4 ms·

'Can't live without it': alarm at Musk's Starlink dominance in Brazil's Amazon

6 points by uxhacker 2y ago

oriettaxx 2y ago
uh, what an exaggeration.... At the Guardian they are not stupid, so I ask myself why that title instead of what is in the text: "Starlink’s almost complete dominance of the Amazon’s satellite internet". Anyhow: Starlink: when I see it on sailing boats/catamarans/yachts I just laugh: the owner is so proud to show off the latest tool, but he does not reelize that most of the time those "satellite" antennas just connect to the closed phone tower with an e-sim.., the same you can do yourself with a e-sim enabled phone....
- rlt 2y ago
  What are you talking about? Starlink antennas don’t connect to cell phone towers at all. Starlink is popular among boaters because it’s hands down the best satellite internet and has truly global coverage (except where not authorized, but all international waters and most territorial waters)
  - oriettaxx 2y ago
    I think I read it here in HN, then I also recall reading the contract when they annouced service for "sailing boat" (several of us where interested), but I am sure there are plenty of users here that knows it better then me, if none I will dig it my self. What I mean is that they do connect with satellite, but they also connect to land mobile antenna as an alternative (I guess when it makes sense or when is convenient for starlink... for $$ and also for performance?). Think about: 95% of the time sailing boats are in a harbour... maybe a small one in the aegean (where the mobile internet is super good... 50Mb simmetric easily), then you have even a catamaran with the starlink antenna... yes a catamaran, but still moving a bit: if you are Starlink where do you pick the data to sell the customer, by satellite? naaahhhh, you just use the local cell tower: the captain will be so proud of his expensive and high tech work everywhere, even in the amazon antenna. Yes, buying local sim is not easy (find a proper shop, choose plan, sign contract, recharge, passport, ...many expire after 3 months if you are not resident) but with e-sim now it gets much better.
    - rlt 2y ago
      Starlink does not connect to cell towers. That’s just not a thing Starlink does, I assure you. Some people may purchase a 3rd party system that integrates both Starlink and cellular but that’s not standard. > the captain will be so proud of his expensive and high tech work everywhere, even in the amazon antenna. Not sure why you think people care so much about showing off their Starlink antenna. They just want good internet.
      - oriettaxx 2y ago
        > Starlink does not connect to cell towers. That’s just not a thing Starlink does, I assure you. yes, you are right: I've read again the contract (boat) where I thought I read about this "backup" connection: nothing about it: I made a mistake. > showing off their Starlink antenna I am refering to sailing boat where mobile internet is cheap and great (Italy, Greece, Turkey...): 99% of the time you see the antenna from the harbour: in the water (while in the harbour) you hardly have visible obstable to a tower: costs are ridiculous compared to Starlink, and the internet is much better: I am also able to realize how wisely a sailor is spending money: more then showing off is the idea to have a cutting edge tech to achieve something you get anyhow with less burden and money (many like sailing 'cause helps you on recognizing what is 'good', even the internet).
        lxgr 2y ago
        > costs are ridiculous compared to Starlink Starlink has plans starting at €40 per month. That's less than an eSIM or even a regular mobile data plan with a data cap in some places.
        oriettaxx 2y ago
        I read > Starting at €296/mo with a hardware cost of €2,962. at https://www.starlink.com/boats https://www.starlink.com/boats
        lxgr 2y ago
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
teleforce 2y ago
Naturally satellite wirless signal penetration and coverage are very limited in tropical forest environment where frequent rain attenuation is the norm, and trees foliage and canopy limiting clear line-of-sight LoS or in satellite terminology it's called masked LoS. Satellite and non-terrestrial networks (NTN) recently proposed by 5G consortium needs a proper system overhaul to properly work in the tropical jungles, cause it ain't a sunny beach or an open sea [1]. [1] 5G Non-Terrestrial Networks: https://www.3gpp.org/news-events/partner-news/5ga-paper-ntn https://www.3gpp.org/news-events/partner-news/5ga-paper-ntn
matheusmoreira 2y ago
Even the brazilian military released a report detailing the impact of this mess on their operations. Looks like they were depending on Starlink. It's so funny and so sad at the same time.

6 points by uxhacker 2y ago

uh, what an exaggeration.... At the Guardian they are not stupid, so I ask myself why that title instead of what is in the text: "Starlink’s almost complete dominance of the Amazon’s satellite internet". Anyhow: Starlink: when I see it on sailing boats/catamarans/yachts I just laugh: the owner is so proud to show off the latest tool, but he does not reelize that most of the time those "satellite" antennas just connect to the closed phone tower with an e-sim.., the same you can do yourself with a e-sim enabled phone....

rlt 2y ago
What are you talking about? Starlink antennas don’t connect to cell phone towers at all. Starlink is popular among boaters because it’s hands down the best satellite internet and has truly global coverage (except where not authorized, but all international waters and most territorial waters)
- oriettaxx 2y ago
  I think I read it here in HN, then I also recall reading the contract when they annouced service for "sailing boat" (several of us where interested), but I am sure there are plenty of users here that knows it better then me, if none I will dig it my self. What I mean is that they do connect with satellite, but they also connect to land mobile antenna as an alternative (I guess when it makes sense or when is convenient for starlink... for $$ and also for performance?). Think about: 95% of the time sailing boats are in a harbour... maybe a small one in the aegean (where the mobile internet is super good... 50Mb simmetric easily), then you have even a catamaran with the starlink antenna... yes a catamaran, but still moving a bit: if you are Starlink where do you pick the data to sell the customer, by satellite? naaahhhh, you just use the local cell tower: the captain will be so proud of his expensive and high tech work everywhere, even in the amazon antenna. Yes, buying local sim is not easy (find a proper shop, choose plan, sign contract, recharge, passport, ...many expire after 3 months if you are not resident) but with e-sim now it gets much better.
  - rlt 2y ago
    Starlink does not connect to cell towers. That’s just not a thing Starlink does, I assure you. Some people may purchase a 3rd party system that integrates both Starlink and cellular but that’s not standard. > the captain will be so proud of his expensive and high tech work everywhere, even in the amazon antenna. Not sure why you think people care so much about showing off their Starlink antenna. They just want good internet.
    - oriettaxx 2y ago
      > Starlink does not connect to cell towers. That’s just not a thing Starlink does, I assure you. yes, you are right: I've read again the contract (boat) where I thought I read about this "backup" connection: nothing about it: I made a mistake. > showing off their Starlink antenna I am refering to sailing boat where mobile internet is cheap and great (Italy, Greece, Turkey...): 99% of the time you see the antenna from the harbour: in the water (while in the harbour) you hardly have visible obstable to a tower: costs are ridiculous compared to Starlink, and the internet is much better: I am also able to realize how wisely a sailor is spending money: more then showing off is the idea to have a cutting edge tech to achieve something you get anyhow with less burden and money (many like sailing 'cause helps you on recognizing what is 'good', even the internet).
      - lxgr 2y ago
        > costs are ridiculous compared to Starlink Starlink has plans starting at €40 per month. That's less than an eSIM or even a regular mobile data plan with a data cap in some places.
        oriettaxx 2y ago
        I read > Starting at €296/mo with a hardware cost of €2,962. at https://www.starlink.com/boats https://www.starlink.com/boats
        lxgr 2y ago

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

teleforce 2y ago

Naturally satellite wirless signal penetration and coverage are very limited in tropical forest environment where frequent rain attenuation is the norm, and trees foliage and canopy limiting clear line-of-sight LoS or in satellite terminology it's called masked LoS. Satellite and non-terrestrial networks (NTN) recently proposed by 5G consortium needs a proper system overhaul to properly work in the tropical jungles, cause it ain't a sunny beach or an open sea [1]. [1] 5G Non-Terrestrial Networks: https://www.3gpp.org/news-events/partner-news/5ga-paper-ntn https://www.3gpp.org/news-events/partner-news/5ga-paper-ntn

matheusmoreira 2y ago

Even the brazilian military released a report detailing the impact of this mess on their operations. Looks like they were depending on Starlink. It's so funny and so sad at the same time.