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Doesn't running a post office help people communicate coded messages about nefarious things? Doesn't running a telephone network help people do the same? What a

Doesn't running a post office help people communicate coded messages about nefarious things? Doesn't running a telephone network help people do the same? What about cellular hardware providers and maintainers?

ajross 2y ago
Tor isn't a post office or telephone network. We have post offices and telephone networks. Tor also isn't a replacement for a web browser or internet, we have those too. Tor's feature isn't "communication" in the abstract, it's anonymity. And yes, that can be used for good or for evil. But the upthread comment was saying how nice it was to run an exit node because it was "helping people". And to the extent that's true, I think correct thinking demands you also account for the harm. And let's be clear: Tor is definitely harmful. Almost all Tor traffic is some degree of nefarious. The tiny handful of dissidents are drowned in a sea of phishing and contraband.
- abc88889 2y ago
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krisoft 2y ago
They do. But all of the above bend over backwards to help law enforcement. > post office help people communicate coded messages about nefarious thing The US postal service scans and stores the outside of every envelope and package they handle. Law enforcement agencies can query this metadata. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mail_Isolation_Control_and_Tracking https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mail_Isolation_Control_and_T... > Doesn't running a telephone network help people do the same? They do, but they are not only share the metadata with law enforcement, but also let them wiretap. (Often they require a warrant for this, but that is not a hard burden for a LEO.) And this capability is not some aftertought, but deeply integrated into their tech stack.
- WarOnPrivacy 2y ago
  > But all of the above bend over backwards to help law enforcement. We prefer they assist LEO operating under court order, instead.
MinMau221 2y ago
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ajross 2y ago

Tor isn't a post office or telephone network. We have post offices and telephone networks. Tor also isn't a replacement for a web browser or internet, we have those too. Tor's feature isn't "communication" in the abstract, it's anonymity. And yes, that can be used for good or for evil. But the upthread comment was saying how nice it was to run an exit node because it was "helping people". And to the extent that's true, I think correct thinking demands you also account for the harm. And let's be clear: Tor is definitely harmful. Almost all Tor traffic is some degree of nefarious. The tiny handful of dissidents are drowned in a sea of phishing and contraband.

abc88889 2y ago
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krisoft 2y ago

They do. But all of the above bend over backwards to help law enforcement. > post office help people communicate coded messages about nefarious thing The US postal service scans and stores the outside of every envelope and package they handle. Law enforcement agencies can query this metadata. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mail_Isolation_Control_and_Tracking https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mail_Isolation_Control_and_T... > Doesn't running a telephone network help people do the same? They do, but they are not only share the metadata with law enforcement, but also let them wiretap. (Often they require a warrant for this, but that is not a hard burden for a LEO.) And this capability is not some aftertought, but deeply integrated into their tech stack.

WarOnPrivacy 2y ago
> But all of the above bend over backwards to help law enforcement. We prefer they assist LEO operating under court order, instead.

MinMau221 2y ago

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