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These complaints aren't invalid, but I do wonder how many users actually get tripped up on these things. If you want a list view, clicking on the icon that look

by lol768 2y ago

These complaints aren't invalid, but I do wonder how many users actually get tripped up on these things. If you want a list view, clicking on the icon that looks like a list isn't a crazy thing to do. I agree the dropdown behaviour is a bit strange. Equally, it's accepted that a bunch of today's Gnome apps have title bars with controls inside them. I don't think it's that jarring that if you don't click on a control accurately and then start dragging the mouse, you're going to move the window.

Gualdrapo 2y ago
The sort of mental process the author related to find that list view was pretty much the same I went through, so at least there's two people. But, as they said and the author quoted, "Our software is built to be usable by everyone. We care deeply about user experience." Though there are already TONS of critiques to GNOME (hell, even I have written some stuff about them here) and so much has been said about it that saying something else seems like a waste of time in my humble opinion. Its devs won't change their mind because they have a laser-sharp vision of what they want to achieve. Its users won't change their mind because they like it and feel at home using it. We the people that don't (or no longer) like it won't change our minds either because it can feel really strange, confusing and even limiting. It's been more than 10 years since they went to that route but they will do little to nothing about that because, as the author correctly asserted, "it's also a project that's very vocal - opinionated, as the saying goes - about how to do things." So either you like the GNOME way of doing things or you just can go somewhere else. Which, again, it's a bit contradictory taking in account their "Our software is built to be usable by everyone" motto.
- righthand 2y ago
  I think one day it will be a sword they fall on as fewer people become interested in working with such aggressive position, the developers will look elsewhere instead of wait for GNOME to implement something or be reasonable.
gibbetsandcrows 2y ago
The worst part about controls inside the titlebar is things like Firefox and Chromium which implement their own decorations and window design with the tabs ending up in 95% of your draggable titlebar area, so you often end up moving the tab instead of moving the window. I'm not sure who will blink first with the lousy design situation, but the users are paying the price. (Honestly browsers just need to change this...Gnome is most people's default and they've shown themselves to be pretty damned stubborn)
- derkades 2y ago
  In Firefox, you can choose whether to use the system titlebar it its own "merged" titlebar. I expected Chrime has a similar setting.
- exe34 2y ago
  i gave up entirely and went with xmonad. normally window placement is automatic and predictable, but if I really want to resize something, it's Super+Right Drag.
  - okasaki 2y ago
    This works in GNOME too, it's Super + left mouse. Super + right mouse anywhere in the window presents a window management menu, including resize/move options
tuna74 2y ago
Yeah, especially as the two different buttons get highlighted separately and has different tooltips as you hover over them.

by lol768 2y ago

Gualdrapo 2y ago

The sort of mental process the author related to find that list view was pretty much the same I went through, so at least there's two people. But, as they said and the author quoted, "Our software is built to be usable by everyone. We care deeply about user experience." Though there are already TONS of critiques to GNOME (hell, even I have written some stuff about them here) and so much has been said about it that saying something else seems like a waste of time in my humble opinion. Its devs won't change their mind because they have a laser-sharp vision of what they want to achieve. Its users won't change their mind because they like it and feel at home using it. We the people that don't (or no longer) like it won't change our minds either because it can feel really strange, confusing and even limiting. It's been more than 10 years since they went to that route but they will do little to nothing about that because, as the author correctly asserted, "it's also a project that's very vocal - opinionated, as the saying goes - about how to do things." So either you like the GNOME way of doing things or you just can go somewhere else. Which, again, it's a bit contradictory taking in account their "Our software is built to be usable by everyone" motto.

righthand 2y ago
I think one day it will be a sword they fall on as fewer people become interested in working with such aggressive position, the developers will look elsewhere instead of wait for GNOME to implement something or be reasonable.

gibbetsandcrows 2y ago

The worst part about controls inside the titlebar is things like Firefox and Chromium which implement their own decorations and window design with the tabs ending up in 95% of your draggable titlebar area, so you often end up moving the tab instead of moving the window. I'm not sure who will blink first with the lousy design situation, but the users are paying the price. (Honestly browsers just need to change this...Gnome is most people's default and they've shown themselves to be pretty damned stubborn)

derkades 2y ago
In Firefox, you can choose whether to use the system titlebar it its own "merged" titlebar. I expected Chrime has a similar setting.
exe34 2y ago
i gave up entirely and went with xmonad. normally window placement is automatic and predictable, but if I really want to resize something, it's Super+Right Drag.
- okasaki 2y ago
  This works in GNOME too, it's Super + left mouse. Super + right mouse anywhere in the window presents a window management menu, including resize/move options

tuna74 2y ago

Yeah, especially as the two different buttons get highlighted separately and has different tooltips as you hover over them.