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At a certain point they are going to run into wiretap laws, right? Not a lawyer, but my understanding is that everywhere in North America is at least single pa

At a certain point they are going to run into wiretap laws, right? Not a lawyer, but my understanding is that everywhere in North America is at least single party consent, and many places are all party consent for recording. Ford can say that by buying a car I have agreed to the terms and conditions (although, I would argue that simply buying a product should be separate from terms and conditions), but my passengers haven't, and they certainly have an expectation that their conversations are private in my vehicle. At a certain point, ad tech is going to run into an ambitious prosecutor or government attorney, and I can't wait.

linuxftw 2y ago
No, because on page 397 of the EULA that pops up on the in-dash LED screen after the 3rd OTA software update specifically stated you authorized this.
- jdsully 2y ago
  But that's the point, you need consent of the person on the other side of the line too which didn't sign the EULA
  - linuxftw 2y ago
    I took it to mean they're listening to the conversation inside of the car, not a telephone call being placed through the car's audio system.
- lcnPylGDnU4H9OF 2y ago
  That might work in a one-party consent state but the passenger who never interacts with the touch screen in a two-party consent state would have a stronger case. Though, even then, gathering the evidence that they're violating such laws would probably be a pretty big hurdle.
  - linuxftw 2y ago
    Two party consent is for wire tapping, eg, monitoring electronic communications. If they're monitoring meat-space communications, it's possible that wire tapping laws don't apply in the first place in most jurisdictions. Like an Alexa device.
    - dghlsakjg 2y ago
      Some two party laws don't specify that it has to be over the wire. They refers to recording a conversation where there is an expectation of privacy. The cabin of a private car certainly falls under that.
mysteria 2y ago
For Nissan according to Mozilla [1]: "You promise to educate and inform all users and occupants of your Vehicle about the Services and System features and limitations, the terms of the Agreement, including terms concerning data collection and use and privacy, and the Nissan Privacy Policy." In addition some vehicles will display a notice on their navigation screens every time the car is started indicating that continued use of this vehicle implies consent to the agreements below. It's sort of like those banners appearing on some websites stating that all users are automatically subject to their legal agreements. 1. https://foundation.mozilla.org/en/privacynotincluded/nissan/ https://foundation.mozilla.org/en/privacynotincluded/nissan/

linuxftw 2y ago

No, because on page 397 of the EULA that pops up on the in-dash LED screen after the 3rd OTA software update specifically stated you authorized this.

jdsully 2y ago
But that's the point, you need consent of the person on the other side of the line too which didn't sign the EULA
- linuxftw 2y ago
  I took it to mean they're listening to the conversation inside of the car, not a telephone call being placed through the car's audio system.
lcnPylGDnU4H9OF 2y ago
That might work in a one-party consent state but the passenger who never interacts with the touch screen in a two-party consent state would have a stronger case. Though, even then, gathering the evidence that they're violating such laws would probably be a pretty big hurdle.
- linuxftw 2y ago
  Two party consent is for wire tapping, eg, monitoring electronic communications. If they're monitoring meat-space communications, it's possible that wire tapping laws don't apply in the first place in most jurisdictions. Like an Alexa device.
  - dghlsakjg 2y ago
    Some two party laws don't specify that it has to be over the wire. They refers to recording a conversation where there is an expectation of privacy. The cabin of a private car certainly falls under that.

mysteria 2y ago

For Nissan according to Mozilla [1]: "You promise to educate and inform all users and occupants of your Vehicle about the Services and System features and limitations, the terms of the Agreement, including terms concerning data collection and use and privacy, and the Nissan Privacy Policy." In addition some vehicles will display a notice on their navigation screens every time the car is started indicating that continued use of this vehicle implies consent to the agreements below. It's sort of like those banners appearing on some websites stating that all users are automatically subject to their legal agreements. 1. https://foundation.mozilla.org/en/privacynotincluded/nissan/ https://foundation.mozilla.org/en/privacynotincluded/nissan/