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What do you mean by "infinite"? Can we keep growing by a few percentage points a year for the next few centuries? Yeah, probably. Can we do that until the heat

What do you mean by "infinite"? Can we keep growing by a few percentage points a year for the next few centuries? Yeah, probably. Can we do that until the heat death of the universe and beyond? Probably not. Stuff gets weird when you include "infinity".

tzs 2y ago
> Can we keep growing by a few percentage points a year for the next few centuries? Yeah, probably 2 percent a year for 200 years (the minimum rate and years that could count as a few) is a multiplier or around 52. For population that would give about 400 billion. > Can we do that until the heat death of the universe and beyond? Probably not. For population and energy we hit severe physical limits long before that. At 1% annual growth in population in 12000 years we run out room. What I mean by "run out of room" is that assuming no FTL travel then since every human right now is on Earth or in low Earth orbit no human 12000 years from now can be more than 12000 light years from Earth. The volume of a sphere 12000 light years in radius, divided by the population after 12000 years of 1% growth, is less than the volume of a human. How about energy? 9300 years of 1% annual energy growth starting now reaches a level where our annual consumption equals the energy of the entire Milky Way galaxy. By "energy of the entire Milky Way" mean everything...electromagnetic radiation, gravitational potential energy, the E=mc^2 energy of everything that has mass. If we can somehow actually do that, 2700 more years of 1% annual energy growth and we are annually consuming the entire energy of the observable universe. Its similar when you look at the mass to make human bodies. Here's what 1% annual population growth looks like in terms of mass needed: 3400 years to where the mass of human bodies equals the total mass of Earth and Moon. 600 more years and we also need Jupiter's mass. 700 more and we need the mass of the whole solar system. Then it is another 2000 before we need the mass of the entire Milky way. 100 more years and we need the Andromeda galaxy's mass too. That's 6800 years from now. Then it is 5500 years until all mass in the observable universe is needed for human bodies. Unless we get FTL travel it seems pretty clear than sometime in the next 12000 years either growth must slow or we have to change humans to require a lot less space, mass, and energy.

tzs 2y ago

> Can we keep growing by a few percentage points a year for the next few centuries? Yeah, probably 2 percent a year for 200 years (the minimum rate and years that could count as a few) is a multiplier or around 52. For population that would give about 400 billion. > Can we do that until the heat death of the universe and beyond? Probably not. For population and energy we hit severe physical limits long before that. At 1% annual growth in population in 12000 years we run out room. What I mean by "run out of room" is that assuming no FTL travel then since every human right now is on Earth or in low Earth orbit no human 12000 years from now can be more than 12000 light years from Earth. The volume of a sphere 12000 light years in radius, divided by the population after 12000 years of 1% growth, is less than the volume of a human. How about energy? 9300 years of 1% annual energy growth starting now reaches a level where our annual consumption equals the energy of the entire Milky Way galaxy. By "energy of the entire Milky Way" mean everything...electromagnetic radiation, gravitational potential energy, the E=mc^2 energy of everything that has mass. If we can somehow actually do that, 2700 more years of 1% annual energy growth and we are annually consuming the entire energy of the observable universe. Its similar when you look at the mass to make human bodies. Here's what 1% annual population growth looks like in terms of mass needed: 3400 years to where the mass of human bodies equals the total mass of Earth and Moon. 600 more years and we also need Jupiter's mass. 700 more and we need the mass of the whole solar system. Then it is another 2000 before we need the mass of the entire Milky way. 100 more years and we need the Andromeda galaxy's mass too. That's 6800 years from now. Then it is 5500 years until all mass in the observable universe is needed for human bodies. Unless we get FTL travel it seems pretty clear than sometime in the next 12000 years either growth must slow or we have to change humans to require a lot less space, mass, and energy.