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I never understood the liability aspect of vehicle repair from a manufacturer's standpoint. The common refrain seems to be that these new vehicles are not servi

I never understood the liability aspect of vehicle repair from a manufacturer's standpoint. The common refrain seems to be that these new vehicles are not serviceable without the dealership/manufacturer. It seems to be a narrative to drive out the owner from repairing vehicle or independent repair facilities. The liability seems to be the same as historic vehicles, for... vehicle repair. So why is this any different? The burden of proof is on the manufacturer to prove that a modification caused damage to the vehicle.

spamizbad 2y ago
I'm also surprised nobody (well the press and regulators): Why are you allowed to design vehicles whose safety is brittle enough that it can inadvertently undermined by an independent mechanic?
- mulmen 2y ago
  Most software is secured my limiting access. That’s not really an option with a car.
- tlb 2y ago
  There's no way to design vehicles that can't be made unsafe by a mechanic making a mistake. Even for purely mechanical things like brakes, a mechanic can leave out a bolt or crack a structural member so that it breaks on the road. EVs require careful procedures, for instance to make sure that any of the high-voltage wires can't rub against anything and wear through the insulation. Dealer mechanics make mistakes too, but at least they're trained on the specific car, and they can collect data to notice a pattern of things breaking after certain people worked on them.
from-nibly 2y ago
Yea but the burden of action is on the victim to have a more expensive lawyer so it doesn't matter one way or another.
jjav 2y ago
> So why is this any different? It is only different in that by making cars internet-connected, the manufacturers see a golden opportunity to make them all cars-as-a-service that you must buy but no longer own. In other words, profit and more profit, greed.

spamizbad 2y ago

I'm also surprised nobody (well the press and regulators): Why are you allowed to design vehicles whose safety is brittle enough that it can inadvertently undermined by an independent mechanic?

mulmen 2y ago
Most software is secured my limiting access. That’s not really an option with a car.
tlb 2y ago
There's no way to design vehicles that can't be made unsafe by a mechanic making a mistake. Even for purely mechanical things like brakes, a mechanic can leave out a bolt or crack a structural member so that it breaks on the road. EVs require careful procedures, for instance to make sure that any of the high-voltage wires can't rub against anything and wear through the insulation. Dealer mechanics make mistakes too, but at least they're trained on the specific car, and they can collect data to notice a pattern of things breaking after certain people worked on them.

from-nibly 2y ago

Yea but the burden of action is on the victim to have a more expensive lawyer so it doesn't matter one way or another.

jjav 2y ago

> So why is this any different? It is only different in that by making cars internet-connected, the manufacturers see a golden opportunity to make them all cars-as-a-service that you must buy but no longer own. In other words, profit and more profit, greed.