly.mozilla.org/2024/07/18/100-webdriver-bidi-and-101-more-these-weeks-in-firefox-issue-164/ https://blog.nightly.mozilla.org/2024/07/18/100-webdriver-bi...
captn3m0 2y ago
Few related things I had to track down about this site recently: 1. This is an official Mozilla site. 2. Source is at https://github.com/mozilla/releases_insights https://github.com/mozilla/releases_insights, under MPL-2.0 3. Thanks to Pascal Chevrel for creating and maintaining this. https://whattrainisitnow.com/humans.txt https://whattrainisitnow.com/humans.txt As far as I can tell, this is the only official page that documents Firefox 115 ESR being extended for Windows 7-8.1 and macOS 10.12-10.14 up to March 2025.
- KwanEsq 2y ago
  There's also https://groups.google.com/a/mozilla.org/g/dev-platform/c/ffRCWVVHvAQ https://groups.google.com/a/mozilla.org/g/dev-platform/c/ffR... , if that would count
DidYaWipe 2y ago
[flagged]
anorangecat 2y ago
Which of these trains is for the developer edition of firefox?
- McGuffin 2y ago
  By default it is on the aurora update channel, seems to have the same version number as beta, but you can also change it ( https://wiki.mozilla.org/Software_Update:Channels https://wiki.mozilla.org/Software_Update:Channels ).
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
butz 2y ago
First time I hear about "train" analogy in release management. Interesting if someone is going to build this visualisation with actual animated train models and tracks ;)
francispauli 2y ago
I finally gave up on firefox a year ago, after being a lifetime user. I can live with it being slightly slower than other browsers but it had strange hangs and very slow loading sometimes that made me switch and didn't find in other browsers. It could be an extension, that specific about:config setting or sometinhg else but i switched to have a browser that doesn't require me troubleshoot this stuff.

99 points by joebig 2y ago

If you're curious what this means... years ago, Firefox took forever to hit 3.6, and the decision was made (mirroring Chrome) that releases would switch from "release when everything is done" to "the trains always run on time", where the release would go out at a predetermined time and anything that was ready would make it. Mozilla also has a habit of simple question-based domains, such as "arewefastyet.com", for tracking progress.

culi 2y ago
Here's a list of sites. The Rust community has also (by extension) adopted the snowclone (e.g. arewegameyet.rs) https://wiki.mozilla.org/Areweyet https://wiki.mozilla.org/Areweyet
- slightwinder 2y ago
  Do they get a massive discount on domain, or why are they so wasteful with them?
  - tricked 2y ago
    I'm pretty sure this is just a list not necessarily owned by Mozilla.
  - gkoberger 2y ago
    They aren’t all official necessarily; lots of people at the company or community members make them.
  - culi 2y ago
    A highly specific domain like this is what? $12 a year?
joebig 2y ago
Thanks. Also makes it easy to browse between releases to check dev notes and in general 'What's new'.
kirk782 2y ago
Was it done because Mozilla thought that Chrome's increasing version numbers would make ordinary people think that Chrome was ahead of Firefox ?
- zamadatix 2y ago
  It's definitely a common thought but there are other considerations too regardless if that's really true or not e.g. browsers needed constant security updates anyways, no reason to not also regularly deliver features that were sitting ready to be used with that update infrastructure.
  - sdk- 2y ago
    It's easier to do small releases often. You have less chances to break multiple parts of the application. You also don't end up in a cycle of "Wait! I'll add just one more thing" which is very common with projects tend to less often.
- _ZeD_ 2y ago
  Like what happened with Slackware 7
- eholk 2y ago
  This was back when Internet Explorer was at version 7. Some Mozilla folks told me they used to get questions like "when are you going to upgrade to Internet 7 like Microsoft?" If I remember right, after Firefox 4 they skipped a few versions and started the train model, while also trying to de-emphasize the version number in marketing.
- abhinavk 2y ago
  Microsoft thought the same for naming their 2nd Xbox the Xbox 360.
  - bee_rider 2y ago
    So revolutionary. They took the Xbox strategy, totally flipped it on its head. Then they flipped it again.
thrdbndndn 2y ago
Not that matters, but "what xxx" question really doesn't have the same vibe as "are we xxx yet" ones.
glandium 2y ago
You're thinking about Firefox 4.
- gkoberger 2y ago
  You’re right! It was 3.6 -> 4 took forever.
graetzer 2y ago
The numbers reported on arewefastyet.com seem to stop at July 15th though
lloydatkinson 2y ago
Why is that site so poorly designed? I tried in both FF and Chrome. In FF I see nothing on any chart. On Chrome, I see a few data points in July and then nothing else.
- qwertox 2y ago
  I had to switch to "Platform: Windows 11 64bit"

sdk- 2y ago

There's also a nice website to see what landed in a specific Nightly build https://mrotherguy.github.io/fx-nightly-changelog/ https://mrotherguy.github.io/fx-nightly-changelog/

joebig 2y ago
Cool. Helped me track down the origin story of the 'dedicated search button' feature which, to me, mysteriously insinuated itself into Android FF:) https://blog.nightly.mozilla.org/2024/07/18/100-webdriver-bidi-and-101-more-these-weeks-in-firefox-issue-164/ https://blog.nightly.mozilla.org/2024/07/18/100-webdriver-bi...

captn3m0 2y ago

Few related things I had to track down about this site recently: 1. This is an official Mozilla site. 2. Source is at https://github.com/mozilla/releases_insights https://github.com/mozilla/releases_insights, under MPL-2.0 3. Thanks to Pascal Chevrel for creating and maintaining this. https://whattrainisitnow.com/humans.txt https://whattrainisitnow.com/humans.txt As far as I can tell, this is the only official page that documents Firefox 115 ESR being extended for Windows 7-8.1 and macOS 10.12-10.14 up to March 2025.

KwanEsq 2y ago
There's also https://groups.google.com/a/mozilla.org/g/dev-platform/c/ffRCWVVHvAQ https://groups.google.com/a/mozilla.org/g/dev-platform/c/ffR... , if that would count

DidYaWipe 2y ago

[flagged]

anorangecat 2y ago

Which of these trains is for the developer edition of firefox?

McGuffin 2y ago
By default it is on the aurora update channel, seems to have the same version number as beta, but you can also change it ( https://wiki.mozilla.org/Software_Update:Channels https://wiki.mozilla.org/Software_Update:Channels ).

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

butz 2y ago

First time I hear about "train" analogy in release management. Interesting if someone is going to build this visualisation with actual animated train models and tracks ;)

francispauli 2y ago

I finally gave up on firefox a year ago, after being a lifetime user. I can live with it being slightly slower than other browsers but it had strange hangs and very slow loading sometimes that made me switch and didn't find in other browsers. It could be an extension, that specific about:config setting or sometinhg else but i switched to have a browser that doesn't require me troubleshoot this stuff.