3 ms·

What could possibly be “life saving”? On the scale of things, it’s a relatively moderate Islamic country so the best you’re going to get is if you’re gay and ke

What could possibly be “life saving”? On the scale of things, it’s a relatively moderate Islamic country so the best you’re going to get is if you’re gay and keep it quiet, no one is really going to bother you.

aussieguy1234 2y ago
PreP is near 100% effective at preventing HIV. For sure I could see access to information about PreP or other HIV prevention methods being blocked by an overzealous government.
- dyauspitr 2y ago
  PreP is not exclusive to LGBT communities (though they are at significantly higher risk than the general population). It’s free at (some) government clinics in Malaysia.
- ETH_start 2y ago
  [flagged]
- ETH_start 2y ago
  Ironic that my comment was censored on a thread complaining about censorship.
  - HeatrayEnjoyer 2y ago
    No one has censored you... are you talking about your comment being flagged? That's from user votes, not HN directly.
    - jtbayly 2y ago
      “The algorithm decided it. That’s not censorship.” “The majority decided it. That’s not censorship.” “The law decided it. That’s not censorship.” “The users decided it. That’s not censorship.” “You were just scared your neighbors would kill you, so you didn’t say anything. That’s not censorship.” I’m having trouble drawing lines.
      - Twistyfiasco 2y ago
        The comment was made and still stands.
        jtbayly 2y ago
        Censorship by the majority is still censorship. I’m not opposed to all censorship. I’m just opposed to refusing to acknowledge it for what it is. If you have your comment flagged by a couple of people, and removed, that is censorship. Plain and simple.
    - wordofx 2y ago
      So… censorship. Just because you don’t like what someone said does not make what they said wrong. Flagging comments is censorship. Plain and simple. You’re trying to remove opinions you don’t agree with.
      - HeatrayEnjoyer 2y ago
        It's not censorship. Just because you call it that doesn't make it true.
  - defrost 2y ago
    I read your comment about maybe "censoring STI prevention information" might reduce the frequency of gay males having sex. Seems unlikely, not suprising it got flagged to death, however it's there for anyone with ShowDead enabled to read.
    - ETH_start 2y ago
      I was saying censoring LGBT material, not STI prevention literature, might reduce STI transmission rates. I was responding to one speculation, with another, to show that the parent speculation — that censorship of LGBT information would lead to more death by denying sexually active people in the LGBT community with information on STI prevention drugs — was over simplifying the factors involved, to present their speculation as a matter of fact. If my comment — which I disclosed as mere speculation — is to be censored on those grounds, the parent comment should definitely have been.
    - ETH_start 2y ago
      But after re-reading my comment, I see now that it could be read as me suggesting that censorship of STI prevention information could lead to less male-to-male sexual contact and thereby reduce STI infection rates and with it deaths. That wasn't what I intended to convey. I was referring to censorship of LGBT material in general potentially having that effect.
      - defrost 2y ago
        Re-reading comments in the light of feedback is always interesting, we often project and appear to say what we don't actually intend - I'm prone to that more and more now that I'm getting older. I'm still not sold on the notion that limiting public infomation reduces the incidence of gay sex in a society; the Victorians famously did that and ended up with Polari, rent boys, Green Carnations, and generally no end of coded communication. It made the puritans feel better but did little good otherwise.
        ETH_start 2y ago
        I'm not sold on the idea either. But it's plausible enough to consider as a possibility in my opinion. Even with all sorts of work-arounds and coded language, the overall volume of male-to-male sexual contact and STI infection might decline with such censorship. Regardless, censorship is not the path to a healthy society and should be rejected on principle.
potamic 2y ago
Quite plausibly, mental health resources. I assume connecting with like minded individuals and communities can go a long way in helping you understand yourself and reconcile your differences with broader society.
becquerel 2y ago
Awareness and acceptance on LGBT matters can have a big impact on suicide rates.
- jtbayly 2y ago
  Is that why the average suicide rate is lower in majority Muslim countries? Awareness presumably increases suicide? I know you were implying the opposite, but how many suicides are you going to prevent by making Malaysia’s rate (6/100k) similar to the US (14/100k)? These are generalized rates, of course, but in point of fact, your claim is not substantiated by any real data.
  - mthoms 2y ago
    You're unaware of data to support the claim that social acceptance of LGBTQ people (particularly children) lowers their suicide rates? Really? This fact is well established and also makes perfect sense logically speaking. https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1002/ajcp.12553 https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1002/ajcp.12553 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0277953622001666 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S027795362... https://www.thetrevorproject.org/survey-2022/#support-youth https://www.thetrevorproject.org/survey-2022/#support-youth There's plenty more if you care to just Google it. The rest of your comment is ridiculous because obviously there is more than one contributing factor to suicide. Including (perhaps) latitude. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9822839/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9822839/
    - jtbayly 2y ago
      I’ve done much more than randomly Google it. I’ve read about it in depth. Encouraging people to be LGBT has resulted in massive increases in number of people claiming to be trans, for example. Assuming they have the “best” case scenario of an affirming home, apparently 14% attempt suicide, according to your third link. Now let me ask you, how many people have we killed by “affirming” these things to the point that it’s actually cool to be trans in most schools? We’re driving up the denominator on the highest risk category for suicide while pretending that that very thing will reduce suicide.
praptak 2y ago
Trans people suicide rate increases if they are left without help.
- wordofx 2y ago
  [flagged]
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

aussieguy1234 2y ago

PreP is near 100% effective at preventing HIV. For sure I could see access to information about PreP or other HIV prevention methods being blocked by an overzealous government.

dyauspitr 2y ago
PreP is not exclusive to LGBT communities (though they are at significantly higher risk than the general population). It’s free at (some) government clinics in Malaysia.
ETH_start 2y ago
[flagged]
ETH_start 2y ago
Ironic that my comment was censored on a thread complaining about censorship.
- HeatrayEnjoyer 2y ago
  No one has censored you... are you talking about your comment being flagged? That's from user votes, not HN directly.
  - jtbayly 2y ago
    “The algorithm decided it. That’s not censorship.” “The majority decided it. That’s not censorship.” “The law decided it. That’s not censorship.” “The users decided it. That’s not censorship.” “You were just scared your neighbors would kill you, so you didn’t say anything. That’s not censorship.” I’m having trouble drawing lines.
    - Twistyfiasco 2y ago
      The comment was made and still stands.
      - jtbayly 2y ago
        Censorship by the majority is still censorship. I’m not opposed to all censorship. I’m just opposed to refusing to acknowledge it for what it is. If you have your comment flagged by a couple of people, and removed, that is censorship. Plain and simple.
  - wordofx 2y ago
    So… censorship. Just because you don’t like what someone said does not make what they said wrong. Flagging comments is censorship. Plain and simple. You’re trying to remove opinions you don’t agree with.
    - HeatrayEnjoyer 2y ago
      It's not censorship. Just because you call it that doesn't make it true.
- defrost 2y ago
  I read your comment about maybe "censoring STI prevention information" might reduce the frequency of gay males having sex. Seems unlikely, not suprising it got flagged to death, however it's there for anyone with ShowDead enabled to read.
  - ETH_start 2y ago
    I was saying censoring LGBT material, not STI prevention literature, might reduce STI transmission rates. I was responding to one speculation, with another, to show that the parent speculation — that censorship of LGBT information would lead to more death by denying sexually active people in the LGBT community with information on STI prevention drugs — was over simplifying the factors involved, to present their speculation as a matter of fact. If my comment — which I disclosed as mere speculation — is to be censored on those grounds, the parent comment should definitely have been.
  - ETH_start 2y ago
    But after re-reading my comment, I see now that it could be read as me suggesting that censorship of STI prevention information could lead to less male-to-male sexual contact and thereby reduce STI infection rates and with it deaths. That wasn't what I intended to convey. I was referring to censorship of LGBT material in general potentially having that effect.
    - defrost 2y ago
      Re-reading comments in the light of feedback is always interesting, we often project and appear to say what we don't actually intend - I'm prone to that more and more now that I'm getting older. I'm still not sold on the notion that limiting public infomation reduces the incidence of gay sex in a society; the Victorians famously did that and ended up with Polari, rent boys, Green Carnations, and generally no end of coded communication. It made the puritans feel better but did little good otherwise.
      - ETH_start 2y ago
        I'm not sold on the idea either. But it's plausible enough to consider as a possibility in my opinion. Even with all sorts of work-arounds and coded language, the overall volume of male-to-male sexual contact and STI infection might decline with such censorship. Regardless, censorship is not the path to a healthy society and should be rejected on principle.

potamic 2y ago

Quite plausibly, mental health resources. I assume connecting with like minded individuals and communities can go a long way in helping you understand yourself and reconcile your differences with broader society.

becquerel 2y ago

Awareness and acceptance on LGBT matters can have a big impact on suicide rates.

jtbayly 2y ago
Is that why the average suicide rate is lower in majority Muslim countries? Awareness presumably increases suicide? I know you were implying the opposite, but how many suicides are you going to prevent by making Malaysia’s rate (6/100k) similar to the US (14/100k)? These are generalized rates, of course, but in point of fact, your claim is not substantiated by any real data.
- mthoms 2y ago
  You're unaware of data to support the claim that social acceptance of LGBTQ people (particularly children) lowers their suicide rates? Really? This fact is well established and also makes perfect sense logically speaking. https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1002/ajcp.12553 https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1002/ajcp.12553 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0277953622001666 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S027795362... https://www.thetrevorproject.org/survey-2022/#support-youth https://www.thetrevorproject.org/survey-2022/#support-youth There's plenty more if you care to just Google it. The rest of your comment is ridiculous because obviously there is more than one contributing factor to suicide. Including (perhaps) latitude. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9822839/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9822839/
  - jtbayly 2y ago
    I’ve done much more than randomly Google it. I’ve read about it in depth. Encouraging people to be LGBT has resulted in massive increases in number of people claiming to be trans, for example. Assuming they have the “best” case scenario of an affirming home, apparently 14% attempt suicide, according to your third link. Now let me ask you, how many people have we killed by “affirming” these things to the point that it’s actually cool to be trans in most schools? We’re driving up the denominator on the highest risk category for suicide while pretending that that very thing will reduce suicide.

praptak 2y ago

Trans people suicide rate increases if they are left without help.

wordofx 2y ago
[flagged]

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]