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It is interesting but not surprising that it’s disc-optional with no pre-installed disc drive option available. Otherwise, in terms of specs and price, I am so

by dangus 2y ago

It is interesting but not surprising that it’s disc-optional with no pre-installed disc drive option available. Otherwise, in terms of specs and price, I am somewhat amazed that the console market is clinging on to life at this point. The PS5/Series generation pushed me to PC and I’m really not understanding the appeal of the consoles anymore beyond the convenience of not needing to do assembly. The consoles are just giving you hardware that PCs already had years ago and isn’t even really beating it on price all that well. This thing is $700 and you’ll end up with a better system if you build a new PC with a $500 graphics card at about $1000 total build cost. And then you have way more flexibility overall and a much larger game library.

RandomLensman 2y ago
Convenience value: Stable platform, fast to start, nothing much do or address other than play.
gjsman-1000 2y ago
Simple, there are two markets: - People who know about and build computers - People who want to play games There's some common overlap; but there are a lot of people who do not overlap. As long as that is the case, PlayStation will always have a market. Also, I'm glad for this; the PC is not a completely stable platform. I remember playing games with NVIDIA PhysX from about a decade and a half ago, and the physics are just ever so slightly broken and off (to the point some levels are unbeatable).
pawelduda 2y ago
And many more bluescreens/crashes/reboots from my experience. Godspeed if you aren't into tinkering and figuring out why your setup that worked yesterday is broken today. I moved from mainly PS5 to a beefy PC and the amount of troubleshooting you have to do is staggering. This kind of things never happened to me in years of playing on a console.
- MichaelZuo 2y ago
  Yeah, gaming on a self built PC only makes sense if your time is worth ~$0.
  - dangus 2y ago
    That’s kind of an overstatement. Building a PC is a <1 day affair even for a novice. And let’s not forget that pre-builts and laptops exist. The laptop mobile graphics situation is the best it’s ever been, it’s so easy to find an affordable gaming system that can handle AAA games. Or there’s the steam deck, a “console” that can play PC games.
    - MichaelZuo 2y ago
      A few crashes every month causing a few hours of lost time is likely worth more than any possible savings self-building could generate.
      - dangus 2y ago
        A few crashes a month is a massive overstatement. It isn’t 1998. And FWIW my PS4 has crashed before. Most likely a software bug but it fully crashed while I was playing a game.
        MichaelZuo 2y ago
        Well crashes, bugs, unusual workarounds, obscure error messages, etc…
        dangus 2y ago
        Okay? My PS4 crashed. My PC crashed. It's rare on both platforms.
        MichaelZuo 2y ago
        The rate of such is what is important… particularly the relative differences…
simion314 2y ago
An argument is that Consoles are easier and safer to give to a child, they can't mess things up and Sony is moderating the online chat. I do not recommend it , from my experience the moderation is a blackbox, I would get warrningss for my son;s activity with no clue what was wrong, some bullshit like it might have been one of the things in this list of bad things. Then they force you to buy a sbuscription to access online features/multiplayer and if they ban you without any right to appeal they will not return your money for the services they will not longer give you. So fck subscriptions, fck moderation without transparency and without right to appeal and talk with a human. And also fck Sony for killing online features because are to lazy to keep a few server code safe, lazy and greedy bastards.
- dangus 2y ago
  Let’s not forget that the target market for game consoles outside of Nintendo is ~40 year olds. I think there’s a good reason Sony is themselves shifting toward the PC.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
kstrauser 2y ago
I spend all day making computers yield to my will. I like doing this. I enjoy it. But when I'm done with my work day, it's awfully nice to sit on the couch, pick up a PS5 controller, and start playing something that requires approximately 0 maintenance. I couldn't care less about specs. I want games to look Good Enough. PC games might look slightly nicer, or perhaps not, given the enormous variety of configurations they have to support, but not so much nicer that I'm willing to be bothered with it. I'm totally capable of building a PC and going to ridiculous lengths to optimize it. I just don't want to anymore.
yesimahuman 2y ago
Lot of downvoting for having a different opinion in this thread. So people disagree with you and think that warrants a downvote? That's counter to the HN ethos. I agree with you, don't need to buy new 2024 PC components to have a great gaming PC, that seems to be the counter argument here which just isn't the case
- johnnyanmac 2y ago
  Downvotes for being outright unaware of the GPU market. If you can build me a PS5 equivalent PC build for $500 I'll take you up on that. Cheapest 3080 I could find used was $600 by itself (and that's probably a GPU already ground to dust from mining). >don't need to buy new 2024 PC components to have a great gaming PC No, you don't. But if you want to compare a PC to a console, you should use equivalent specs. People who just want a convinient way to play games (not AAA games) can pick up a steam deck for $200-300 and be set for life. But that's not who Sony is targeting.
  - dangus 2y ago
    You’re the one who is unaware of the GPU market here. The 3080 is last generation’s hardware. If we are comparing equivalent specs, we should note that this new PS5 Pro is not going to be equivalent to mid-high end graphics cards that cost $500. Many outlets are comparing it to the RX6800 [1], which would put it at around a $380 retail graphics card like an RTX 4060Ti. Here’s my PS5 Pro equivalent build: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/q24H6D https://pcpartpicker.com/list/q24H6D It’s $900, but remember that PS5 online play costs $80/year. so you’re breaking even after about 2 years, not counting the cost savings of PC games (I can buy Elden ring for under $50 via cheapshark.com, but it’s $70 on the PS Store) Also, common components like case, power supply, and storage almost never have to be replaced when a PC is upgraded. Sony is making you throw out all those common components. [1] https://www.ign.com/articles/playstation-5-pro-vs-playstation-5-specs-performance-compared https://www.ign.com/articles/playstation-5-pro-vs-playstatio...
    - yesimahuman 2y ago
      Yea and if Sony isn't targeting the super budget conscious then who does this target? I don't get it. $700 is too much to buy this console as a gift (say, for a kid), and if you're a passionate gamer then I think the argument that you might start looking at alternatives in the PC space is pretty compelling. For me, I think the PS5 has a real fit in my house especially as my kids play it, and so does my PC which I haven't upgraded in years. I see no reason to buy the PS5 pro given it's in that no mans land price-wise.
johnnyanmac 2y ago
>I’m really not understanding the appeal of the consoles anymore beyond the convenience of not needing to do assembly...and isn’t even really beating it on price all that well. It's a bit of the opposite direction for me. Crypto and now AI ruined the idea of a gaming PC being cheaper than a console. 3080's by themselves (which is what a $500 PS5 uses) can still go for $800 by itself on the used market. The gen 9 consoles are the cheapest way to buy 2020's tech right now.
- thirdsun 2y ago
  I doubt the non-Pro PS5 is anywhere close to the RTX3080's performance.
  - johnnyanmac 2y ago
    It's between a 3080 mobile and a 3080 in terms of raw hardware, if that helps, closer to the mobile version (minus obvious heat mitigation shortcomings). I compare it to a 3X series than a 2X because it's one specific spec that devs can target, leading to better optimization. And PS5 does have a few specific propreitary tricks to leverage as well compared to a PC. Plus... it's not like the 2X GPUs are dirt cheap to begin with. I see $250-300 new. If I'm going to buy a gaming PC, it may as well at least be better than the machine I already own, and that one part is already half the price of a PS5 base.

by dangus 2y ago

RandomLensman 2y ago

Convenience value: Stable platform, fast to start, nothing much do or address other than play.

gjsman-1000 2y ago

Simple, there are two markets: - People who know about and build computers - People who want to play games There's some common overlap; but there are a lot of people who do not overlap. As long as that is the case, PlayStation will always have a market. Also, I'm glad for this; the PC is not a completely stable platform. I remember playing games with NVIDIA PhysX from about a decade and a half ago, and the physics are just ever so slightly broken and off (to the point some levels are unbeatable).

pawelduda 2y ago

And many more bluescreens/crashes/reboots from my experience. Godspeed if you aren't into tinkering and figuring out why your setup that worked yesterday is broken today. I moved from mainly PS5 to a beefy PC and the amount of troubleshooting you have to do is staggering. This kind of things never happened to me in years of playing on a console.

MichaelZuo 2y ago
Yeah, gaming on a self built PC only makes sense if your time is worth ~$0.
- dangus 2y ago
  That’s kind of an overstatement. Building a PC is a <1 day affair even for a novice. And let’s not forget that pre-builts and laptops exist. The laptop mobile graphics situation is the best it’s ever been, it’s so easy to find an affordable gaming system that can handle AAA games. Or there’s the steam deck, a “console” that can play PC games.
  - MichaelZuo 2y ago
    A few crashes every month causing a few hours of lost time is likely worth more than any possible savings self-building could generate.
    - dangus 2y ago
      A few crashes a month is a massive overstatement. It isn’t 1998. And FWIW my PS4 has crashed before. Most likely a software bug but it fully crashed while I was playing a game.
      - MichaelZuo 2y ago
        Well crashes, bugs, unusual workarounds, obscure error messages, etc…
        dangus 2y ago
        Okay? My PS4 crashed. My PC crashed. It's rare on both platforms.
        MichaelZuo 2y ago
        The rate of such is what is important… particularly the relative differences…

simion314 2y ago

An argument is that Consoles are easier and safer to give to a child, they can't mess things up and Sony is moderating the online chat. I do not recommend it , from my experience the moderation is a blackbox, I would get warrningss for my son;s activity with no clue what was wrong, some bullshit like it might have been one of the things in this list of bad things. Then they force you to buy a sbuscription to access online features/multiplayer and if they ban you without any right to appeal they will not return your money for the services they will not longer give you. So fck subscriptions, fck moderation without transparency and without right to appeal and talk with a human. And also fck Sony for killing online features because are to lazy to keep a few server code safe, lazy and greedy bastards.

dangus 2y ago
Let’s not forget that the target market for game consoles outside of Nintendo is ~40 year olds. I think there’s a good reason Sony is themselves shifting toward the PC.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

kstrauser 2y ago

I spend all day making computers yield to my will. I like doing this. I enjoy it. But when I'm done with my work day, it's awfully nice to sit on the couch, pick up a PS5 controller, and start playing something that requires approximately 0 maintenance. I couldn't care less about specs. I want games to look Good Enough. PC games might look slightly nicer, or perhaps not, given the enormous variety of configurations they have to support, but not so much nicer that I'm willing to be bothered with it. I'm totally capable of building a PC and going to ridiculous lengths to optimize it. I just don't want to anymore.

yesimahuman 2y ago

Lot of downvoting for having a different opinion in this thread. So people disagree with you and think that warrants a downvote? That's counter to the HN ethos. I agree with you, don't need to buy new 2024 PC components to have a great gaming PC, that seems to be the counter argument here which just isn't the case

johnnyanmac 2y ago
Downvotes for being outright unaware of the GPU market. If you can build me a PS5 equivalent PC build for $500 I'll take you up on that. Cheapest 3080 I could find used was $600 by itself (and that's probably a GPU already ground to dust from mining). >don't need to buy new 2024 PC components to have a great gaming PC No, you don't. But if you want to compare a PC to a console, you should use equivalent specs. People who just want a convinient way to play games (not AAA games) can pick up a steam deck for $200-300 and be set for life. But that's not who Sony is targeting.
- dangus 2y ago
  You’re the one who is unaware of the GPU market here. The 3080 is last generation’s hardware. If we are comparing equivalent specs, we should note that this new PS5 Pro is not going to be equivalent to mid-high end graphics cards that cost $500. Many outlets are comparing it to the RX6800 [1], which would put it at around a $380 retail graphics card like an RTX 4060Ti. Here’s my PS5 Pro equivalent build: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/q24H6D https://pcpartpicker.com/list/q24H6D It’s $900, but remember that PS5 online play costs $80/year. so you’re breaking even after about 2 years, not counting the cost savings of PC games (I can buy Elden ring for under $50 via cheapshark.com, but it’s $70 on the PS Store) Also, common components like case, power supply, and storage almost never have to be replaced when a PC is upgraded. Sony is making you throw out all those common components. [1] https://www.ign.com/articles/playstation-5-pro-vs-playstation-5-specs-performance-compared https://www.ign.com/articles/playstation-5-pro-vs-playstatio...
  - yesimahuman 2y ago
    Yea and if Sony isn't targeting the super budget conscious then who does this target? I don't get it. $700 is too much to buy this console as a gift (say, for a kid), and if you're a passionate gamer then I think the argument that you might start looking at alternatives in the PC space is pretty compelling. For me, I think the PS5 has a real fit in my house especially as my kids play it, and so does my PC which I haven't upgraded in years. I see no reason to buy the PS5 pro given it's in that no mans land price-wise.

johnnyanmac 2y ago

>I’m really not understanding the appeal of the consoles anymore beyond the convenience of not needing to do assembly...and isn’t even really beating it on price all that well. It's a bit of the opposite direction for me. Crypto and now AI ruined the idea of a gaming PC being cheaper than a console. 3080's by themselves (which is what a $500 PS5 uses) can still go for $800 by itself on the used market. The gen 9 consoles are the cheapest way to buy 2020's tech right now.

thirdsun 2y ago
I doubt the non-Pro PS5 is anywhere close to the RTX3080's performance.
- johnnyanmac 2y ago
  It's between a 3080 mobile and a 3080 in terms of raw hardware, if that helps, closer to the mobile version (minus obvious heat mitigation shortcomings). I compare it to a 3X series than a 2X because it's one specific spec that devs can target, leading to better optimization. And PS5 does have a few specific propreitary tricks to leverage as well compared to a PC. Plus... it's not like the 2X GPUs are dirt cheap to begin with. I see $250-300 new. If I'm going to buy a gaming PC, it may as well at least be better than the machine I already own, and that one part is already half the price of a PS5 base.