3 ms·

Many games have ranked ladders now which are taken fairly seriously. Success at high levels of ladder player often translates into career opportunities, especia

by mjr00 2y ago

Many games have ranked ladders now which are taken fairly seriously. Success at high levels of ladder player often translates into career opportunities, especially in League of Legends. > Any ELO-based matchmaking will solve this, cheater will end-up playing against each-other or against very skilled player. Well, first, you're wrong, because cheating only makes them good at one part of the game, not every part of the game. e.g. in League of Legends, a scripting Xerath or Karthus who hits every skillshot is going to win laning phase hard. However, scripting isn't going to help if they have bad macro and end up caught out in the middle of the game, causing their team to lose. Most cheaters don't end up at the top of the ladder, they end up firmly in the upper-middle. Secondly, you're basically saying "cheating is OK because they'll end up at the top of the ladder." You don't realize how ridiculous this sounds? Third, ranked and competition aside, playing against someone who's cheating isn't fun, even if you end up winning because they make mistakes that their cheats can't help them with. You don't play competitive games, that's fine, but a lot of people do and they demand more competitive integrity than casual players.

choo-t 2y ago
> You don't play competitive games, that's fine, but a lot of people do and they demand more competitive integrity than casual players. Little difference : I don't play competitive game with completes strangers on company run servers. I've played competitively on community based server, with people being screened by other players and the community able to regulate itself (ban or unban players). The problem space is vastly different, you don't need intrusive ring 0 anti-cheat for this. The whole kernel-level anticheat stuff is a poor solution to a self-made problem by the developer : they wanted to be the one in charge of the game and servers, so they needed to slash human moderation need. They also wanted to create a unique pool of player and didn't want the community to split between itself and play how they want.
- mjr00 2y ago
  > Little difference : I don't play competitive game with completes strangers on company run servers. People don't consider playing around with your friends to be competitive. You don't get to choose who else is competing in the game or what strategies they use. This is just an area that you are clearly not familiar with. > The whole kernel-level anticheat stuff is a poor solution to a self-made problem by the developer : they wanted to be the one in charge of the game and servers, so they needed to slash human moderation need. They also wanted to create a unique pool of player and didn't want the community to split between itself and play how they want. This wasn't self-made by the developer, it was demanded by the players. Competitive games have almost exclusively moved to online, skill-based matchmaking with a ladder system because that's what players want.
  - choo-t 2y ago
    > People don't consider playing around with your friends to be competitive. I didn't say friends. Please don't modify my argument to refute it. > You don't get to choose who else is competing in the game or what strategies they use. I, as a single player, no, but us, as a community, yes, and it's the same for any game or sport, different group run different tournament with different rules about who play and how. > This is just an area that you are clearly not familiar with. Please refrain to use ad hominem, especially when you have no idea who you are talking with. > This wasn't self-made by the developer, it was demanded by the players. I don't know any players who asked for the disappearance of community run server or human moderation, neither that wanted do lose agency on the way they play. I don't they these players doesn't exist, but I don't make gross generality about players. > Competitive games have almost exclusively moved to online, skill-based matchmaking with a ladder system because that's what players want. They're not a hive mind, lots of them didn't or doesn't like matchmaking in any form, and even for the ones that wanted it, that doesn't mean developers have to remove other mean of play, like server browser and private server.

by mjr00 2y ago

choo-t 2y ago

> You don't play competitive games, that's fine, but a lot of people do and they demand more competitive integrity than casual players. Little difference : I don't play competitive game with completes strangers on company run servers. I've played competitively on community based server, with people being screened by other players and the community able to regulate itself (ban or unban players). The problem space is vastly different, you don't need intrusive ring 0 anti-cheat for this. The whole kernel-level anticheat stuff is a poor solution to a self-made problem by the developer : they wanted to be the one in charge of the game and servers, so they needed to slash human moderation need. They also wanted to create a unique pool of player and didn't want the community to split between itself and play how they want.

mjr00 2y ago
> Little difference : I don't play competitive game with completes strangers on company run servers. People don't consider playing around with your friends to be competitive. You don't get to choose who else is competing in the game or what strategies they use. This is just an area that you are clearly not familiar with. > The whole kernel-level anticheat stuff is a poor solution to a self-made problem by the developer : they wanted to be the one in charge of the game and servers, so they needed to slash human moderation need. They also wanted to create a unique pool of player and didn't want the community to split between itself and play how they want. This wasn't self-made by the developer, it was demanded by the players. Competitive games have almost exclusively moved to online, skill-based matchmaking with a ladder system because that's what players want.
- choo-t 2y ago
  > People don't consider playing around with your friends to be competitive. I didn't say friends. Please don't modify my argument to refute it. > You don't get to choose who else is competing in the game or what strategies they use. I, as a single player, no, but us, as a community, yes, and it's the same for any game or sport, different group run different tournament with different rules about who play and how. > This is just an area that you are clearly not familiar with. Please refrain to use ad hominem, especially when you have no idea who you are talking with. > This wasn't self-made by the developer, it was demanded by the players. I don't know any players who asked for the disappearance of community run server or human moderation, neither that wanted do lose agency on the way they play. I don't they these players doesn't exist, but I don't make gross generality about players. > Competitive games have almost exclusively moved to online, skill-based matchmaking with a ladder system because that's what players want. They're not a hive mind, lots of them didn't or doesn't like matchmaking in any form, and even for the ones that wanted it, that doesn't mean developers have to remove other mean of play, like server browser and private server.