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I'm a little confused on what this means: > The bill [...] would prohibit the company's products from operating on U.S. communications infrastructure. It would

I'm a little confused on what this means: > The bill [...] would prohibit the company's products from operating on U.S. communications infrastructure. It would not prevent existing DJI drones from operating in the United States. How could existing drones continue operating while prohibited from comms infra? Does anyone have a link to the actual bill or some other source that goes into more detail? I have multiple DJI drones and would like to know how this affects me since I was planning to upgrade soon...

lazide 2y ago
DJI drones don’t use any comms infrastructure, do they?
- buggy6257 2y ago
  That was my assumption too but why specifically call this out? I'm just confused by this statement and want to figure out what's actually in the bill...
  - lazide 2y ago
    I’d assume it’s so they can look they they’re doing something while actually doing nothing at all.
  - yrxuthst 2y ago
    Some of their higher end competition like the ACSL SOTEN [1] have LTE connectivity for remote control, this might just be to limit competition at the high end of the market. 1. https://product.acsl.co.jp/en/product/post-369/ https://product.acsl.co.jp/en/product/post-369/
    - CaptainOfCoit 2y ago
      > ACSL SOTEN [1] have LTE connectivity for remote control LTE connectivity that would use US infrastructure (LTE towers) for its connection. Unless the drones start shipping with satellite radio, I'm not sure what the scare is about, seems to be mostly about that Chinese products just shouldn't be available to the average American.
- tracerbulletx 2y ago
  GPS? Also your phone is on the cell network and the software is connecting to the network over that.
- slimsag 2y ago
  DJI sells a product called Aeroscope which is an antenna platform used by airport towers; it shows them via the frequencies the drones operate on where the drone is, that it is active, all information tied to the serial number including the drone pilot's FAA registration (who the owner of the drone is, the pilot's phone number, their address, etc.) It also this shows them the location of the pilot via the remote control frequency. This applies even for their sub-$1000 consumer drones, and FAA registration is mandatory for all drones above 250g weight.
  - lazide 2y ago
    What does that have to do with the comments? That also isn’t using US comms infrastructure, correct? My understanding is that is all broadcast via the ‘unregulated’ bands between the drone and controller + bits that are mandated to be broadcast by the FAA.
adrianmonk 2y ago
I was confused by that, too. I found this video where Congressman Pallone summarizes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X9dlYHN8dQ8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X9dlYHN8dQ8 I'll type a quick transcript: > In the last few months, we've seen reports that hacking groups linked to China, Russia, North Korean, and Iran are gaining access to our communications networks to conduct surveillance, collect massive amounts of data, and manipulate our elections. And because of this, there's a real risk that the information they collect could be used to launch cyberattacks on our critical infrastructure and undermine our democratic values of free speech and expression, as well as civil and human rights. But fortunately, Congress has acted with strong bipartisan support to bolster the defense of our communications networks. My bipartisan Secure and Trusted Communications Networks Act, which became law in 2020, established a list of equipment and services that pose a national security risk and prevent their use in our communications networks. And HR 2864 builds on that bipartisan work by adding the telecommunications and video surveillance equipment and services provided by so-called DJI Technologies, better recognizes the equipment and services used in their drones to the Federal Communication Commission's covered list. With this action, Congress will ensure that future versions of DJI drones cannot be imported, marketed, or sold in the United States. This is the current bill: https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/house-bill/2864 https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/house-bill/2864 This is the earlier law that establishes the list that DJI stuff will be added to: https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/house-bill/4998/text https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/house-bill/4998... The law prohibits providers of "advanced communications service" from using certain equipment, if they receive subsidies. And if they do, it reimburses them for replacing it with other equipment. And here's what the current bill says about the DJI equipment: > The communications equipment or service being— > (A) telecommunications or video surveillance equipment produced by Shenzhen Da-Jiang Innovations Sciences and Technologies Company Limited (commonly known as ‘DJI Technologies’) (or any subsidiary or affiliate thereof); or > (B) telecommunications or video surveillance services, including software, provided by an entity described in subparagraph (A) or using equipment described in such subparagraph. So, if you're a phone company, ISP, cable company, etc. and if you get federal subsidies, then you won't be able to buy DJI drones or use their software / services, and you won't be able to "maintain" (keep using?) whatever you already have either. I'm not sure what threat they're specifically trying to protect against. One guess would be exfiltration of video / photos of important infrastructure. Another guess would be DJI's software running on systems which could be used as a springboard for hacking.
rasz 2y ago
DJI calls home?

lazide 2y ago

DJI drones don’t use any comms infrastructure, do they?

buggy6257 2y ago
That was my assumption too but why specifically call this out? I'm just confused by this statement and want to figure out what's actually in the bill...
- lazide 2y ago
  I’d assume it’s so they can look they they’re doing something while actually doing nothing at all.
- yrxuthst 2y ago
  Some of their higher end competition like the ACSL SOTEN [1] have LTE connectivity for remote control, this might just be to limit competition at the high end of the market. 1. https://product.acsl.co.jp/en/product/post-369/ https://product.acsl.co.jp/en/product/post-369/
  - CaptainOfCoit 2y ago
    > ACSL SOTEN [1] have LTE connectivity for remote control LTE connectivity that would use US infrastructure (LTE towers) for its connection. Unless the drones start shipping with satellite radio, I'm not sure what the scare is about, seems to be mostly about that Chinese products just shouldn't be available to the average American.
tracerbulletx 2y ago
GPS? Also your phone is on the cell network and the software is connecting to the network over that.
slimsag 2y ago
DJI sells a product called Aeroscope which is an antenna platform used by airport towers; it shows them via the frequencies the drones operate on where the drone is, that it is active, all information tied to the serial number including the drone pilot's FAA registration (who the owner of the drone is, the pilot's phone number, their address, etc.) It also this shows them the location of the pilot via the remote control frequency. This applies even for their sub-$1000 consumer drones, and FAA registration is mandatory for all drones above 250g weight.
- lazide 2y ago
  What does that have to do with the comments? That also isn’t using US comms infrastructure, correct? My understanding is that is all broadcast via the ‘unregulated’ bands between the drone and controller + bits that are mandated to be broadcast by the FAA.

adrianmonk 2y ago

I was confused by that, too. I found this video where Congressman Pallone summarizes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X9dlYHN8dQ8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X9dlYHN8dQ8 I'll type a quick transcript: > In the last few months, we've seen reports that hacking groups linked to China, Russia, North Korean, and Iran are gaining access to our communications networks to conduct surveillance, collect massive amounts of data, and manipulate our elections. And because of this, there's a real risk that the information they collect could be used to launch cyberattacks on our critical infrastructure and undermine our democratic values of free speech and expression, as well as civil and human rights. But fortunately, Congress has acted with strong bipartisan support to bolster the defense of our communications networks. My bipartisan Secure and Trusted Communications Networks Act, which became law in 2020, established a list of equipment and services that pose a national security risk and prevent their use in our communications networks. And HR 2864 builds on that bipartisan work by adding the telecommunications and video surveillance equipment and services provided by so-called DJI Technologies, better recognizes the equipment and services used in their drones to the Federal Communication Commission's covered list. With this action, Congress will ensure that future versions of DJI drones cannot be imported, marketed, or sold in the United States. This is the current bill: https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/house-bill/2864 https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/house-bill/2864 This is the earlier law that establishes the list that DJI stuff will be added to: https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/house-bill/4998/text https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/house-bill/4998... The law prohibits providers of "advanced communications service" from using certain equipment, if they receive subsidies. And if they do, it reimburses them for replacing it with other equipment. And here's what the current bill says about the DJI equipment: > The communications equipment or service being— > (A) telecommunications or video surveillance equipment produced by Shenzhen Da-Jiang Innovations Sciences and Technologies Company Limited (commonly known as ‘DJI Technologies’) (or any subsidiary or affiliate thereof); or > (B) telecommunications or video surveillance services, including software, provided by an entity described in subparagraph (A) or using equipment described in such subparagraph. So, if you're a phone company, ISP, cable company, etc. and if you get federal subsidies, then you won't be able to buy DJI drones or use their software / services, and you won't be able to "maintain" (keep using?) whatever you already have either. I'm not sure what threat they're specifically trying to protect against. One guess would be exfiltration of video / photos of important infrastructure. Another guess would be DJI's software running on systems which could be used as a springboard for hacking.

rasz 2y ago

DJI calls home?